Sport Today

        Here's a team of Australian cricketers that Richie Richardson may have
encountered somewhere along the way.

        Andrew Hilditch                                 (1073 runs at 31.55)
        Wayne Norman Phillips           (22 runs at 11)
        Dirk Wellham                                    (257 runs at 23.36)
        Steve Smith                                     (41 runs at 8.20)
        Robbie Kerr                                     (31 runs at 7.75)
        Trevor Chappell                                 (79 runs at 15.8)
        Wayne Bentley Phillips (w/k)    (1485 runs at 32.28, 52 dismissals)
        Peter Taylor                                    (25 wickets at 39.56)
        Peter Sleep                                     (31 wickets at 45.06)
        Chris Matthews                          (6 wickets at 52.16)
        Greg Campbell                           (13 wickets at 38.69)

        Those who missed out include Mike Whitney, Julian Wiener, Graeme Beard,
Grey Dyer, Greg Ritchie, Tom Moody, Ray Bright, Trevor Hohns, Dave
Gilbert, Mike Veletta, Jim Higgs, Steve Rixon, Mick Malone, Tom Hogan,
Steve Davis and David Hookes (in a few cases because some of them were too
good, the rest simply because there isn't enough space). Notice the amount
of rather ineffective spinners.
        Trevor Chappell, due to his integrity and family connections, gets to be
captain. Andrew Hilditch, by sheer weight of runs, is the v/c.

        Eu Hin

greg
--

[all opinions are my own except those which aren't]

:       Here's a team of Australian cricketers that Richie Richardson may have
: encountered somewhere along the way.

:       Andrew Hilditch                                 (1073 runs at 31.55)

Yeah. RR probably thinks he's a great, cause he did OK in 84/5

:       Wayne Norman Phillips           (22 runs at 11)

nope - he never saw this guy

:       Dirk Wellham                                    (257 runs at 23.36)

Probably did see him - though his only test (that I could find) v WI was
before RR's time.

:       Steve Smith                                     (41 runs at 8.20)

definitely played him.

:       Robbie Kerr                                     (31 runs at 7.75)

don't think he played him.

:       Trevor Chappell                                 (79 runs at 15.8)

didn't see Trevor, ever.

:       Wayne Bentley Phillips (w/k)    (1485 runs at 32.28, 52 dismissals)

did see him - quite a lot ca. 83-85

:       Peter Taylor                                    (25 wickets at 39.56)
90-91

:
        Peter Sleep                                     (31 wickets at 45.06)
88/9? Don't think so, but possible.

:       Chris Matthews                          (6 wickets at 52.16)
did he play WI? don't think so.

:       Greg Campbell                           (13 wickets at 38.69)

definitely never played WI.

:      
:       Those who missed out include Mike Whitney, Julian Wiener, Graeme Beard,
: Grey Dyer, Greg Ritchie, Tom Moody, Ray Bright, Trevor Hohns, Dave
: Gilbert, Mike Veletta, Jim Higgs, Steve Rixon, Mick Malone, Tom Hogan,
: Steve Davis and David Hookes (in a few cases because some of them were too
: good, the rest simply because there isn't enough space). Notice the amount
: of rather ineffective spinners.

Most of these guys did play WI, except Graeme Beard (no Tests at all) and
Simon (not Steve) Davis - only one test v NZ.

:       Trevor Chappell, due to his integrity and family connections, gets to be
: captain. Andrew Hilditch, by sheer weight of runs, is the v/c.

Hilditch was once v/c of the Australian team, on the 85 Ashes tour, and
immediately following.

Cheers, Josh

--
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*Volvo - it's Swedish for "asleep at the wheel"                               *
*IRCnick: rogan                                                         *
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: :     Andrew Hilditch                                 (1073 runs at 31.55)

: Yeah. RR probably thinks he's a great, cause he did OK in 84/5
[...deleted...]

: Cheers, Josh

-------
Let's not stop this at mere sarcasm. One -- you are either implying that
Richardson does'nt know to evaluate the strength of opponents as well as
(many) people on this newsgroup do,

or

Two, you are implying that he was LYING when he said that this Aussie
team was the weakest he had played against.

I don't think I'll bother commenting about One, and about Two, after a
shock loss, I don't think Richardson would've cared enough to cook up
some stories about his opponents' weaknesses.

Also, with the series being decided and all that, I should mention that
I don't think this Australian team will send shudders down anybody's
spine, even with McDermott in it's ranks. Is it such a great surprise
that a prominent member of a team that has'nt known defeat in a test
series for the last decade-and-a-half does'nt exactly sing it's praises?

Win or lose, forever Windies.
Venky (Venkatesh Sridharan).

: : Let's not stop this at mere sarcasm. One -- you are either implying that
: : Richardson does'nt know to evaluate the strength of opponents as well as
: : (many) people on this newsgroup do,

: I think he forgets too easily. The 95 side ahs every batsman averaging in
: the 40's. Out of the 84 side(s) everyone except Border finsihed with an
: average in the 30's. (Boon and Jones did play a couple of tests around
: that time against WI - but they haven't finished yet). I don't know how
: much plainer I can make it. THE 1984 AUSTRALIAN TEAM WAS CRAP. THIS TEAM
: IS BETTER.

-------
The *only* team that was probably clearly weaker than this one was the one
that got thrashed in 1984. Still, it's very possible that Richie thought
that one was "better"... though I'm sure you, with all the powerhouse
information you have, (averages) don't agree.
-------

: I would think it was a function of Richie lacking respect for his
: oppostition, especially guys like Slater and McGrath who he has never
: even seen before.

-------
Well, if he *really* did'nt think McGrath and Slater were'nt that great,
what's the big deal? You don't hold back when you think Williams is no
good, do you?
-------

: I think it was a throwaway line, but one that he should be ashamed of. If
: he REALLY thought this, why didn't he say it DURING the series, then go
: out and prove it by beating us?

-------
Okay, I have no arguments against this one.
-------

: : shock loss, I don't think Richardson would've cared enough to cook up
: : some stories about his opponents' weaknesses.

: I have no idea what RR would have cared about. Not self respect obviously.

-------
Nor about how (bad) the Aussies would feel when he said what he did,
obviously.

About the "self respect" bit -- I'm sure Richie has enough, and is dying
to prove that to you.
-------

: Well no. It won't send shudders down many batsmen's spine, because we
: have no fast bowler who threatens to remove your head. Our bowlers bowl
: to get the guy out, not to scare the opposition. As with our batsmen, who
: play for runs, rather than "intimidate" with their "presence". If you
: think that makes a "weak" cricket team, well you're in the wrong game.

-------
Regardless of your glib comments, this Australian team is no great one.
Great teams have great bowling attacks (invariably), and this one has
McGrath, Julian, Reifell and Warne. Enough said.
-------

: As to the last bit, is that meant as an excuse? ie. a person who has
: never lost has every right to be an ungracious shit when they do
: eventually lose?

-------
Rubbish, I never meant it as an excuse. But you seem to be *demanding*
that Richardson respect this Australian team while glossing over the fact
that Australians have been less than sporting in the past -- this is not
meant to be an excuse either, I don't see why I should make excuses. Look

were Richie's comments any less sporting *in spirit* ??

I (personally) think Richie could (and SHOULD) have kept his comments to
himself, but if he does'nt respect a particular opponent, then him saying
that aloud is no big deal.

Win or lose, forever Windies.
Venky (Venkatesh Sridharan).

: : :   Andrew Hilditch                                 (1073 runs at 31.55)

: : Yeah. RR probably thinks he's a great, cause he did OK in 84/5
: [...deleted...]

: : Cheers, Josh

: -------
: Let's not stop this at mere sarcasm. One -- you are either implying that
: Richardson does'nt know to evaluate the strength of opponents as well as
: (many) people on this newsgroup do,

I think he forgets too easily. The 95 side ahs every batsman averaging in
the 40's. Out of the 84 side(s) everyone except Border finsihed with an
average in the 30's. (Boon and Jones did play a couple of tests around
that time against WI - but they haven't finished yet). I don't know how
much plainer I can make it. THE 1984 AUSTRALIAN TEAM WAS CRAP. THIS TEAM
IS BETTER.

I would think it was a function of Richie lacking respect for his
oppostition, especially guys like Slater and McGrath who he has never
even seen before.

I think it was a throwaway line, but one that he should be ashamed of. If
he REALLY thought this, why didn't he say it DURING the series, then go
out and prove it by beating us?

: Two, you are implying that he was LYING when he said that this Aussie
: team was the weakest he had played against.

Rubbish.

: I don't think I'll bother commenting about One, and about Two, after a
: shock loss, I don't think Richardson would've cared enough to cook up
: some stories about his opponents' weaknesses.

I have no idea what RR would have cared about. Not self respect obviously.

: Also, with the series being decided and all that, I should mention that
: I don't think this Australian team will send shudders down anybody's
: spine, even with McDermott in it's ranks. Is it such a great surprise
: that a prominent member of a team that has'nt known defeat in a test
: series for the last decade-and-a-half does'nt exactly sing it's praises?

Well no. It won't send shudders down many batsmen's spine, because we
have no fast bowler who threatens to remove your head. Our bowlers bowl
to get the guy out, not to scare the opposition. As with our batsmen, who
play for runs, rather than "intimidate" with their "presence". If you
think that makes a "weak" cricket team, well you're in the wrong game.

As to the last bit, is that meant as an excuse? ie. a person who has
never lost has every right to be an ungracious shit when they do
eventually lose?

Cheers, Josh

--
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*"Josh, you are a pissant" - Tim Boden-Library                        *
*IRCnick: rogan                                                         *
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The Windies and RR have been very gracious in victory. To use this very mild
comment to detract from their sportsmanship in not waranted.

I will also accept that the present Aussie side has a much more solid batting
line-up than the 84 side. But looking at the bowling on paper, for the little its
worth, this has to be a very weak attack. It was this very bowling, not the batting,
that won the series for the Australians. For that, RR can rightfully feel that the
Windies underperformed.

Finally, this comment cannot be considered in the same context as the underarm
delivery. Now that was unsporting!

Hoping to douse, but no doubt only inflaming, this topic

Kurt

---
These views are mine, I tell you... mine, all mine!

If the others do great things, they are "greats." It depends on
accomplishment, not paper or opinion.

Graeme

Regards,
Raja J.

: Warne is already a great.

-------
Yup. I guess he gave Walsh and Ambrose a torrid time at the crease all
through the series, and, despite his knockers, ran through Bermuda (all
the tailend wickets, perhaps? :-)
-------

: If the others do great things, they are "greats." It depends on
: accomplishment, not paper or opinion.

-------
True. And if they don't, they're not. I'm getting the hang of this...

: Graeme

Win or lose, forever Windies.
Venky (Venkatesh Sridharan).

In any case there's more to the Hilditch story than mere statistics.  
Bowlers from other countries soon discovered that he was the world's worst
***, so towards the end of his career he was continually sucked into
hooking and continually got caught out for piddling scores.

Rob

        Michael.
--
Michael Jennings
Department of Applied Mathematics and Theoretical Physics

All wars are civil wars, because all men are brothers ... Each one owes
infinitely more to the human race than to the particular country in
which he was born.
                -- Francois Fenelon