Honma Clubs Why don't more pro's play them?

Honma Clubs Why don't more pro's play them?

Post by Gloria & Larr » Fri, 08 Aug 2003 13:04:06


I have read and heard that they are the finest clubs in the world. So why
doesn't any of the top Pros play them? I did hear Tiger Woods has a set so
the Pros must recognize the quality of these clubs.  I understand
endor***ts play a major part of what most pros play but why doesn't at
least one of them on tour use the Honma's?

I saw a used set on "sale" for $1,600.
Larry

 
 
 

Honma Clubs Why don't more pro's play them?

Post by Stik » Fri, 08 Aug 2003 14:54:59



Quote:
> I have read and heard that they are the finest clubs in the world. So why
> doesn't any of the top Pros play them? I did hear Tiger Woods has a set so
> the Pros must recognize the quality of these clubs.  I understand
> endor***ts play a major part of what most pros play but why doesn't at
> least one of them on tour use the Honma's?

> I saw a used set on "sale" for $1,600.
> Larry

I think the $1600 set must be the lower end of Honma irons.

I like the look of Honma blades (although I've never played with them),
and the smaller iron heads.  But I really don't think they are worth
over USD10,000 (some are gold plated).  LOL!
Also, I think they are built for smaller Asian physique -- which is great
for petit women.

Due to the US/Japanese exchange rate (and higher cost of living in Japan),
anything Japanese seem more expensive (for value).

I own a Honma driver, but I personally think they are inferior to the
US brands (e.g. Callaway and Titleist) -- and switched back to
Callaway VFT several years ago.  It just did not feel as responsive.
(My Honma is for sale in SF Area).

Stik

www.wired.bz/stik

 
 
 

Honma Clubs Why don't more pro's play them?

Post by Falchoo » Fri, 08 Aug 2003 23:11:03


Quote:


> > I have read and heard that they are the finest clubs in the world. So
why
> > doesn't any of the top Pros play them? I did hear Tiger Woods has a set
so
> > the Pros must recognize the quality of these clubs.  I understand
> > endor***ts play a major part of what most pros play but why doesn't at
> > least one of them on tour use the Honma's?

> > I saw a used set on "sale" for $1,600.
> > Larry

> I think the $1600 set must be the lower end of Honma irons.

> I like the look of Honma blades (although I've never played with them),
> and the smaller iron heads.  But I really don't think they are worth
> over USD10,000 (some are gold plated).  LOL!
> Also, I think they are built for smaller Asian physique -- which is great
> for petit women.

> Due to the US/Japanese exchange rate (and higher cost of living in Japan),
> anything Japanese seem more expensive (for value).

> I own a Honma driver, but I personally think they are inferior to the
> US brands (e.g. Callaway and Titleist) -- and switched back to
> Callaway VFT several years ago.  It just did not feel as responsive.
> (My Honma is for sale in SF Area).

> Stik

> www.wired.bz/stik

are they the clubs I saw in Singapore going for AU$20,000 a set??

 
 
 

Honma Clubs Why don't more pro's play them?

Post by jeff » Fri, 08 Aug 2003 22:42:14



Quote:
> I have read and heard that they are the finest clubs in the world.

"Finest"?  I wonder what that means exactly.  Sounds like marketing for a
niche product that is merely extremely expensive.

Quote:
> So why doesn't any of the top Pros play them?

Maybe they're not that great?  Or maybe the company doesn't have the clout
that Titleist or TaylorMade or Ping have in terms of endor***t dollars.

Quote:
> I did hear Tiger Woods has a set so the Pros must recognize the quality of

these clubs.

You "heard" it?  Even assuming that's true, you have no idea how he came to
have them, so why on earth would you conclude "the Pros must recognize the
quality of these clubs."?  He certainly doesn't play those clubs in
competition.

 
 
 

Honma Clubs Why don't more pro's play them?

Post by Bear » Fri, 08 Aug 2003 23:06:18



Quote:
>I have read and heard that they are the finest clubs in the world. So why
>doesn't any of the top Pros play them? I did hear Tiger Woods has a set so
>the Pros must recognize the quality of these clubs.  I understand
>endor***ts play a major part of what most pros play but why doesn't at
>least one of them on tour use the Honma's?

I caddied at a Canadian Tour event for a pro from Hawaii who played
with a set of Honma's. He missed the cut by a stroke and I have seen
or heard about him since.

They are made for people with more money than brains. They will not
hit the ball any better than any other make of clubs.

Quote:

>I saw a used set on "sale" for $1,600.
>Larry

Rod
 
 
 

Honma Clubs Why don't more pro's play them?

Post by DJD » Sat, 09 Aug 2003 00:20:42

Quote:

> I have read and heard that they are the finest clubs in the world.

<snipped>

Just because you heard it doesn't make it true.

--
Dan Driscoll
Member - NCGA
RSG FAQ: http://ttsoft.com/thor/rsggolf.html
RSG Roll Call http://rec-sport-golf.com/members/?rollcall=driscolld

 
 
 

Honma Clubs Why don't more pro's play them?

Post by Bill The Newbi » Sat, 09 Aug 2003 00:45:37

Quote:

> "Finest"?  I wonder what that means exactly.  Sounds like marketing for a
> niche product that is merely extremely expensive.

> > So why doesn't any of the top Pros play them?

> Maybe they're not that great?  Or maybe the company doesn't have the clout
> that Titleist or TaylorMade or Ping have in terms of endor***t dollars.

> > I did hear Tiger Woods has a set so the Pros must recognize the quality
of
> these clubs.

> You "heard" it?  Even assuming that's true, you have no idea how he came
to
> have them, so why on earth would you conclude "the Pros must recognize the
> quality of these clubs."?  He certainly doesn't play those clubs in
> competition.

I heard once (and I'm straining to remember) that there is a theory in
economics regarding certain expensive items. There is a small percentage of
the very rich who will buy something, however trivial, simply because it's
the most expensive version or item out there. Someone did a  thesis on it or
published something... I'm trying to remember the story, it was on
NPR...about it and it's driving me nuts not being able to remember. Any
economics geniuses who can recall what I'm thinking of? Maybe I'm not just
remembering all the salient points.

-bill
You must remove MYPANTS to email

 
 
 

Honma Clubs Why don't more pro's play them?

Post by Kenny Stul » Sat, 09 Aug 2003 02:07:27


Quote:

>I have read and heard that they are the finest clubs in the world. So why
>doesn't any of the top Pros play them? I did hear Tiger Woods has a set so
>the Pros must recognize the quality of these clubs.  I understand
>endor***ts play a major part of what most pros play but why doesn't at
>least one of them on tour use the Honma's?

>I saw a used set on "sale" for $1,600.
>Larry

Must have been ***s.  The last set of Honma irons I saw in a store were
something like 16 grand.

What you've heard is advertising and hype.  If Honma clubs were so superior to
other clubs, the pro's would use them.  The fact that they don't should tell
you something.

Kenny

--
Kenny Stultz - Troll and SPAM intolerant
RSG Rollcall: http://SportToday.org/
"Golf is the only sport where a precise knowledge of the Rules can
earn one a reputation for bad sportsmanship"

 
 
 

Honma Clubs Why don't more pro's play them?

Post by <jeffkn.. » Sat, 09 Aug 2003 02:52:01

here's what i found...
http://SportToday.org/
jk


Quote:

> >I have read and heard that they are the finest clubs in the world. So why
> >doesn't any of the top Pros play them? I did hear Tiger Woods has a set
so
> >the Pros must recognize the quality of these clubs.  I understand
> >endor***ts play a major part of what most pros play but why doesn't at
> >least one of them on tour use the Honma's?

> >I saw a used set on "sale" for $1,600.
> >Larry

> Must have been ***s.  The last set of Honma irons I saw in a store
were
> something like 16 grand.

> What you've heard is advertising and hype.  If Honma clubs were so
superior to
> other clubs, the pro's would use them.  The fact that they don't should
tell
> you something.

> Kenny

> --
> Kenny Stultz - Troll and SPAM intolerant
> RSG Rollcall: http://SportToday.org/
> "Golf is the only sport where a precise knowledge of the Rules can
> earn one a reputation for bad sportsmanship"

 
 
 

Honma Clubs Why don't more pro's play them?

Post by Bryan S. Slic » Sat, 09 Aug 2003 06:00:29

[Bill The Newbie]
[Thu, 07 Aug 2003 15:45:37 GMT]

:I heard once (and I'm straining to remember) that there is a theory in
:economics regarding certain expensive items. There is a small percentage of
:the very rich who will buy something, however trivial, simply because it's
:the most expensive version or item out there. Someone did a  thesis on it or
:published something... I'm trying to remember the story, it was on
:NPR...about it and it's driving me nuts not being able to remember. Any
:economics geniuses who can recall what I'm thinking of? Maybe I'm not just
:remembering all the salient points.

It's not just the rich that do this sort of thing.  Witness Tommy
Hilfiger t-shirts for $50+ a pop.. for basically.. a T-SHIRT.. with a
logo on it.  Ralph Lauren does the same stuff.  And they sell.  Why?  
People trying to out-cool each other by what they have.  Look-at-what-I-
got-I-rule-you-suck.  It's sad.. but it's common.

--
Bryan S. Slick, bryan_s at slick-family dot net

"To those who have fought for it,
 freedom has a flavor the protected will never know."

 
 
 

Honma Clubs Why don't more pro's play them?

Post by Perfect Impac » Sat, 09 Aug 2003 09:44:55



Quote:
> [Bill The Newbie]
> [Thu, 07 Aug 2003 15:45:37 GMT]

> :I heard once (and I'm straining to remember) that there is a theory in
> :economics regarding certain expensive items. There is a small percentage
of
> :the very rich who will buy something, however trivial, simply because
it's
> :the most expensive version or item out there. Someone did a  thesis on it
or
> :published something... I'm trying to remember the story, it was on
> :NPR...about it and it's driving me nuts not being able to remember. Any
> :economics geniuses who can recall what I'm thinking of? Maybe I'm not
just
> :remembering all the salient points.

> It's not just the rich that do this sort of thing.  Witness Tommy
> Hilfiger t-shirts for $50+ a pop.. for basically.. a T-SHIRT.. with a
> logo on it.  Ralph Lauren does the same stuff.  And they sell.  Why?
> People trying to out-cool each other by what they have.  Look-at-what-I-
> got-I-rule-you-suck.  It's sad.. but it's common.

> --
> Bryan S. Slick, bryan_s at slick-family dot net

> "To those who have fought for it,
>  freedom has a flavor the protected will never know."

there is no question that the price a seller places on something gives the
message 'this is VALUABLE!' and there are people who will not 'settle' for
less than 'the most valuable' and for them price is no object.

in a recent inquiry at a sales model, we overheard a woman remark to the
agent about lots starting at $250 K, "O good, i wouldn't want to live where
they were less than $250k."

Would you buy great perfume if it came in a drug store bottle for $10   or
would you much more likely buy the same thing for $250 in a fancy designer
styled bottle and fance box?  The latter, and that is human nature: to TAKE
THE SELLER'S WORD FOR THE VALUE.  and some people want quality, not economy,
and use price to establish it in the absence of anything else.

it is anything but a secret in the industry.  Have you tried to buy a
Harley, or a Rolls, or a.... and on and on.  it doesnt cost that much to
make the product... but high price is a symbol which is the essence.

Lots in HH Island sometimes go for $10M     -- price is not the object - the
perception of exclusivity drives many.

 
 
 

Honma Clubs Why don't more pro's play them?

Post by Bill The Newbi » Sun, 10 Aug 2003 02:19:24

<snip>

Quote:
> > It's not just the rich that do this sort of thing.  Witness Tommy
> > Hilfiger t-shirts for $50+ a pop.. for basically.. a T-SHIRT.. with a
> > logo on it.  Ralph Lauren does the same stuff.  And they sell.  Why?
> > People trying to out-cool each other by what they have.  Look-at-what-I-
> > got-I-rule-you-suck.  It's sad.. but it's common.

I agree up to a certain point, but what *I* was talking about was an extreme
case - where someone has what is easily a market value item, say, a tennis
bracelet, for $2K. But if they sell it for 2 million, there ARE people who
will buy it, simply because it costs that much.

Quote:
> Would you buy great perfume if it came in a drug store bottle for $10   or
> would you much more likely buy the same thing for $250 in a fancy designer
> styled bottle and fance box?  The latter, and that is human nature: to
TAKE
> THE SELLER'S WORD FOR THE VALUE.  and some people want quality, not
economy,
> and use price to establish it in the absence of anything else.

> it is anything but a secret in the industry.  Have you tried to buy a
> Harley, or a Rolls, or a.... and on and on.  it doesnt cost that much to
> make the product... but high price is a symbol which is the essence.

> Lots in HH Island sometimes go for $10M     -- price is not the object -
the
> perception of exclusivity drives many.

I think that has a lot to do with what I mentioned initially. I can't
imagine the cost of goods on these horribly expensive clubs to require such
a profound markup, and yet they seem to sell. I mentioned these clubs to a
friend last night, and his reply was "The sum total value of every club
Tiger has ever owned probably does not equal $16k."

Maybe I oughta make a few clubs a year, tout them as incredibly rare, get
one or two pros to be photographed swinging them, and then try and sell them
for $10K a set and see what happens. Even chances, I think.

-b

 
 
 

Honma Clubs Why don't more pro's play them?

Post by fivei.. » Sun, 10 Aug 2003 02:50:43

selling prices based on replacement cost - is history. selling prices
to-day, are based on "perceived value".

there are clubs, and there are clubs. the buying of clubs, is no
different from any other purchase, and should be made at the discretion
of the buyer, based on; do I like it, and do I have the purchasing power
to obtain it.

It's that simple, allow for errors, very few purchases are totally
satisfying.

"do you have a room full of discarded items - bought for price - alone?"

If you are strapped for cash, look for bargains, do the best you can,
enjoy what you have, and can afford.

?m h o
??v?e

?????????

 
 
 

Honma Clubs Why don't more pro's play them?

Post by Bill The Newbi » Sun, 10 Aug 2003 03:26:38

Quote:
>selling prices based on replacement cost - is history. selling prices
>to-day, are based on "perceived value".

I assuming you're making this blanket statement referring to golf equipment,
when in fact, MANY industries do not base sales prices on "perceived value."
Careful there, okay?

Quote:
>there are clubs, and there are clubs. the buying of clubs, is no
>different from any other purchase, and should be made at the discretion
>of the buyer, based on; do I like it, and do I have the purchasing power
>to obtain it.

I think you're oversimplifying it, as you seem to on several other threads.
I cannot claim great knowledge of golf yet, so you may very well know quite
a bit more than I. However,  I have seen theone-line, blanket-statement
posts seem to be your forte' of late, and I believe that you tend to weaken
your own credibility in this forum with short, smug postings written as
chapter and verse, with little to no room for interpretation or supporting
information.

Quote:
>It's that simple, allow for errors, very few purchases are totally
>satisfying.

With all due respect, you are not in the mind or shoes of other consumers,
and I don't think you can make that statement for everyone. It is just as
accurate to say that MOST purchases are totally satisfying for people.

Both statements are foolish.

Quote:
>"do you have a room full of discarded items - bought for price - alone?"

No, I do not. But then again, I don't have the means to do that, either. And
if I had the means, there's no telling what sort of bizarre psychosis I
would succumb to from being able to roll around *** in my money every day.
That's not the point. I entered into this thread to find out if anyone else
could remember the economic piece I was talking about, and to date, no one
has confirmed.

Quote:
>If you are strapped for cash, look for bargains, do the best you can,
>enjoy what you have, and can afford.

Gee, thanks. That never occurred to me at all.

-b

 
 
 

Honma Clubs Why don't more pro's play them?

Post by Asbj?rn Bj?rnst » Wed, 27 Aug 2003 18:23:19

Quote:

> I caddied at a Canadian Tour event for a pro from Hawaii who played
> with a set of Honma's. He missed the cut by a stroke and I have seen
> or heard about him since.

As long as we're talking anecdotes: The chinese pro that beat Ernie
Els in the Caltex open (Singapore) this year was using Honma clubs.

Quote:
> They are made for people with more money than brains. They will not
> hit the ball any better than any other make of clubs.

Hard to argue against that.
--
  -asbjxrn