Rowntree on Walsh

Rowntree on Walsh

Post by Mentalguy2k » Sat, 23 Mar 2013 22:33:22


Found a slightly more expansive report on Rowntree's comments, seems to
agree with the suspicion that Walsh says one thing before the game and does
another during it:

http://www.sportinglife.com/rugby-union/news/article/504/8578318/rown...

"Rowntree is "annoyed" by the way Walsh handled both the scrum and the
breakdown, two key areas which Wales dominated as they stormed to a record
victory and the Six Nations title.

"Wales are said to have admitted privately after the match that they
collapsed the scrum on six occasions but it was England, unable to hold them
up, who were penalised.

"England also have issues with the key turnover which led to Alex Cuthbert's
first try, a moment head coach Stuart Lancaster described as "the tipping
point" in the game.

**"Rowntree suggested the message he received in his pre-match meeting with
Walsh was not followed through into the game and he wants to ask the IRB's
referee's chief Joel Jutge why."**

Meanwhile here's the turnover specifically mentioned by England:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?feature=player_detailpage&v=gCE34Npj1AI#...

What do the collective brains of RSRU make of it? Illegal or not?

 
 
 

Rowntree on Walsh

Post by mr_tiger_fis » Sat, 23 Mar 2013 23:20:23

Quote:

> What do the collective brains of RSRU make of it? Illegal or not?

I know what I think of that specific event. I think Owens was off his feet as he dislodged the ball from Parling's grasp for it to pop up loose. All over in the blink of an eye and dead easy to miss in realtime by even a good referee. A SH referee would, IMHO be more likely to let it go than a NH ref. Walsh is from the SH and he let it go... very enthusiastically waving his arms about to indicate the ball was back in open play.

This is the law I think was transgressed:

15.6    OTHER PLAYERS

(a) After a tackle, all other players must be on their feet when they
play the ball. Players are on their feet if no other part of their body
is supported by the ground or players on the ground.

Penalty: Penalty Kick

 
 
 

Rowntree on Walsh

Post by Ning » Sun, 24 Mar 2013 00:03:34


Quote:

>> What do the collective brains of RSRU make of it? Illegal or not?

> I know what I think of that specific event. I think Owens was off his feet as he dislodged the ball from Parling's grasp for it to pop up loose. All over in the blink of an eye and dead easy to miss in realtime by even a good referee. A SH referee would, IMHO be more likely to let it go than a NH ref. Walsh is from the SH and he let it go... very enthusiastically waving his arms about to indicate the ball was back in open play.

> This is the law I think was transgressed:

> 15.6    OTHER PLAYERS

> (a) After a tackle, all other players must be on their feet when they
> play the ball. Players are on their feet if no other part of their body
> is supported by the ground or players on the ground.

> Penalty: Penalty Kick

I'd like to know which offences SL thought were being committed.
Regardless of the rule above, it's looks like a knock-on but that would
have been difficult to spot as Walsh is on the other side and can't see
the ball.

Youngs assumes an offence has been committed and waits for Walsh to do
something,  Robshaw has to cover for Youngs thus  leaving Mike Brown
trying to cover a 3 on 1.

Pete

 
 
 

Rowntree on Walsh

Post by Stephe » Sun, 24 Mar 2013 03:30:26

Quote:


>>> What do the collective brains of RSRU make of it? Illegal or not?

>> I know what I think of that specific event. I think Owens was off his
>> feet as he dislodged the ball from Parling's grasp for it to pop up
>> loose. All over in the blink of an eye and dead easy to miss in realtime
>> by even a good referee. A SH referee would, IMHO be more likely to let
>> it go than a NH ref. Walsh is from the SH and he let it go... very
>> enthusiastically waving his arms about to indicate the ball was back in open play.

>> This is the law I think was transgressed:

>> 15.6    OTHER PLAYERS

>> (a) After a tackle, all other players must be on their feet when they
>> play the ball. Players are on their feet if no other part of their body
>> is supported by the ground or players on the ground.

>> Penalty: Penalty Kick

> I'd like to know which offences SL thought were being committed.
> Regardless of the rule above, it's looks like a knock-on but that would
> have been difficult to spot as Walsh is on the other side and can't see the ball.

> Youngs assumes an offence has been committed and waits for Walsh to do
> something,  Robshaw has to cover for Youngs thus  leaving Mike Brown
> trying to cover a 3 on 1.

> Pete

Of all teams in the world, I'd have thought Englanders are taught to play
the whistle
--
Cheers
Stephen
 
 
 

Rowntree on Walsh

Post by Morrissey Bree » Sun, 24 Mar 2013 04:58:08


Quote:


> >>> What do the collective brains of RSRU make of it? Illegal or not?

> >> I know what I think of that specific event. I think Owens was off his
> >> feet as he dislodged the ball from Parling's grasp for it to pop up
> >> loose. All over in the blink of an eye and dead easy to miss in realtime
> >> by even a good referee. A SH referee would, IMHO be more likely to let
> >> it go than a NH ref. Walsh is from the SH and he let it go... very
> >> enthusiastically waving his arms about to indicate the ball was back in open play.

> >> This is the law I think was transgressed:

> >> 15.6 ? ?OTHER PLAYERS

> >> (a) After a tackle, all other players must be on their feet when they
> >> play the ball. Players are on their feet if no other part of their body
> >> is supported by the ground or players on the ground.

> >> Penalty: Penalty Kick

> > I'd like to know which offences SL thought were being committed.
> > Regardless of the rule above, it's looks like a knock-on but that would
> > have been difficult to spot as Walsh is on the other side and can't see the ball.

> > Youngs assumes an offence has been committed and waits for Walsh to do
> > something, ?Robshaw has to cover for Youngs thus ?leaving Mike Brown
> > trying to cover a 3 on 1.

> > Pete

> Of all teams in the world, I'd have thought Englanders are taught to play
> the whistle
> --
> Cheers
> Stephen

And what if there is NO whistle? What if the referee REFUSES to blow
the whistle?
 
 
 

Rowntree on Walsh

Post by Mentalguy2k » Sun, 24 Mar 2013 05:23:44



Quote:


> >>> What do the collective brains of RSRU make of it? Illegal or not?

> >> I know what I think of that specific event. I think Owens was off his
> >> feet as he dislodged the ball from Parling's grasp for it to pop up
> >> loose. All over in the blink of an eye and dead easy to miss in
> >> realtime
> >> by even a good referee. A SH referee would, IMHO be more likely to let
> >> it go than a NH ref. Walsh is from the SH and he let it go... very
> >> enthusiastically waving his arms about to indicate the ball was back in
> >> open play.

> >> This is the law I think was transgressed:

> >> 15.6 OTHER PLAYERS

> >> (a) After a tackle, all other players must be on their feet when they
> >> play the ball. Players are on their feet if no other part of their body
> >> is supported by the ground or players on the ground.

> >> Penalty: Penalty Kick

> > I'd like to know which offences SL thought were being committed.
> > Regardless of the rule above, it's looks like a knock-on but that would
> > have been difficult to spot as Walsh is on the other side and can't see
> > the ball.

> > Youngs assumes an offence has been committed and waits for Walsh to do
> > something, Robshaw has to cover for Youngs thus leaving Mike Brown
> > trying to cover a 3 on 1.

> > Pete

> Of all teams in the world, I'd have thought Englanders are taught to play
> the whistle
> --
> Cheers
> Stephen
>And what if there is NO whistle? What if the referee REFUSES to blow
>the whistle?

Then you play on. It's no good standing there shouting "off his feet off his
feet" and waving your arms around while play continues.
 
 
 

Rowntree on Walsh

Post by Richard Bridgma » Sun, 24 Mar 2013 08:43:21

Quote:

>> What do the collective brains of RSRU make of it? Illegal or not?

> I know what I think of that specific event. I think Owens was off his
> feet as he dislodged the ball from Parling's grasp for it to pop up
> loose. All over in the blink of an eye and dead easy to miss in realtime
> by even a good referee. A SH referee would, IMHO be more likely to let it
> go than a NH ref. Walsh is from the SH and he let it go... very
> enthusiastically waving his arms about to indicate the ball was back in open play.

> This is the law I think was transgressed:

> 15.6    OTHER PLAYERS

> (a) After a tackle, all other players must be on their feet when they
> play the ball. Players are on their feet if no other part of their body
> is supported by the ground or players on the ground.

> Penalty: Penalty Kick

I suppose so. Or Hands in the ruck. But marginal. You could be forgiven for
saying Parling was holding on a fraction too long, so...

But in any case, so what? So the ref missed it. So he didn't ref how he
said he would. Let's get over it. I'm more concerned that many of the
England players didn't play the way they said they would.

--
Richard Bridgman

 
 
 

Rowntree on Walsh

Post by Ben » Sun, 24 Mar 2013 19:53:53

The turnover is neither here nor there. Or to put it another way: if England had scored from a similar situation so be it.

My issue with the scrubs is less that Walsh is somehow anti England than he has no clue what is happening at scrum time. He's not the only ref with that issue but because Walsh's interactions with players are poor - blanking Robshaw, but giving detailed explanations to Warburton (who wasn't captain) it makes it hard for sides Walsh has taken against to work out what to do differently.

And it bears repeating that Wales were the better side. There is an argument that things may have gone differently with a bit of momentum but England's failure to take the opportunities they did have is the root of their loss.

 
 
 

Rowntree on Walsh

Post by Tom Westo » Sun, 24 Mar 2013 23:16:29

[snip]

Quote:

> "Wales are said to have admitted privately after the match that they

> collapsed the scrum on six occasions but it was England, unable to hold them

> up, who were penalised.

This seems a pretty contentious claim. Is there any source on this other than
Rowntree?
 
 
 

Rowntree on Walsh

Post by John William » Mon, 25 Mar 2013 11:04:02

On Sat, 23 Mar 2013 07:16:29 -0700 (PDT), Tom Weston

Quote:


>[snip]

>> "Wales are said to have admitted privately after the match that they

>> collapsed the scrum on six occasions but it was England, unable to hold them

>> up, who were penalised.

>This seems a pretty contentious claim. Is there any source on this other than
>Rowntree?

I'm not at all sure Rowntree said this. I believe it was published in
a Welsh regional paper, but how true that is I have no idea, not
having looked for it.

I wouldn't trust the papers too much on this unless there are words
from Rowntree in quotes, and even then I wouldn't be surprised if
there were "errors". The rugby "journalism" in this country is like
the rest of journalism here.

--

All the best
John Williams