Combine Ryder & President's Cup

Combine Ryder & President's Cup

Post by bruce_d_woo » Fri, 18 Dec 1998 04:00:00


I read that Jack Nicklaus thought a combination of the
President's Cup & the Ryder Cup would be a good idea.

Sounds like it would be good for golf (fan interest, TV
ratings everywhere...).  Perhaps it would be possible to
play threeway matches per the following format:

three best ball matches against the other 2 squads -
EEUU (3 foursomes), EEII " , UUII "  (all 12 players
on each squad would play)

three combined score team matches against the other two
[same setup]

eigh*** match play twosomes
EU (6 pairs), EI (6 pairs), UI (6 pairs)

Hold the combined event every two years.

Since The Ryder Cup has the history & prestige let the
winning team hold the Ryder Cup.

The ladies could do the same for the Solheim Cup...

[And, pay the players 1st, 2nd & 3rd place money.]

BDW

 
 
 

Combine Ryder & President's Cup

Post by Robert Hamilto » Fri, 18 Dec 1998 04:00:00

The problem is the idea of the US vs Europe vs the rest of the world.
There is a lot to the rest of the world! The President's Cup team was a
great team, with "unkowns" like Turner! Who else can put together Price,
Elkington, Norman and Els, who you know are going to gind it out in any
event? The "rest of the world" is only going to get better, whereas
Europe and the US are near as good as they are going to get. I am also
not a big fan of nationalism, as it promotes hatred and political
extremism. Something like the world golf championship type idea would
probably work better. The match play championship was great! Golf will
become more international, and the better players will only play in top
events, and reward, ie cash AND exposure, will be the principle
determinant for event quality. Consider the adverizing value of a golfer
respected throughout the world vs one only known in the US. It is about
time US golfers came to realize that the US tour does not have the best
golfers. US players have it pretty good compared to the rest of the
world. They play all events in one country on a tour contrived to make
conditions as optimal as possible. How well do US tour players do when
they compete regularly on other tours? Not much better (or not as good
as?) non-US players on the US
tour..Faldo...Ballesteros...Elkington.....Els....Price...Norman...Aoki...Parnevik?
Each from a different country.....there's a lot to the rest of the
world!

Rob.

Quote:

> I read that Jack Nicklaus thought a combination of the
> President's Cup & the Ryder Cup would be a good idea.

> Sounds like it would be good for golf (fan interest, TV
> ratings everywhere...).  Perhaps it would be possible to
> play threeway matches per the following format:

> three best ball matches against the other 2 squads -
> EEUU (3 foursomes), EEII " , UUII "  (all 12 players
> on each squad would play)

> three combined score team matches against the other two
> [same setup]

> eigh*** match play twosomes
> EU (6 pairs), EI (6 pairs), UI (6 pairs)

> Hold the combined event every two years.

> Since The Ryder Cup has the history & prestige let the
> winning team hold the Ryder Cup.

> The ladies could do the same for the Solheim Cup...

> [And, pay the players 1st, 2nd & 3rd place money.]

> BDW

--
http://SportToday.org/~rhamilto

 
 
 

Combine Ryder & President's Cup

Post by \ » Fri, 18 Dec 1998 04:00:00

Ain't gonna happen.  The PGA of America runs the Ryder Cup, and the PGA TOUR
runs the Presidents Cup.  The two organizations aren't affiliated.

In a recent article (I forget where I read it), players were asked their
opinions on the idea of a three-way competition -- America vs. Europe (Ryder
Cup), America vs. International non-Europe (Presidents Cup), and Europe vs.
International non-Europe (proposed-cup).

The idea was met with luke warm response.

Personally, I like the idea, but where should it stop?

Sooner or later the twelve golfers in Greenland and Antarctica are gonna
want to get in.

Randy

Quote:

>I read that Jack Nicklaus thought a combination of the
>President's Cup & the Ryder Cup would be a good idea.

>Sounds like it would be good for golf (fan interest, TV
>ratings everywhere...).  Perhaps it would be possible to
>play threeway matches per the following format:

>three best ball matches against the other 2 squads -
>EEUU (3 foursomes), EEII " , UUII "  (all 12 players
>on each squad would play)

>three combined score team matches against the other two
>[same setup]

>eigh*** match play twosomes
>EU (6 pairs), EI (6 pairs), UI (6 pairs)

>Hold the combined event every two years.

>Since The Ryder Cup has the history & prestige let the
>winning team hold the Ryder Cup.

>The ladies could do the same for the Solheim Cup...

>[And, pay the players 1st, 2nd & 3rd place money.]

>BDW


 
 
 

Combine Ryder & President's Cup

Post by Joe Cartpat » Sat, 19 Dec 1998 04:00:00

It'll never happen.
Tradition................................................................
Quote:

>I read that Jack Nicklaus thought a combination of the
>President's Cup & the Ryder Cup would be a good idea.

>Sounds like it would be good for golf (fan interest, TV
>ratings everywhere...).  Perhaps it would be possible to
>play threeway matches per the following format:

>three best ball matches against the other 2 squads -
>EEUU (3 foursomes), EEII " , UUII "  (all 12 players
>on each squad would play)

>three combined score team matches against the other two
>[same setup]

>eigh*** match play twosomes
>EU (6 pairs), EI (6 pairs), UI (6 pairs)

>Hold the combined event every two years.

>Since The Ryder Cup has the history & prestige let the
>winning team hold the Ryder Cup.

>The ladies could do the same for the Solheim Cup...

>[And, pay the players 1st, 2nd & 3rd place money.]

>BDW

 
 
 

Combine Ryder & President's Cup

Post by Colin Wilso » Sat, 19 Dec 1998 04:00:00

Quote:

> Sooner or later the twelve golfers in Greenland and Antarctica are
> gonna want to get in.

BTW, did you see any articles in the media about the ice golf
championships in Greenland? We had a few media snippets here in Oz a
week or so ago. Apparently they spray the ice red/pink for greens
(unsure why they don't spray them green ... red must give better
visibility).

It sounded much more serious than you think ;-)

Cheers
Colin Wilson
Trentham Golf Club
http://publishing.kyneton.net.au/trentham

 
 
 

Combine Ryder & President's Cup

Post by Mark the Bla » Tue, 22 Dec 1998 04:00:00



Quote:
>I read that Jack Nicklaus thought a combination of the
>President's Cup & the Ryder Cup would be a good idea.

Its a good idea, but perhaps Jack didnt mean what you are thinking.
Including the International team into the Ryder cup would just be not
on, the reasons are obvious - the RC is simply a two team competition.
To let another team in would be making a mockery of it, and reduce the
value of the whole thing.

What is a good idea though, is the establishment of a third
inter-region cup, The Internationals v. Europe.    In fact if they did
do this they could play each Cup once every three years, meaning that
each side would play two cups every three years.    

Given the success of the international side thus far,  the total
points combined in three cups being exactly even with the US, it is
only a matter of time before an event along the lines of above will be
played, within the next 10 years.  

The only thing however, is will the absence of the US team result in
less support from the corporate dollar?   Because its obvious the US
is where most of the money is, and if they aint playing, hardly anyone
in USA will be watching.  This on its one may be the solitary factor
in deciding whether this third cup will ever get on the map.

Fore Right!,
           Mark

Fairway: [faer-wai] "An unfamiliar tract of mown grass running directly from tee to the green. Your ball can usually be found immediately to the left or right of it."

 
 
 

Combine Ryder & President's Cup

Post by dave_elli » Tue, 22 Dec 1998 04:00:00

Quote:

> What is a good idea though, is the establishment of a third
> inter-region cup, The Internationals v. Europe.    In fact if they did
> do this they could play each Cup once every three years, meaning that
> each side would play two cups every three years.

Something along this line would be interesting.

D.E.

 
 
 

Combine Ryder & President's Cup

Post by bret » Wed, 23 Dec 1998 04:00:00

to tell you the truth i'd much rather have a 3 way duel
every 2 years. make it over a week instead of 3 days.
play a couple of days of round robin under the existing
format of best ball, foursomes and singles. then have
the best two teams advance for 3 days of head to head
exactly as it is now. i think there would be a great
deal more interest in something like this plus the fact
that as it is the americans play every year which must
get a little frustrating for the players.

brett


Quote:

>> What is a good idea though, is the establishment of
a third
>> inter-region cup, The Internationals v. Europe.
In fact if they did
>> do this they could play each Cup once every three
years, meaning that
>> each side would play two cups every three years.

>Something along this line would be interesting.

>D.E.

 
 
 

Combine Ryder & President's Cup

Post by Andy Stewar » Thu, 24 Dec 1998 04:00:00

Interesting thought. Being a golfer from Scotland, I am naturally aware of
the history of golf and the history of the Ryder Cup. One of the great
things about golf is it's evolution over the centuries. I would feel it a
great shame if the Ryder Cup, and all it stood for, was compromised to
"subsidise" an inferior event. It may be unfair to call the presidents cup
inferior, but I did not detect the same enthusiasm among the crowd as for
the Ryder Cup (Remember Kiawah Island) but maybe that's because I do not
have "team" in the Presidents Cup.

Before anyone points out the format of the Ryder Cup had to be changed
already to include Europe, I would say that this was a natural extension.
Remember that there are only about 55 million people in the UK and about 48
million of these are English !!!!
--
Andy Stewart, Dundee, Scotland.
When replying - remove bb from my Email Address

 
 
 

Combine Ryder & President's Cup

Post by Medullo » Thu, 24 Dec 1998 04:00:00

Quote:
>Interesting thought. Being a golfer from Scotland, I am naturally aware of
>the history of golf and the history of the Ryder Cup. One of the great
>things about golf is it's evolution over the centuries. I would feel it a
>great shame if the Ryder Cup, and all it stood for, was compromised to
>"subsidise" an inferior event

No doubt that the international team in the president's cup was superior to the
european team in the ryder cup. Look at the score! The competition with the
better players will get the most attention. Europe cannot hope to field a team
as good as the "rest of the world".

Rob

 
 
 

Combine Ryder & President's Cup

Post by dave_elli » Thu, 24 Dec 1998 04:00:00

Europe cannot hope to field a team

Quote:
> as good as the "rest of the world".

If by the rest of the world, you mean the group that played the US in
the president's cup, I think it would be a fair match.

D.E.

 
 
 

Combine Ryder & President's Cup

Post by bret » Fri, 25 Dec 1998 04:00:00


Quote:
>I would feel it a
>great shame if the Ryder Cup, and all it stood for,
was compromised to
>"subsidise" an inferior event. It may be unfair to

call the presidents cup
Quote:
>inferior, but I did not detect the same enthusiasm

among the crowd as for
Quote:
>the Ryder Cup (Remember Kiawah Island) but maybe

that's because I do not

Quote:
>have "team" in the Presidents Cup.

so basically because the very large crowd on hand was
well behaved during the presidents cup, it is an
inferior event.

the players have complained about crowds during the
last 2 ryder cups with good reason. they however all
seemed to think that it was great playing in front of
people who appreciated the golf being played in the
presidents cup rather than the parochial following they
may have been expecting.

as for tradition and the ryder cup - the ryder cup was
originally only the british isles. it has been extended
to cover all of europe which you call a "natural"
extension, i'm not sure i follow the logic in that
statement. but using the same logic why not extend it
to cover the rest of the world??

brett

 
 
 

Combine Ryder & President's Cup

Post by Andy Stewar » Fri, 25 Dec 1998 04:00:00

I am sorry you misinterpreted my comments and I apologise if that it was
due to my diction. The size of the crowd, which relates more to venue
capacity and geography was not the measure I was using. In (very) short -
do the Americans get more e***d about the thought of playing the
Europeans, the Rest of the World (ROW) or both/neither ??

Secondly, and this is going to offend some, I think that it is obnoxious
for Americans to assume that each "World" team event should be reduced to
US vs. ROW games. This is the same mentality that allows only US teams to
compete in the World Series of baseball.

Lastly, I do agree that there have been problems with the last two Ryder
Cups. The last one was held in Spain for the first time and the crowds
behaviour can be put down to naivety (this time) and the pervious one was
held at a venue (if I remember correctly) where problems have been reported
for tour events (beer swilling philistines). Ask any pro why the love
playing the Open in Scotland and they will tell you it's because the crowds
are so knowledgeable and fair. Remember that no US player playing in Europe
has had to endure what Monty and Ian Woosnam have had to endure in the US.
I am not saying that they would be my choice of playing partners but they
did not deserve that.

If I have failed to insult anyone in the world, I apologise :-)

I would like to wish everyone a happy and prosperous '99 - especially on
the links !!

Quote:
> >I would feel it a
> >great shame if the Ryder Cup, and all it stood for,
> was compromised to
> >"subsidise" an inferior event. It may be unfair to
> call the presidents cup
> >inferior, but I did not detect the same enthusiasm
> among the crowd as for
> >the Ryder Cup (Remember Kiawah Island) but maybe
> that's because I do not
> >have "team" in the Presidents Cup.

> so basically because the very large crowd on hand was
> well behaved during the presidents cup, it is an
> inferior event.

> the players have complained about crowds during the
> last 2 ryder cups with good reason. they however all
> seemed to think that it was great playing in front of
> people who appreciated the golf being played in the
> presidents cup rather than the parochial following they
> may have been expecting.

> as for tradition and the ryder cup - the ryder cup was
> originally only the british isles. it has been extended
> to cover all of europe which you call a "natural"
> extension, i'm not sure i follow the logic in that
> statement. but using the same logic why not extend it
> to cover the rest of the world??

> brett