Indian bowling selection for matches against australia,england, pakistan

Indian bowling selection for matches against australia,england, pakistan

Post by Ra » Tue, 28 Jan 2003 07:54:42


who all should make up the bowling department in matches against
australia ,england , pakistan and zimbabwe?  Srinath is a
no-brainer.....Well ,let us see what other think about the remaining
slots.....
 
 
 

Indian bowling selection for matches against australia,england, pakistan

Post by Colin Kynoc » Tue, 28 Jan 2003 08:22:24

Quote:

> who all should make up the bowling department in matches against
> australia ,england , pakistan and zimbabwe?  Srinath is a
> no-brainer.....

Now that is harsh

Colin Kynoch

 
 
 

Indian bowling selection for matches against australia,england, pakistan

Post by Ra » Tue, 28 Jan 2003 13:42:31

Quote:

> Now that is harsh

> Colin Kynoch

What is harsh in this question? I was asking for the choices for
remaining slots in the bowling dept, given that srinanth's place is
guaranteed.........

 
 
 

Indian bowling selection for matches against australia,england, pakistan

Post by Ben Gusse » Tue, 28 Jan 2003 15:52:05


Quote:
> who all should make up the bowling department in matches against
> australia ,england , pakistan and zimbabwe?  Srinath is a
> no-brainer.....Well ,let us see what other think about the remaining
> slots.....

Harbhajan, Khan, Nehra, Srinath.

Use Gangs for the remaining overs.

--
Cheers,
Ben.

 
 
 

Indian bowling selection for matches against australia,england, pakistan

Post by Mad Hamis » Tue, 28 Jan 2003 20:14:15


Quote:

>> Now that is harsh

>> Colin Kynoch

>What is harsh in this question?

I can't remember the actual words you used I believe it was "Srinath
is a no-brainer"

Of course you meant that the selection of Srinath was a certainty but
Colin couldn't resist the joke.
--
"Hope is replaced by fear and dreams by survival, most of us get by."
Stuart Adamson 1958-2001

Mad Hamish
Hamish Laws

 
 
 

Indian bowling selection for matches against australia,england, pakistan

Post by Raghu Sakleshp » Wed, 29 Jan 2003 04:41:56

Quote:

> who all should make up the bowling department in matches against
> australia ,england , pakistan and zimbabwe?  Srinath is a
> no-brainer.....Well ,let us see what other think about the remaining
> slots.....

Would go with Z Khan as a sure thing to go with Srinath. I would also
take 2 of
Harby, Kumble and Nehra as the regular 4 bowlers. I would start with
Harby and Kumble and play Nehra in later games resting the worse of
Harby or Kumble if required.. Although I would play Nehra against Zim
for sure..

-raghu

 
 
 

Indian bowling selection for matches against australia,england, pakistan

Post by Nikhil Sha » Wed, 29 Jan 2003 05:54:23

Quote:


>>who all should make up the bowling department in matches against
>>australia ,england , pakistan and zimbabwe?  Srinath is a
>>no-brainer.....Well ,let us see what other think about the remaining
>>slots.....

> Would go with Z Khan as a sure thing to go with Srinath. I would also
> take 2 of
> Harby, Kumble and Nehra as the regular 4 bowlers. I would start with
> Harby and Kumble and play Nehra in later games resting the worse of
> Harby or Kumble if required.. Although I would play Nehra against Zim
> for sure..

> -raghu

My choice is

Srinath, Zhan, Agarkar, and Harbhajan

Like I said before, Agarkar just around the last WC in England
had an ECO rate of about around 5.3. His current ECO rate
of 5.1 has been because of he performs on the average
an E/R=4-5. The SA conditions are favorable to Agarkar
than to Nehra who relies on the movement off the air
in high humidity. In addition, Agarkar is a better
batsmen and a fielder than Nehra. Agarkar as a bowler in
SA certainly will do better than Nehra, let alone his
batting and fielding.

Shewag Ganguly Sachin Dravid Yuvraj Kaif Agarkar
Srinath Khan Kumble Harbhajan.

Actually, in terms of choice of the bowling attack,
Agarkar is a no-brainer, when you consider how much
value he adds in terms of his fielding and batting.
Both Srinath and Zhan *don't* add as much value as
batting and fielding as Agarkar adds.  The last 2 ODIs
we won were close matches and tailend batting is a value
factor that Agarkar adds. In that respect:

Agarkar Zhan Harby Kumble Srinath Nehra

Where bowling, fielding and batting is considered.

Regards

Nikhil

 
 
 

Indian bowling selection for matches against australia,england, pakistan

Post by Ra » Wed, 29 Jan 2003 11:37:23

Quote:



> >>who all should make up the bowling department in matches against
> >>australia ,england , pakistan and zimbabwe?  Srinath is a
> >>no-brainer.....Well ,let us see what other think about the remaining
> >>slots.....

> > Would go with Z Khan as a sure thing to go with Srinath. I would also
> > take 2 of
> > Harby, Kumble and Nehra as the regular 4 bowlers. I would start with
> > Harby and Kumble and play Nehra in later games resting the worse of
> > Harby or Kumble if required.. Although I would play Nehra against Zim
> > for sure..

> > -raghu

> My choice is

> Srinath, Zhan, Agarkar, and Harbhajan

> Like I said before, Agarkar just around the last WC in England
> had an ECO rate of about around 5.3. His current ECO rate
> of 5.1 has been because of he performs on the average
> an E/R=4-5. The SA conditions are favorable to Agarkar
> than to Nehra who relies on the movement off the air
> in high humidity. In addition, Agarkar is a better
> batsmen and a fielder than Nehra. Agarkar as a bowler in
> SA certainly will do better than Nehra, let alone his
> batting and fielding.

> Shewag Ganguly Sachin Dravid Yuvraj Kaif Agarkar
> Srinath Khan Kumble Harbhajan.

> Actually, in terms of choice of the bowling attack,
> Agarkar is a no-brainer, when you consider how much
> value he adds in terms of his fielding and batting.
> Both Srinath and Zhan *don't* add as much value as
> batting and fielding as Agarkar adds.  The last 2 ODIs
> we won were close matches and tailend batting is a value
> factor that Agarkar adds. In that respect:

> Agarkar Zhan Harby Kumble Srinath Nehra

> Where bowling, fielding and batting is considered.

> Regards

> Nikhil

Agarkar over Nehra? I guess that is a dangerous choice.Agarkar is
famous for inconsistency. One match he will perform too well and in
the next he will do the opposite...Where is Nehra can support Srinath
and Zaheer better.. Agarkar on the other hand can replace Mongia if
Mongia fails to perform on the pre-cup warmup matches against local SA
teams and also against Holland....Atleast he can bowl a couple of
overs as a 5th bolwer....
 
 
 

Indian bowling selection for matches against australia,england, pakistan

Post by Raghu Sakleshp » Thu, 30 Jan 2003 02:53:21

Quote:



> >>who all should make up the bowling department in matches against
> >>australia ,england , pakistan and zimbabwe?  Srinath is a
> >>no-brainer.....Well ,let us see what other think about the remaining
> >>slots.....

> > Would go with Z Khan as a sure thing to go with Srinath. I would also
> > take 2 of
> > Harby, Kumble and Nehra as the regular 4 bowlers. I would start with
> > Harby and Kumble and play Nehra in later games resting the worse of
> > Harby or Kumble if required.. Although I would play Nehra against Zim
> > for sure..

> > -raghu

> My choice is

> Srinath, Zhan, Agarkar, and Harbhajan

> Like I said before, Agarkar just around the last WC in England
> had an ECO rate of about around 5.3. His current ECO rate
> of 5.1 has been because of he performs on the average
> an E/R=4-5. The SA conditions are favorable to Agarkar
> than to Nehra who relies on the movement off the air
> in high humidity. In addition, Agarkar is a better
> batsmen and a fielder than Nehra. Agarkar as a bowler in
> SA certainly will do better than Nehra, let alone his
> batting and fielding.

> Shewag Ganguly Sachin Dravid Yuvraj Kaif Agarkar
> Srinath Khan Kumble Harbhajan.

The choices here narrows down to one of Nehra, Bangar and Agarkar as
an all rounder for the first game. The rest would pretty much select
themselves into the team atleast for the first match. After that
additional fine tuning could be done based on performance in the first
game.

I do agree that an all rounder would add more value to the team than
just a specialist third bowler. Nehra could find his place into the
team in the place of Kumble/Harby if one of them does not perform well
in the conditions there.
So between Agarkar and Bangar for the all rounder slot, I would go
with Bangar simply because Bangar can be more of a consistent bowler
than Agarkar. Agarkar has the inclination to get carried away and gets
easily crushed when he starts to stray in line and length. Bangar is
also a good bat too and has shown that the can step up the scoring
rate on a couple of occassions atleast.

Quote:
> Actually, in terms of choice of the bowling attack,
> Agarkar is a no-brainer, when you consider how much
> value he adds in terms of his fielding and batting.
> Both Srinath and Zhan *don't* add as much value as
> batting and fielding as Agarkar adds.  The last 2 ODIs
> we won were close matches and tailend batting is a value
> factor that Agarkar adds. In that respect:

Yes Srinath and ZKhan may not be as good as Agarkar in batting and
fielding, but Agarkar is no way near them in bowling quality, inspite
of his Strike rate capability :-)
Agarkar cannot make it to the team as a third seamer until Nehra
starts to fall apart. As an all rounder he will have to contend with
Bangar, and I would think Bangar would get selected over Agarkar for
the first match atleast..

Quote:
> Agarkar Zhan Harby Kumble Srinath Nehra

> Where bowling, fielding and batting is considered.

> Regards

> Nikhil

-raghu
 
 
 

Indian bowling selection for matches against australia,england, pakistan

Post by Nikhil Sha » Thu, 30 Jan 2003 02:56:07

<snip>

Quote:
> Agarkar over Nehra? I guess that is a dangerous choice.Agarkar is
> famous for inconsistency. One match he will perform too well and in
> the next he will do the opposite...Where is Nehra can support Srinath
> and Zaheer better.. Agarkar on the other hand can replace Mongia if
> Mongia fails to perform on the pre-cup warmup matches against local SA
> teams and also against Holland....Atleast he can bowl a couple of
> overs as a 5th bolwer....

The image we have against Agarkar is a propaganda. He is *famous*
for his inconsistency? I have been seeing that in all the players in the
side anyway :-) If a bowler averages 28 or below and being the only
bowler in the history of Indian cricket to do that by taking 100 wickets
or more in addition to Kapil and Srinath, by Indian standards I think
he is pretty consistent and that is indicated from his numbers he has

ODI games in India are high scoring. An average of about 275,
as compared to about 250 outside India, which can be a good
score to defend. For example let us take a look at Abdul Razzaq
and Srinath -



Both Srinath and Razzaq reached the same number of wkts
in the same number of matches, which is quite a coincidence :-)
but makes the comparison more sensible at 119 matches which
Razzaq has played so far. The percentage difference in
average is about approx 15%.

Is Razzaq better than Srinath, or even Zaheer or Agarkar
by 15%? No? I think bowling statistics of Indian bowlers
are about 15% worse than other bowlers. The point is, on
Indian pitches bowlers like Agarkar may further look inconsistent
that Khan and Srinath, who are also affected by their statistical
numbers. If Srinath, Khan or Agarkar were to play for
Pakistan they would average about 24, I would say fairly
consistent by international standards and an average of 28
by Indian standards.

Anyway the topic is about Agarkar, our favorite topic :-) And why
Agarkar over Nehra? Because Nehra's strike rate is about 50, or about
9 overs. In an entire ODI matches there is no guarantee that
Nehra can take a wicket, so there is plenty of support economy
wise but not strike-rate wise. We tend you think that support
bowlers are purely economical, I disagree. You also need to
be supportive in terms of the strike rate as well because both
Srinath and Zaheer are not going to take wickets all the time.

This problem occured in the last tour to SA where Gibbs and
Kirsten got to a flying start and our bowlers #3 and #4 who were
economical simply could not

Regards

Nikhil

 
 
 

Indian bowling selection for matches against australia,england, pakistan

Post by Lenin Mara » Thu, 30 Jan 2003 04:05:50


Quote:
> So between Agarkar and Bangar for the all rounder slot, I would go
> with Bangar simply because Bangar can be more of a consistent bowler
> than Agarkar. Agarkar has the inclination to get carried away and gets
> easily crushed when he starts to stray in line and length. Bangar is
> also a good bat too and has shown that the can step up the scoring
> rate on a couple of occassions atleast.

Bangar might be good for tests but AA should always be selected over him
fo ODIs.

Some stats

Overall
SB  - 5 wickets at 58.40. ER of 5.40 and SR of 64.8
          161 runs at 17.88 SR 81.31

AA - 166 wickets at 28.73. ER of 5.12 and SR of 33.6
          782 runs at 17.00 SR 88.56

Matches they have plaeyd together

SB  - 5 wickets at 47.8 ER of  5.3 and SR of  54
         73 runs at a SR of  58.87 avg 9.12
AA - 17 wickets at 17.11. ER of  4.1 and SR of 25
          71 runs at a SR of  112.7 avg 8.87

I don't think you can justify his place on perfomance for the
allrounders spot.

Peace,
Lenin

 
 
 

Indian bowling selection for matches against australia,england, pakistan

Post by Colin Kynoc » Thu, 30 Jan 2003 20:07:53

Quote:



>>>Now that is harsh

>>>Colin Kynoch

>>What is harsh in this question?

> I can't remember the actual words you used I believe it was "Srinath
> is a no-brainer"

> Of course you meant that the selection of Srinath was a certainty but
> Colin couldn't resist the joke.

Got it.

The Bondanath wars are still in the memory banks.

Colin Kynoch
Who can't find a good source of bonda outside of Melbourne in Victoria.

- Show quoted text -

 
 
 

Indian bowling selection for matches against australia,england, pakistan

Post by Devd » Fri, 31 Jan 2003 05:14:37

Quote:



> > So between Agarkar and Bangar for the all rounder slot, I would go
> > with Bangar simply because Bangar can be more of a consistent bowler
> > than Agarkar. Agarkar has the inclination to get carried away and gets
> > easily crushed when he starts to stray in line and length. Bangar is
> > also a good bat too and has shown that the can step up the scoring
> > rate on a couple of occassions atleast.

> Bangar might be good for tests but AA should always be selected over him
> fo ODIs.

> Some stats

> Overall
> SB  - 5 wickets at 58.40. ER of 5.40 and SR of 64.8
>           161 runs at 17.88 SR 81.31

> AA - 166 wickets at 28.73. ER of 5.12 and SR of 33.6
>           782 runs at 17.00 SR 88.56

> Matches they have plaeyd together

> SB  - 5 wickets at 47.8 ER of  5.3 and SR of  54
>          73 runs at a SR of  58.87 avg 9.12
> AA - 17 wickets at 17.11. ER of  4.1 and SR of 25
>           71 runs at a SR of  112.7 avg 8.87

> I don't think you can justify his place on perfomance for the
> allrounders spot.

> Peace,
> Lenin

What a pity we are comparing an established ODI bowler
like Agarkar to Bangar. What preplexes me is that what
has Bangar really done to merit this attention for
allrounder and fond hopes from the skipper? The
traditional definition of an allrounder is that he
is a good bowler who can also contribute reasonably with
the bat. Bangar can't bowl for nuts even more than a
couple of overs in onedayers, so where does the question
of him being an allrounder arise? (It is for this reason
i think Laxman's dropping was harakiri as he would have
added far better value to the batter's choices than Bangar
but that is another story best kept for a future date).
Of course, in India the allrounder definition has taken
a topsy-turvy as batsmen who can bat well and  bowl a
few good overs here and there are being touted and encouraged
as allrounders.

Devdas