South Africa vs Ireland (SPOILER)

South Africa vs Ireland (SPOILER)

Post by Mike Am » Mon, 15 Jun 1998 04:00:00


South Africa  37
Ireland           13

It was a tough but scrappy game of test rugby. In the end the Boks won
comfortably enough but except for Stefan Terblanche, who had a dream
debut, scoring no less than four tries, it was not a game that the
Springboks will remember with any great fondness.

The Irish defended with heart, soul and the occasional head-high for
good measure. They were clearly intent on taking the game to the Boks
physically, hoping to feed off any mistakes the resultant pressure
might induce and to a limited extent, they succeeded.

Eric Ellwood's pinpoint up-and-under, aimed to fall on the left-hand
upright of the Boks' posts, was so close to target, that it had the
Bok fullback in a dilemma. Not so, the Irish right winger, who leapt
high into the air to pluck a try right out of the jaws of a startled
Montgomery's grasp and crash over for a brilliant 7-pointer.

This was Ireland's only contribution to a game that frankly, never
rose to great heights but early in the second half, they did make a
valiant attempt to win with a powerful surge down the right sideline
which saw them bundled into touch a metre short of the line.

Gaffie du Toit, SA's newly-found heir to the Honiball throne had a
quiet but reasonably successful debut. He is a big lad with brains in
both feet and a good turn of speed as he showed on one occasion, when
he sliced through the Irish defence like a greased pig-sticker, only
to run away from his support! But nothing that a bit of experience and
a few wise words from the backline coach won't sort out.

Joost van der Westhuizen had a shocker! When he wasn't fumbling the
ball, he was passing behind Bok backs, who had to stop and wait for
the pass to arrive. IMO both  Putt and Swanepoel should start shining
up their boots up for next week.

The Bok scrum was also a mess at the end of the game and not
surprisingly either. Ollie le Roux is a solid loosehead with good ball
skills, who gets about the park too but, sorry Nick Mallett, not for
the full 80 minutes. You should have brought on Kempson for
the last twenty as the Sharks always do.

Make no mistake, the Irish were very effective spoilers and seldom
the beneficiaries of 50/50 calls by Referee Morrison. On the other
hand, the expression of relief on the Irish ***'s face when he
saw the colour of the card shown to him, spoke for itself.

I'm expecting a couple of changes to the Bok lineup for the next one
but the Irish will probably field the same combo.

Mike Amm

 
 
 

South Africa vs Ireland (SPOILER)

Post by Hector Camero » Mon, 15 Jun 1998 04:00:00

Quote:

> South Africa  37
> Ireland           13

> It was a tough but scrappy game of test rugby. In the end the Boks won
> comfortably enough but except for Stefan Terblanche, who had a dream
> debut, scoring no less than four tries, it was not a game that the
> Springboks will remember with any great fondness.

> The Irish defended with heart, soul and the occasional head-high for
> good measure. They were clearly intent on taking the game to the Boks
> physically, hoping to feed off any mistakes the resultant pressure
> might induce and to a limited extent, they succeeded.

> Eric Ellwood's pinpoint up-and-under, aimed to fall on the left-hand
> upright of the Boks' posts, was so close to target, that it had the
> Bok fullback in a dilemma. Not so, the Irish right winger, who leapt
> high into the air to pluck a try right out of the jaws of a startled
> Montgomery's grasp and crash over for a brilliant 7-pointer.

> This was Ireland's only contribution to a game that frankly, never
> rose to great heights but early in the second half, they did make a
> valiant attempt to win with a powerful surge down the right sideline
> which saw them bundled into touch a metre short of the line.

> Gaffie du Toit, SA's newly-found heir to the Honiball throne had a
> quiet but reasonably successful debut. He is a big lad with brains in
> both feet and a good turn of speed as he showed on one occasion, when
> he sliced through the Irish defence like a greased pig-sticker, only
> to run away from his support! But nothing that a bit of experience and
> a few wise words from the backline coach won't sort out.

> Joost van der Westhuizen had a shocker! When he wasn't fumbling the
> ball, he was passing behind Bok backs, who had to stop and wait for
> the pass to arrive. IMO both  Putt and Swanepoel should start shining
> up their boots up for next week.

> The Bok scrum was also a mess at the end of the game and not
> surprisingly either. Ollie le Roux is a solid loosehead with good ball
> skills, who gets about the park too but, sorry Nick Mallett, not for
> the full 80 minutes. You should have brought on Kempson for
> the last twenty as the Sharks always do.

> Make no mistake, the Irish were very effective spoilers and seldom
> the beneficiaries of 50/50 calls by Referee Morrison. On the other
> hand, the expression of relief on the Irish ***'s face when he
> saw the colour of the card shown to him, spoke for itself.

> I'm expecting a couple of changes to the Bok lineup for the next one
> but the Irish will probably field the same combo.

> Mike Amm

Hello Mike
Do you think as I do Joost's form is not as good as it has been in the
past and should Swanepoel start as scrumhalf with Joost on the bench.
Hector
PS Never did get those tapes.

 
 
 

South Africa vs Ireland (SPOILER)

Post by Ferd » Mon, 15 Jun 1998 04:00:00



<<>Gaffie du Toit, SA's newly-found heir to the Honiball throne had a

Quote:
>quiet but reasonably successful debut. He is a big lad with brains in
>both feet and a good turn of speed as he showed on one occasion, when
>he sliced through the Irish defence like a greased pig-sticker, only
>to run away from his support! But nothing that a bit of experience and
>a few wise words from the backline coach won't sort out.>>

You are gracefull to him.
The way I see it is: If we played the All Blacks yesterday, Gaffie
would well and truly have cost us the game.

<<Joost van der Westhuizen had a shocker! When he wasn't fumbling the

Quote:
>ball, he was passing behind Bok backs, who had to stop and wait for
>the pass to arrive. IMO both  Putt and Swanepoel should start shining
>up their boots up for next week.>>

I have been saying for years Joost is shit scrum half. A great player,
but a shit scrum half. He paralyses a backline. We were spoilt end of
last year with Swanepoel who actually serves his backline.
I am not optimistic that Joost will be dropped. He is one of those
strange players that seemingly cannot be dropped from a team. We are
stuck with him, probably till HE deciedes to retire!.

<<I'm expecting a couple of changes to the Bok lineup for the next one

Quote:
>but the Irish will probably field the same combo.>>>

What changes do you expect?

On pure form (and I suppose one must remember that Mallett knows what
he did the past week - in other words, if he put players through
stamina building exercises, he will probably forgive lack of form) I
would put Drotske in for Dalton, Skinstad for Erasmus, Swanepoel for
Joost, Franco Smit for Gaffie and Boome for Andrews. Boome and
Swanepoel because they are in the squad, which limits choice.

 
 
 

South Africa vs Ireland (SPOILER)

Post by Ferd » Mon, 15 Jun 1998 04:00:00

On Sun, 14 Jun 1998 07:07:12 +0100, Hector Cameron

<<>Hello Mike

Quote:
>Do you think as I do Joost's form is not as good as it has been in the
>past and should Swanepoel start as scrumhalf with Joost on the bench.
>Hector
>PS Never did get those tapes.>>

Sorry to but in ---  I agree with you 100%. Even romove him from the
bench the way he playes these days. Pick Swanepoel and Putt.
 
 
 

South Africa vs Ireland (SPOILER)

Post by Mike Am » Mon, 15 Jun 1998 04:00:00

Quote:

>Hello Mike
>Do you think as I do Joost's form is not as good as it has been in
>the past and should Swanepoel start as scrumhalf with Joost on
>the bench.
>Hector

IMO the dilemma is that Joost the rugby player is lethal but Joost the
scrummie is an imposter. The question is where else can he be  used
effectively? "Left wing", some say, "Openside flanker", say others.

Quote:
>PS Never did get those tapes.

They may still pitch. So many of our tapes have gone astray, we have
stopped consigning. The word is that ***o videos from the east were
being re-consigned locally and all tapes were being seized or possibly
just stolen locally. Sorry, not much I can do. We have already
refunded those who covered our expenses in advance.
 
 
 

South Africa vs Ireland (SPOILER)

Post by Henri Burge » Mon, 15 Jun 1998 04:00:00

Quote:

>I am not optimistic that Joost will be dropped. He is one of those
>strange players that seemingly cannot be dropped from a team. We are
>stuck with him, probably till HE deciedes to retire!.

Time to call the NSC in, Ferdi?

-:)

Oh, courtesy to Didds!

Regards

Henri Burger, Tzaneen. RSA
'Afrika is Nie vir Sissies Nie!'
(e-mail: remove 'sukikaki.')

 
 
 

South Africa vs Ireland (SPOILER)

Post by Mike Am » Mon, 15 Jun 1998 04:00:00

Quote:

>What changes do you expect?

The changes I expect and the changes I myself would make without one
second's hesitation are not the same. When I see some of the opinions
expressed by a lot of my good friends whom I really like and respect
and see what havoc their type of thinking has wreaked on SA rugby over
the last 5 or 6 years and I hear them talk about the tried and tested
formulas of the past then.....

Ferdi, I really despair for SA rugby because IMO these people just
don't understand the game anymore but they still truly believe that
they do. The truth is that the game has changed radically and
continues to change each year from the start of S12 to the end.

This year was no exception and even some S12 coaches are still trying
to work out in simple terms, why the Golden Cats saw their gat without
a mirror. At this stage I am looking (so far in vain) for some sign
that Mallett and his assistant still know what they are doing. I hope
so!

Quote:
>On pure form (and I suppose one must remember that Mallett knows what
>he did the past week - in other words, if he put players through
>stamina building exercises, he will probably forgive lack of form) I
>would put Drotske in for Dalton, Skinstad for Erasmus, Swanepoel for
>Joost, Franco Smit for Gaffie and Boome for Andrews. Boome and
>Swanepoel because they are in the squad, which limits choice.

Well I never chose the squad so I don't limit my choice which would
be as follows: (Substitutes in brackets)

15 Joubert 14 Terblanche 13 Snyman 12 Muller 11 v/d Westhuizen 10 du
Toit 9 Putt 8 Teichmann 7 Skinstadt 6 Vos 5 Venter 4 Andrews 3 Garvie
2 Rossouw 1 le Roux
(Montgomery, Smith, Swanepoel, Dalton, Kempson, Boome, Erasmus)

If Honiball and du Randt were available, my lineup would be different.
If the referee was someone other than Ed Morrison, I might also
reconsider my lineup depending on the actual choice of ref.

Cheers
Mike

 
 
 

South Africa vs Ireland (SPOILER)

Post by Denis J Mille » Mon, 15 Jun 1998 04:00:00

Mike Amm's team is spot-on. Joost at wing. Fax this to Mallett,
will you??????

--
D J Miller

 
 
 

South Africa vs Ireland (SPOILER)

Post by Coetzee, Jacob Car » Tue, 16 Jun 1998 04:00:00

Quote:

> I have been saying for years Joost is shit scrum half. A great player,
> but a shit scrum half. He paralyses a backline. We were spoilt end of
> last year with Swanepoel who actually serves his backline.
> I am not optimistic that Joost will be dropped. He is one of those
> strange players that seemingly cannot be dropped from a team. We are
> stuck with him, probably till HE deciedes to retire!.

> On pure form (and I suppose one must remember that Mallett knows what
> he did the past week - in other words, if he put players through
> stamina building exercises, he will probably forgive lack of form) I
> would put Drotske in for Dalton, Skinstad for Erasmus, Swanepoel for
> Joost, Franco Smit for Gaffie and Boome for Andrews. Boome and
> Swanepoel because they are in the squad, which limits choice.

Let's examine the situation: If the Springbok selectors were to drop
Joost and Andrews, (and with Os sidelined) they will be left with ...
zero, ziltch, aizikolo players who won the World Cup in 1995! Crazy!

What are the aims of the Springboks this season? To beat Ireland, Wales
or England by record margins, thereby justifying a policy of team
selection purely on merit? I think not. Rather to beat the AB's at least
once this year, and to prepare for WC99. To beat the All Blacks, or to
do well in the World Cup, you need players with talent, EXPERIENCE and
BMT. The 1995 Springboks achieved the ultimate in rugby, and proved that
they had guts, determination, and BMT. Some of them have retired, or
have moved on to England's greener pastures, but while we still have
players like Andrews and Joost who are not that old and who can still
play a decent game of rugby, we can't afford to do without them! Bring
back Joubert and Chester. If Ruben Kruger returns to any sort of form,
get him in there. Make room for Rossouw and even Hennie le Roux in the
squad. And forget about replacing Joost and Andrews, whether they are in
top form or not. These guys have been there and have done it, and they
know first-hand what it takes to win a big match. Experience is
something which no coach can impart to a player - it is something which
is earned the hard way.

Look at the All Blacks on the other hand: Wilson, Little, Lomu (assuming
he is selected), Mehrtens, Kronfeld, M Jones, I Jones, Brooke, Brown,
Dowd. I may be wrong on one or two, but as far as I can remember, all
these current AB's played in the WC95 final. Last year, after the Super
12, a friend remarked how he could not see some of the All Blacks
keeping their places in the AB team. Guys like Little, Bunce, Mehrtens
(OK, he was dropped for a while), Kronfeld, and even Wilson. These
players did not have a great S12, or there were other NZ players who
simply looked to be in better form. However, the AB management has
vision and values experience. These players retained their places, and
they kicked some serious butt!

JC

 
 
 

South Africa vs Ireland (SPOILER)

Post by Mike Am » Tue, 16 Jun 1998 04:00:00


Quote:
>Mike Amm's team is spot-on. Joost at wing. Fax this to Mallett,
>will you??????

Thanks for the compliment Denis but Mallett probably has enough
alt.radical.rugby.advice to last him a lifetime. He'll probably
call me when his supply of test victories, runs a bit lower.:o)

Hamba kahle
Mike Amm

 
 
 

South Africa vs Ireland (SPOILER)

Post by Ferd » Tue, 16 Jun 1998 04:00:00

On Sun, 14 Jun 1998 20:35:12 -0400, Denis J Miller

<<>Mike Amm's team is spot-on. Joost at wing. Fax this to Mallett,

Quote:
>will you??????>>

The problem is it was tried before by NTvl - Joost on the wing - and
he did not shape all that well on the wing.
 
 
 

South Africa vs Ireland (SPOILER)

Post by Mike Am » Tue, 16 Jun 1998 04:00:00

Quote:

>The problem is it was tried before by NTvl - Joost on the wing - and
>he did not shape all that well on the wing.

Are you quite sure about that Ferdi? As I remember it, Joost played
the first half on the wing and Coenie Breytenbach was at scrummie. As
I remember it Coenie was chewing bricks at scrummie, so Joost went
back there after halftime to save the Northerns coach's bacon!!!

Maybe my memory is letting me down but I think John Williams was the
Northerns coach at the time and everyone was on his back in a big way.
Wasn't it S12 '96, the round robin against Auckland at Eden Park?

Or has my memory gone totally oud, koud en befok??

 
 
 

South Africa vs Ireland (SPOILER)

Post by Ferd » Tue, 16 Jun 1998 04:00:00

On Mon, 15 Jun 1998 16:11:15 +0800, "Coetzee, Jacob Carl"

<<>play a decent game of rugby, we can't afford to do without them!
Bring

Quote:
>back Joubert and Chester. If Ruben Kruger returns to any sort of form,
>get him in there. Make room for Rossouw and even Hennie le Roux in the
>squad. And forget about replacing Joost and Andrews, whether they are in
>top form or not. >>

And why not Francois Pienaar, Balie Swart, James Small, Joel Stransky
and Hannes Strydom as well?

(Maybe because they, er, don't play so well any more...?)

Ruben Kruger cannot even make the Vodacom NTvl team.

 
 
 

South Africa vs Ireland (SPOILER)

Post by Ferd » Tue, 16 Jun 1998 04:00:00



<<>Are you quite sure about that Ferdi? As I remember it, Joost played

Quote:
>the first half on the wing and Coenie Breytenbach was at scrummie. As
>I remember it Coenie was chewing bricks at scrummie, so Joost went
>back there after halftime to save the Northerns coach's bacon!!!

>Maybe my memory is letting me down but I think John Williams was the
>Northerns coach at the time and everyone was on his back in a big way.
>Wasn't it S12 '96, the round robin against Auckland at Eden Park?

>Or has my memory gone totally oud, koud en befok??>>

Better than mine. I don't remember teh details any better than you. It
may have been against WP on Newlands as well. As I remember they could
have started without Joost on the wing. He did not make much of a
difference there.
 
 
 

South Africa vs Ireland (SPOILER)

Post by Charles Lev » Fri, 19 Jun 1998 04:00:00


) wrote about Rueben Kruger:

Quote:
> The NZ test was his one good game in many average ones. He was on the
> verge of losing his place before ge got hurt. Ahead of him in the race
> to Bok colours these days are people like Skinstad, Charle van
> Rensburg, Wayne Fyvie (when he is back later this year), AJ Venter and
> some NTvl loosies.

Kruger is a great flanker, just cos he's not really big or really fast he
doesn't get rated. The top 2 inches are what give Kruger the edge. I
watched last years triseries tests, Kruger, as he should be was the first
bok to the breakdown. The next bok was often Teicheman and the rest where
too slow. The boks lost the battle for the loose ball badly without him.

Andre Venter should play lock or left-right-out, not openside.
AJ Venter is a no8, not an openside.
Skinstad fit is without a doubt the best openside in SA.
I don't rate Fyvie, he's been outplayed by quite a few kiwi flakers
(even Carter :-) ).
Who does Van Rensburg play for?
Erasmus is another good openside.

Quote:
> << But Chris Rossouw
> >is regarded by many as the best *** in the country, >>>

> There I can come close to agreeing with you.

Me too. Why was he dropped after the world cup.