Team-mate wars : pure conjecture

Team-mate wars : pure conjecture

Post by ric zi » Fri, 23 Mar 2007 17:29:17


Just some shameless conjecturing to pass the time waiting for another
effing meeting to start...feel free to comment :-)

FERRARI - Kimi vs Massa :
Massa will be quick, sometimes quicker than Kimi. But he is now under
pressure to live up to his own ego and we've seen in previous years what
Massa's like under self-imposed pressure... Expect front rows and pole
from him, but expect also some JPM-like rashness and hotheaded mistakes.

RESULT : Kimi will calmly win the battle over the course of the season,
and will probably do Massa's (and others') head in.

MCLAREN - Alonso vs Hamilton :
Alonso has one season during which to make his experience, courage and
racecraft compensate for his slight lack of outright speed, before
Hamilton learns from him and turns Fred's tools against him. Expect much
Prost/Schumacher strategic driving and racecraft from Fred. Hamilton
will rattle him, and in 2008 Alonso, disgruntled with Lewis's "star
treatment" within the team, may well move elsewhere. Toyota will snap
him up, probably, to replace one of the Tugger Twins.

RESULT : Alonso to win, just. He'll be a moody bastard from June
onwards.

BMW - Heidfeld-Kubica :
Nick is quick, no doubt about that. Kubica is the best thing that's ever
happened to Heidfeld. Woke him up from a deep slumber. Both of these
guys will go at it hammer and tongs, but I think Nick will win by a
slender margin, thanks to his experience. However, I wouldn't be
surprised if in their haste, they took each other out a few times,
Williams-style. Expect much frowning from Mario Theissen.

RESULT : Heidfeld to scrape it. Both guys will get their knuckles rapped
by Super Mario at least once.

RENAULT - Fisi-Kovalainen :
Fisi will drive at the same level as last year. He is well and truly in
his twilight years. He will be (rightly) replaced in 2008 by Piquet, I'm
100% sure of it. Kovalainen will have a Rosberg-like first year. He'll
do enough on occasion to show that he's very quick, but I'm worried that
he's too inconsistent and feverish. He needs a year to calm down, and
get ready for the challenge that Nelsinho will throw at him in 2008.

RESULT : Fisi, on points - but not enough to justify keeping him.

HONDA - Button-Barrichello :
It's a moot point. They're both going to suffer. These guys are so
evenly matched it's hard to pull out a clear winner. I'll go for Rubens,
just for a change, but I'll admit that's more to do with Buttonausia
than anything else.

RESULT : Rubens will win this battle of the has-beens, by a wafer.
Probably by virtue of less bad luck.

TOYOTA - Trulli-Ralf :
Who cares? Trulli will be quicker all year, but Ralf will get more
points (in ones and twos). Gosh golly wow I'm so e***d.

RESULT : Ralf, thanks to a string of exciting 7th and 8th places.

RED BULL - Coulthard-Webber :
Webber will win, but he'll be worried that he won't beat Granddad by as
much as he expected. He will finally understand what we all know : that
he's Mr.Overrated. The car will be off the pace all season, and Newey's
Godlike status will drop faster than Kimi's pants. That'll be one myth
put to rest. The Design God of the last 10 years was Rory Byrne anyway,
with Newey a distant second. DC will have a good time fighting in the
pack and will probably call it a day at the end of the year, a rich,
happy and fulfilled man. Good on him.

RESULT : Webber will scrape it, and will reveal his true identity this
year : The Australian Fisi. Coulthard will retire, rich as Croesus and
smiling from ear to ear.

SUPER AGURI - Sato-Davidson :
Should be a good battle between the two featherweights. I expect Taku to
win, quite simply because he's blindingly fast when he wants to be, and
seems to have much improved as a race driver these last two seasons. He
has the experience and the speed. He'll also command more respect within
the team, of course.

RESULT : Sato-san, by a whisker. Davidson will be plucky and brilliant
on occasion but will ultimately suffer from rainy British sporting luck.

------

I can't be arsed to do the Toro Rossos and Spykers, I don't really care
either way. Plus, the meeting's about to start...<yawn> (where's the
Tetris on this machine?)...
--
ric at pixelligence dot com

 
 
 

Team-mate wars : pure conjecture

Post by Phil Carmod » Fri, 23 Mar 2007 18:36:24

Quote:

> Just some shameless conjecturing to pass the time waiting for another
> effing meeting to start...feel free to comment :-)

Is your 'winning' the psychological battle, or the points battle?

Phil
--
"Home taping is killing big business profits. We left this side blank
so you can help." -- Dead Kennedys, written upon the B-side of tapes of
/In God We Trust, Inc./.

 
 
 

Team-mate wars : pure conjecture

Post by ric zi » Fri, 23 Mar 2007 18:54:57

Quote:


> > Just some shameless conjecturing to pass the time waiting for another
> > effing meeting to start...feel free to comment :-)

> Is your 'winning' the psychological battle, or the points battle?

Points. If you're talking about Fred, he'll probably lose the psych
battle to Lewis. If you're talking about Kimi, it'll be both : points
and headgames.
--
ric

ric at pixelligence dot com

 
 
 

Team-mate wars : pure conjecture

Post by Pete Fenelo » Fri, 23 Mar 2007 20:50:30

Quote:

> will rattle him, and in 2008 Alonso, disgruntled with Lewis's "star
> treatment" within the team, may well move elsewhere. Toyota will snap
> him up, probably, to replace one of the Tugger Twins.

I doubt it. Toyota have never looked like a top team, and Ron and Lewis
are in it for the long term. I can see the FA/LH pairing staying
together as long as DC/MH.

Quote:
> RESULT : Heidfeld to scrape it. Both guys will get their knuckles rapped
> by Super Mario at least once.

But in '08 Kubica will be formidable. Vettel's in the frame too snapping
at both their heels, so neither man can slack.

Quote:
> RESULT : Rubens will win this battle of the has-beens, by a wafer.
> Probably by virtue of less bad luck.

Rubens looks like he's stopped caring; JB looks like he's started.

Quote:
> TOYOTA - Trulli-Ralf :
> RESULT : Ralf, thanks to a string of exciting 7th and 8th places.

Who gives a *** either way?

Quote:
> RED BULL - Coulthard-Webber :

> RESULT : Webber will scrape it, and will reveal his true identity this
> year : The Australian Fisi. Coulthard will retire, rich as Croesus and
> smiling from ear to ear.

I still think DC has the edge on Webber.

Quote:

> SUPER AGURI - Sato-Davidson :

> RESULT : Sato-san, by a whisker. Davidson will be plucky and brilliant
> on occasion but will ultimately suffer from rainy British sporting luck.

Taku makes too many mistakes and overdrives too much.

pete
--

 
 
 

Team-mate wars : pure conjecture

Post by WebSlav » Fri, 23 Mar 2007 23:05:17

Quote:

> MCLAREN - Alonso vs Hamilton :
> Alonso has one season during which to make his experience, courage and
> racecraft compensate for his slight lack of outright speed,

He has speed, if he needs to. Most of the time he plays his cards so
that he doesn't.

Quote:
> Hamilton
> will rattle him, and in 2008 Alonso, disgruntled with Lewis's "star
> treatment" within the team, may well move elsewhere.

Alonso moved to McLaren partly because he wanted a longer deal than
Renault had to offer. He is signed to the end of 2009.

Quote:
> RED BULL - Coulthard-Webber :
> Webber will win, but he'll be worried that he won't beat Granddad by as
> much as he expected.

I predicted that DC will destroy the last shreds of Webber's
reputation as a good driver.

-Webs-

 
 
 

Team-mate wars : pure conjecture

Post by Paul- » Fri, 23 Mar 2007 23:21:20

Quote:

> I predicted that DC will destroy the last shreds of Webber's
> reputation as a good driver.

LOL!

When did Webber ever have that reputation?

--
Paul-B         Formula 1 -  cheat-free version here now.

 
 
 

Team-mate wars : pure conjecture

Post by Lenn » Fri, 23 Mar 2007 23:50:49


Quote:
> I predicted that DC will destroy the last shreds of Webber's
> reputation as a wide driver.

Here, I fixed that typo for you...
 
 
 

Team-mate wars : pure conjecture

Post by Mikolaj Machowsk » Sat, 24 Mar 2007 01:26:46

ric zito scripsit:

Quote:
> BMW - Heidfeld-Kubica :
> Nick is quick, no doubt about that. Kubica is the best thing that's ever
> happened to Heidfeld. Woke him up from a deep slumber. Both of these
> guys will go at it hammer and tongs, but I think Nick will win by a
> slender margin, thanks to his experience. However, I wouldn't be
> surprised if in their haste, they took each other out a few times,
> Williams-style. Expect much frowning from Mario Theissen.

While I agree with your prediction of final result I doubt knocking out.
Both are rather cautious drivers and care about team position - together
can make BMW Sauber on podium of WCC. As a drivers they don't have
a chance to make WDC championship podium.

Quote:

> RESULT : Heidfeld to scrape it. Both guys will get their knuckles rapped
> by Super Mario at least once.

m.
 
 
 

Team-mate wars : pure conjecture

Post by WebSlav » Sat, 24 Mar 2007 09:05:51

Quote:

> LOL!

> When did Webber ever have that reputation?

When he had Yoong, Davidson, Pizzonia, Wilson and Klien as team-
mates. ;) At Jaguar he actually did show some promise from time to
time (especially in qualifying), but that relied on an assumption that
the Jag was crap. It was, of course, but maybe quite not as ***as
everybody thought. Webber's decent performance was put more to his
talent than the car at the time.

-Webs-

 
 
 

Team-mate wars : pure conjecture

Post by CatharticF » Sat, 24 Mar 2007 10:36:36



Quote:
> Just some shameless conjecturing to pass the time waiting for another
> effing meeting to start...feel free to comment :-)

> RESULT : Kimi will calmly win the battle over the course of the season,
> and will probably do Massa's (and others') head in.

Agreed. Kimi just _does_ it, no nonsense if even less communication to
the press.

Quote:
> RESULT : Alonso to win, just. He'll be a moody bastard from June
> onwards.

I'm still unsure, looking back on the times he was in clear air Fred
didn't really have the advantage I expected, though he did use his last
set of tyres better. Ultimately though he got the result and only he
knows whether it was difficult. The real story (as it was with Schu) is
when the car is less competitive or the two are separated. If Ferrari
stay in front though at least you'll know Fred is trying when there's
clear track in front.

Quote:
> RESULT : Heidfeld to scrape it. Both guys will get their knuckles
> rapped by Super Mario at least once.

Wildcard: Vettel. BMW plainly think very highly of him. No Friday for
Kubica on a track he's never driven? Nuts..

Quote:
> RESULT : Fisi, on points - but not enough to justify keeping him.

Fisi isn't slow, he's just inconsistent and easily demotivated. I was
socked (and I think Renault were too) by Heikki's performance. Plainly
it's an aberration, but his underperformance is fuel for Fisi. If he
turns the tables though I expect Fisi to 'flip' as well.

Quote:
> RESULT : Rubens will win this battle of the has-beens, by a wafer.
> Probably by virtue of less bad luck.

In my mind this another example of good drivers with bad cars. Sad - but
I roughly agree. But I don't think we can make a call until the car is a
potential race winner. How the hell are they supposed to be motivated as
it is? The undertone of every interview I have read makes me think
they're beating the technical team behind closed doors. And with Super
Aguri's performance they have the perfect stick to use.

Quote:
> RESULT : Ralf, thanks to a string of exciting 7th and 8th places.

Here we have 2 x Fisi, although I rank Trulli as better motivated. But
again they're both potentially quick, capable drivers who could get an
extra half a second out of the car were it a second quicker. I find it
hard to criticise drivers when the team is the weakest link.

Quote:
> RESULT : Webber will scrape it, and will reveal his true identity this
> year : The Australian Fisi. Coulthard will retire, rich as Croesus and
> smiling from ear to ear.

Webber DESPERATELY needs a quick reliable car. As with Button he's copped
criticism out of proportion with his talent. The frustration must be
immense and yet he put that thing on the 4th row with more fuel than the
Renault in front of him, only to have a plethora of problems including a
defective throttle sensor (sticking open) during the race. DC is
perpetually underrated but his experience must help them improve. I agree
on Newey - he's done some fabulous work but equally some very
disappointing work (take the flawed McLaren MP4/18).

--
CatharticF1

"What you thought was Freedom is just Greed."

 
 
 

Team-mate wars : pure conjecture

Post by Richard Mille » Sat, 24 Mar 2007 17:32:07



Quote:

>> LOL!

>> When did Webber ever have that reputation?

>When he had Yoong, Davidson, Pizzonia, Wilson and Klien as team-
>mates. ;) At Jaguar he actually did show some promise from time to
>time (especially in qualifying), but that relied on an assumption that
>the Jag was crap. It was, of course, but maybe quite not as ***as
>everybody thought. Webber's decent performance was put more to his
>talent than the car at the time.

Don't forget he also scored 2 points in a Minardi - even Alonso had only
managed to get it up to 10th place the previous year.
--
Richard Miller
 
 
 

Team-mate wars : pure conjecture

Post by a_Fran » Sat, 24 Mar 2007 17:45:43

On Fri, 23 Mar 2007 08:32:07 +0000, Richard Miller

Quote:




>>> LOL!

>>> When did Webber ever have that reputation?

>>When he had Yoong, Davidson, Pizzonia, Wilson and Klien as team-
>>mates. ;) At Jaguar he actually did show some promise from time to
>>time (especially in qualifying), but that relied on an assumption that
>>the Jag was crap. It was, of course, but maybe quite not as ***as
>>everybody thought. Webber's decent performance was put more to his
>>talent than the car at the time.

>Don't forget he also scored 2 points in a Minardi - even Alonso had only
>managed to get it up to 10th place the previous year.

Don't forget, mindless Webber bashing is a good way of removing focus
from other drivers who were to be the next Stewart, Mansell, etc..

--

Regards, Frank

 
 
 

Team-mate wars : pure conjecture

Post by Paul- » Sat, 24 Mar 2007 18:44:09

Quote:

> On Fri, 23 Mar 2007 08:32:07 +0000, Richard Miller




> >>> LOL!

> >>> When did Webber ever have that reputation?

> > > When he had Yoong, Davidson, Pizzonia, Wilson and Klien as team-
> > > mates. ;) At Jaguar he actually did show some promise from time to
> > > time (especially in qualifying), but that relied on an assumption
> > > that the Jag was crap. It was, of course, but maybe quite not as
> > > ***as everybody thought. Webber's decent performance was put
> > > more to his talent than the car at the time.

> > Don't forget he also scored 2 points in a Minardi - even Alonso had
> > only managed to get it up to 10th place the previous year.

> Don't forget, mindless Webber bashing is a good way of removing focus
> from other drivers who were to be the next Stewart, Mansell, etc..

Why is Webber-bashing supposed to be "mindless"? Is he above criticism
then?

My honest opinion is that he is overrated and nothing more than a
competent journeyman, occasional flashes of brilliance but no
consistency... rather like Fisi and Trulli.

I appreciate that you Aussies haven't had anyone to crow about since
Jonesy, but really... ;-p

--
Paul-B         Formula 1 -  cheat-free version here now.

 
 
 

Team-mate wars : pure conjecture

Post by CatharticF » Sat, 24 Mar 2007 19:20:04


Quote:

>> On Fri, 23 Mar 2007 08:32:07 +0000, Richard Miller




>> >>> LOL!

>> >>> When did Webber ever have that reputation?

>> > > When he had Yoong, Davidson, Pizzonia, Wilson and Klien as team-
>> > > mates. ;) At Jaguar he actually did show some promise from time to
>> > > time (especially in qualifying), but that relied on an assumption
>> > > that the Jag was crap. It was, of course, but maybe quite not as
>> > > ***as everybody thought. Webber's decent performance was put
>> > > more to his talent than the car at the time.

>> > Don't forget he also scored 2 points in a Minardi - even Alonso had
>> > only managed to get it up to 10th place the previous year.

>> Don't forget, mindless Webber bashing is a good way of removing focus
>> from other drivers who were to be the next Stewart, Mansell, etc..

> Why is Webber-bashing supposed to be "mindless"? Is he above criticism
> then?

> My honest opinion is that he is overrated and nothing more than a
> competent journeyman, occasional flashes of brilliance but no
> consistency... rather like Fisi and Trulli.

> I appreciate that you Aussies haven't had anyone to crow about since
> Jonesy, but really... ;-p

Listen - if you lot could build cars that didn't break down he might have
won Monaco against Kimi and Fred last year. In a Williams!

--
CatharticF1

'What you thought was freedom is just greed'

 
 
 

Team-mate wars : pure conjecture

Post by Paul Ian Harma » Sat, 24 Mar 2007 19:26:57


Quote:
> Listen - if you lot could build cars that didn't break down he might have
> won Monaco against Kimi and Fred last year. In a Williams!

Only a few short years ago, winning Monaco in a Williams would have been a
given. Oh how the times have changed.

    Paul