Sport Today

by S » Fri, 28 Mar 2008 10:12:34

Didn't see any of the 1st day but the spinners came on after 10 overs so
that gives us a clue. Seamers bowled 29 overs.

I am always skeptical about listening to the bowlers opinions (no matter
who they are) - when things don't go well for them they tend to link
their performance to the pitch. When things go well they don't mention
the pitch much.

SA really need over 500. Hope they can do it. They have often failed to
convert from good foundations

Interested to see how India go in their innings. One never knows

by **Rosha** » Fri, 28 Mar 2008 11:22:28

Quote:

> Didn't see any of the 1st day but the spinners came on after 10 overs so
> that gives us a clue. Seamers bowled 29 overs.

> I am always skeptical about listening to the bowlers opinions (no matter
> who they are) - when things don't go well for them they tend to link
> their performance to the pitch. When things go well they don't mention
> the pitch much.

> SA really need over 500. Hope they can do it. They have often failed to
> convert from good foundations

> Interested to see how India go in their innings. One never knows

I suspect SA will fold for 400-450 and India will
reply with a 500+ score for a lead of about 50-75 runs.

by **Uday Raja** » Fri, 28 Mar 2008 10:26:17

Quote:

> Didn't see any of the 1st day but the spinners came on after 10 overs so
> that gives us a clue. Seamers bowled 29 overs.

I saw the first hour and the last 45 minutes or so, taking some time
off to sleep in between. Looked like a very good batting wicket. Both
Sreesanth and RP got a little bit movement early on, but not much
bounce. McKenzie was looking to come forward on every delivery, as a
result of which he was surprised by a couple of bouncers from RP.
Towards the end of that first hour, RP had a couple of deliveries that
kept very low, which Dhoni had to stop on the second bounce.

In the last 45 minutes, Kumble bowled well, varying his pace
intelligently. There was nothing for him or Harbhajan in the pitch,
though. Not much turn and no bounce. I would back RSA to top 500, but
a couple of early wickets can change the outlook.

Not sure what to expect on day 3 or day 4. By day 5, the Chepauk pitch
is often very difficult to bat on. ISTR a number of low fourth innings
scores there over the last decade.

Quote:

> Interested to see how India go in their innings. One never knows

India tends to have a lot of trouble with South Africa, since the RSA
attack is very disciplined in terms of bowling to its field, and the
fielders are very good. Sooner rather than later, the Indian batsmen
lose their patience and play a loose stroke. If RSA gets over 500, I
expect India to struggle to save the follow-on.

by **Rodney Ulyat** » Fri, 28 Mar 2008 14:25:13

Quote:

> Didn't see any of the 1st day but the spinners came on after 10 overs so
> that gives us a clue. Seamers bowled 29 overs.
> I am always skeptical about listening to the bowlers opinions (no matter
> who they are) - when things don't go well for them they tend to link
> their performance to the pitch. When things go well they don't mention
> the pitch much.

Or simply dub it a flat belter. Said Fred Spofforth in 1882 of the
track on which he took four*** for ninety and his side was bowled out
for 63, "[T]he wicket was fairly good, and we did not expect to be got
rid of under 200 runs" -- a testimony with which his team-mates strongly
disagree.

Quote:

> SA really need over 500. Hope they can do it. They have often failed to
> convert from good foundations

Boucher is due for a big score.

<snip>

--
Rodney Ulyate

"The game of cricket played by men of true sport is incomparable."
Sir Neville Cardus

by **tendulkar.co** » Fri, 28 Mar 2008 23:42:59

Quote:

> Didn't see any of the 1st day but the spinners came on after 10 overs so
> that gives us a clue. Seamers bowled 29 overs.

> I am always skeptical about listening to the bowlers opinions (no matter
> who they are) - when things don't go well for them they tend to link
> their performance to the pitch. When things go well they don't mention
> the pitch much.

> SA really need over 500. Hope they can do it. They ?have often failed to
> convert from good foundations

> Interested to see how India go in their innings. One never knows

500 is a recipe for disaster. Any team batting on these pitches should
really aim for 700+. There are plenty of times when teams score 500,
get complacent, throw their wickets away and the next thing they know
they are batting on a fifth day krumbler to save the test match and
they go on to lose it

I'm not saying RSA will be in that position. But, even if you score
500 on this pitch, the opposition can score 700+ easily and suddenly
you are staring at innings defeat. This applies to any test match
between competent teams (Aus, RSA, Eng, Ind, Pak & SLK)

90% of the world pitches behave like Chennai's pitch and scoring 700+
should be the strategy of any test team.

It is a simple strategy and you get Two of the Greatest Bowlers of All
Time automatically added to your team. Mr. Last Day Pitch and Mr.
Scoreboard Pressure

I would kick Amla, McKenzie, Smith and Boucher's ***in that order
for getting out on this pitch.

by S » Sat, 29 Mar 2008 01:11:39

Quote:

>> Didn't see any of the 1st day but the spinners came on after 10 overs so
>> that gives us a clue. Seamers bowled 29 overs.

>> I am always skeptical about listening to the bowlers opinions (no matter
>> who they are) - when things don't go well for them they tend to link
>> their performance to the pitch. When things go well they don't mention
>> the pitch much.

>> SA really need over 500. Hope they can do it. They have often failed to
>> convert from good foundations

>> Interested to see how India go in their innings. One never knows

> 500 is a recipe for disaster. Any team batting on these pitches should
> really aim for 700+. There are plenty of times when teams score 500,
> get complacent, throw their wickets away and the next thing they know
> they are batting on a fifth day krumbler to save the test match and
> they go on to lose it

> I'm not saying RSA will be in that position. But, even if you score
> 500 on this pitch, the opposition can score 700+ easily and suddenly
> you are staring at innings defeat. This applies to any test match
> between competent teams (Aus, RSA, Eng, Ind, Pak & SLK)

> 90% of the world pitches behave like Chennai's pitch and scoring 700+
> should be the strategy of any test team.

> It is a simple strategy and you get Two of the Greatest Bowlers of All
> Time automatically added to your team. Mr. Last Day Pitch and Mr.
> Scoreboard Pressure

> I would kick Amla, McKenzie, Smith and Boucher's ***in that order
> for getting out on this pitch.

Agree with you about McKenzie, Smith, Boucher

Not sure about Amla and whether the run out was his fault. Boucher
advanced a good third of the way down the pitch

by **Suresh K** » Sat, 29 Mar 2008 04:57:01

Quote:

> I saw the first hour and the last 45 minutes or so, taking some time
> off to sleep in between.

Is there a Sop cast or a telecast of the game?

Quote:

> Towards the end of that first hour, RP had a couple of deliveries that
> kept very low, which Dhoni had to stop on the second bounce.

Looks like the pitch rolled out into a batting strip on day 2. A
hopeless wicket for the bowlers.

Quote:

> Not sure what to expect on day 3 or day 4. By day 5, the Chepauk pitch
> is often very difficult to bat on. ISTR a number of low fourth innings
> scores there over the last decade.

True. But it has never been this easy to bat on the first and second
days. The Chepauk of the 70's and 80's is history. But even in the
90's the ball used to bounce on day 1, have some carry and move off
the seam in the first 2/3 hours. This is an awful wicket. I am not
sure that it will crumble on day 5.

Quote:

> > Interested to see how India go in their innings. One never knows

> India tends to have a lot of trouble with South Africa, since the RSA
> attack is very disciplined in terms of bowling to its field, and the
> fielders are very good.

More so than Australia? I didn't get that feeling when I watched them
in their home series a year and half ago. I thought they really did
not bowl to their fields in the first and last tests. Their bowling
was otherwise good and the fielding too was generally good. But I
think Aussies are more disciplined and their bowling-fielding
combination is perhaps the sterner test of the batting side's
discipline.

Quote:

> Sooner rather than later, the Indian batsmen
> lose their patience and play a loose stroke. If RSA gets over 500, I
> expect India to struggle to save the follow-on.

On this wicket, I doubt it. Although it may perhaps start playing
quirky by lat tomorrow, I think its unlikely. This is a plumb wicket
and full of runs. India should be able to get 400 at least. And then
there is the problem of Spin - RSA does not have a high quality
spinner in the team that can exploit the wicket on day 4 afternoon and
beyond.

This wicket is a lot like the Calcutta wicket on which India and
Pakistan amassed runs. Too bad that none of our seamers will get any
help. We were just beginning to develop a decent seam attack.

Suresh K S

by **Andrew Dunfor** » Sat, 29 Mar 2008 07:04:27

Quote:

> Didn't see any of the 1st day but the spinners came on after 10 overs so
> that gives us a clue. Seamers bowled 29 overs.

> I am always skeptical about listening to the bowlers opinions (no matter
> who they are) - when things don't go well for them they tend to link
> their performance to the pitch. When things go well they don't mention
> the pitch much.

> SA really need over 500. Hope they can do it. They have often failed to
> convert from good foundations

> Interested to see how India go in their innings. One never knows
> 500 is a recipe for disaster. Any team batting on these pitches should
> really aim for 700+. There are plenty of times when teams score 500,
> get complacent, throw their wickets away and the next thing they know
> they are batting on a fifth day krumbler to save the test match and
> they go on to lose it

Whilst I don't disagree with your strategy, of the 1869 Test matches played
to date the number of times a team has scored 500+ in its first innings then
gone on to lose is in single figures. In some of those instances (e.g. Aus
v India at Adelaide 2003/04) the losing team didn't bat on the last day.
There is some evidence to back up your theory, but not a great deal.

<snip>

Andrew

by **tendulkar.co** » Sat, 29 Mar 2008 08:43:41

Quote:

> > Didn't see any of the 1st day but the spinners came on after 10 overs so
> > that gives us a clue. Seamers bowled 29 overs.

> > I am always skeptical about listening to the bowlers opinions (no matter
> > who they are) - when things don't go well for them they tend to link
> > their performance to the pitch. When things go well they don't mention
> > the pitch much.

> > SA really need over 500. Hope they can do it. They have often failed to
> > convert from good foundations

> > Interested to see how India go in their innings. One never knows
> > 500 is a recipe for disaster. Any team batting on these pitches should
> > really aim for 700+. There are plenty of times when teams score 500,
> > get complacent, throw their wickets away and the next thing they know
> > they are batting on a fifth day krumbler to save the test match and
> > they go on to lose it

> Whilst I don't disagree with your strategy, of the 1869 Test matches played
> to date the number of times a team has scored 500+ in its first innings then
> gone on to lose is in single figures. ?In some of those instances (e.g. Aus
> v India at Adelaide 2003/04) the losing team didn't bat on the last day.
> There is some evidence to back up your theory, but not a great deal.

> <snip>

> Andrew- Hide quoted text -

> - Show quoted text -

That's only because the other team is also artificially awed by the
500+ number. That is, both teams are being stupid, no different from
teams aiming for 225 in a 50 over game in the 80s. You want to be the
first team to break out of that mentality and gain competitive
advantage.

How many times have you seen a team in the past 15 years that have
scored 400/4 or 300/3 and yet get bowled out for around 500? To me all
those positions are potential 700+ opportunities but thrown away due
to complacency. It works because the opposition is doing the same
mistake. But one day, some team will discover the easiest way to win
test matches, convert those 400/4 or 300/3 positions to 700+. You
don't even need great bowlers to win test matches with this strategy.
Even the Michael Clarke's of this world can pick wickets on a fifth
day wicket and scoreboard pressure.

by **jzfredrick** » Sat, 29 Mar 2008 09:19:40

Quote:

> That's only because the other team is also artificially awed by the
> 500+ number. That is, both teams are being stupid, no different from
> teams aiming for 225 in a 50 over game in the 80s. You want to be the
> first team to break out of that mentality and gain competitive
> advantage.

> How many times have you seen a team in the past 15 years that have
> scored 400/4 or 300/3 and yet get bowled out for around 500? To me all
> those positions are potential 700+ opportunities but thrown away due
> to complacency. It works because the opposition is doing the same
> mistake. But one day, some team will discover the easiest way to win
> test matches, convert those 400/4 or 300/3 positions to 700+. You
> don't even need great bowlers to win test matches with this strategy.
> Even the Michael Clarke's of this world can pick wickets on a fifth
> day wicket and scoreboard pressure.

I just don't buy it, sorry.

I think there are a few simple reasons why teams at 4/400 end up
getting out for not much over 500;

1) 500 runs has proven to be PLENTY enough to win most games, even on
tame pitches.
2) If Team A can score 4/400, chances are Team A thinks the pitch is a
belter
3) You need to leave yourself enough time to bowl a team out twice - a
follow-on is never guaranteed. Due to this they try to pick the
scoring rate up, which leads to wickets.
4) If you can get a 3rd innings lead of 250 runs, more often than not
you win the test.

History shows us that most captains would also disagree with your "go
for 700+" theory. Hasn't India only once scored 700+, in all her
tests? Yet 21 times India has declared their first innings between 500
and 699.

Lastly, I think if you offered 500 runs to ANY captain on the first
innings on ANY pitch, 99.99% of them would take it.

by **Uday Raja** » Sat, 29 Mar 2008 09:20:51

Quote:

> Is there a Sop cast or a telecast of the game?

Zee Sports is showing the game, and willow.tv has a web broadcast of
Zee Sports.

Quote:

> > India tends to have a lot of trouble with South Africa, since the RSA
> > attack is very disciplined in terms of bowling to its field, and the
> > fielders are very good.

> More so than Australia? I didn't get that feeling when I watched them
> in their home series a year and half ago. I thought they really did
> not bowl to their fields in the first and last tests. Their bowling
> was otherwise good and the fielding too was generally good. But I
> think Aussies are more disciplined and their bowling-fielding
> combination is perhaps the sterner test of the batting side's
> discipline.

Just based on my own impressions from the last Ind-RSA series (in RSA)
and the just-concluded series in Aus, I do think India has had more
trouble scoring freely against RSA. Except during that 1-run-an-over
Jaffer-Dravid stand in the Melbourne Test, India generally managed to
keep the board ticking against Australia, with Tendulkar, Laxman,
Ganguly, and of course Sehwag all flowing nicely during different
parts of the series. None of those bats seemed to bat with quite as
much fluency in RSA. I'm glad that Sehwag has already got going; I
think he's the one batsman in the side who can score quickly against
any attack.

Quote:

> On this wicket, I doubt it. Although it may perhaps start playing
> quirky by lat tomorrow, I think its unlikely. This is a plumb wicket
> and full of runs. India should be able to get 400 at least. And then
> there is the problem of Spin - RSA does not have a high quality
> spinner in the team that can exploit the wicket on day 4 afternoon and
> beyond.

I don't think Harris is a top-class spinner myself, but we did let him
bottle us up, taking a few key wickets along the way, in RSA. I hope
we can put up a decent total.

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