North Flex Top vs. Constant Curve again

North Flex Top vs. Constant Curve again

Post by Juri Munk » Mon, 05 Oct 1992 18:23:40


Some of you may remember my article on finding the right mast for the
North sails that I have. I came to the conclusion that the North constant
curve masts gave better results than the flex tops even though officially
North recommended the flex tops.

I have the 1993 "North Sails News" in front of me and it seems that now
North has 5 different flex curve classifications. The mast that I'm using
now (that I found to be optimal with my Gamma 5.5 and Infinity 5.0) has
"Mast Curve 2". Of course the new sails may require different masts, but
according to North, MC2 is ok for the Infinity 5.0 and Prisma 5.0. For the
5.5, the recommend MC3 or MC4.

The new classification do not prove that I was right or wrong, but they do
show that selecting a mast for a modern can be really tough.

----

The conditions here have been quite unusual. Usually I get to use my 3.6
once or twice during September. This year, I sailed twice in September.
Once with the 5.5 and once with the 6.5 (mostly non-planing). This
year has indeed been strange. (July is normally the "off" month, but this
year I sailed more in July than in any other month.

--
  Juri Munkki                                          Windsurf: fast sailing

 
 
 

North Flex Top vs. Constant Curve again

Post by Roger Christ » Wed, 07 Oct 1992 01:45:03

Quote:

>Some of you may remember my article on finding the right mast for the
>North sails that I have. I came to the conclusion that the North constant
>curve masts gave better results than the flex tops even though officially
>North recommended the flex tops.

A little North bashing here...

At one time, I had a quiver of North Slalom Speed and Infinity sails.
I was using the "recommended" North mast base and tips (Dynamic Speed
AL75, yellow top, pupple top, aluminum top).  I tried rigging them
every conceivable way.  I asked the dealer to assist me (he has 13
years windsurfing experience).  The sails never performed the way I
felt they should.  I finally dumped them.

RUMOR 1: I heard that North has a new policy for 1993 equipment.  They
will no longer sell just sails to their dealers.  The dealer will be
required to purchase an additional 80% of masts, bases, booms, etc.
This means if a dealer wants to buy $10K worth of sails, they will be
required to purchase $8K worth of other North products.

RUMOR 2: Also heard that Gaastra is offering dealers new sails at 40%
off of their normal wholesale price.  To qualify, the dealer must have
leftover 1992 sails and may purchase up to the wholesale value of the
old sails in new sails.  Don't know if it included return of old sails
or what.

Any dealers out there know about these rumors?
--

 
 
 

North Flex Top vs. Constant Curve again

Post by Kirk Lindstr » Fri, 09 Oct 1992 00:00:58

Sounds like the North, NP and Gaastra bashing the Bruce Peterson does in a
recent mag. interview is very justified.  

Kirk out

 
 
 

North Flex Top vs. Constant Curve again

Post by Tom Alber » Thu, 15 Oct 1992 00:15:41


Quote:
> I have the 1993 "North Sails News" in front of me and it seems that now
> North has 5 different flex curve classifications. The mast that I'm using
> now (that I found to be optimal with my Gamma 5.5 and Infinity 5.0) has
> "Mast Curve 2". Of course the new sails may require different masts, but
> according to North, MC2 is ok for the Infinity 5.0 and Prisma 5.0. For the
> 5.5, the recommend MC3 or MC4.

        It looks like North is making the switch to constant curve.
        Their wave sails are calling for constant curve while their
        race sails are calling for "in between" curve ala Sailworks.

        I only looked at one size of each model at the trade show.  
        I didn't realize that they had different mast recommendations
        for different sizes within a model.  That doesn't sound like a
        good idea to me.

        tom.

 
 
 

North Flex Top vs. Constant Curve again

Post by Nick_Nik » Sat, 17 Oct 1992 09:19:22

Quote:


>> I have the 1993 "North Sails News" in front of me and it seems that now
>> North has 5 different flex curve classifications. The mast that I'm using
>> now (that I found to be optimal with my Gamma 5.5 and Infinity 5.0) has
>> "Mast Curve 2". Of course the new sails may require different masts, but
>> according to North, MC2 is ok for the Infinity 5.0 and Prisma 5.0. For the
>> 5.5, the recommend MC3 or MC4.

>    It looks like North is making the switch to constant curve.
>    Their wave sails are calling for constant curve while their
>    race sails are calling for "in between" curve ala Sailworks.

[stuff deleted...]
>    Doesn't sound like a good idea to me...
>    tom.

North do seem to be on the change over or maybe recommending two
mast types for wave and slalom/race designs but to have a different
mast type within a model is strange....

It would be interesting to see exactly which mast type
is optimal in 'most' conditions. Mast conformance may be a way to lock
you into a sail brand as one tends to change the mast less frequently.
Also, it tends to force a change of the full quiver which is done even
less frequently. For a sail designer I would have thought that a stiff
mast is best but now sail designers are taking advantage of mast bend
to enhance sail shape, particularly in gusts.

My understanding is that it is not good to have a mast bend to leeward.
This totally stuffs up the sail shape. But maybe the designers have found
a solution.

I would much prefer a 'standard' slalom / race mast and a 'standard'
wave type mast.

--
-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*-*

Australian Graduate School of Management,       Tel: 61 2 931 9263
P.O. Box 1, Kensington. N.S.W. 2033.            Fax: 61 2 662 7621

 
 
 

North Flex Top vs. Constant Curve again

Post by GARY BOAT » Sat, 17 Oct 1992 21:17:16

Quote:

>North do seem to be on the change over or maybe recommending two
>mast types for wave and slalom/race designs but to have a different
>mast type within a model is strange....
>>P.O. Box 1, Kensington. N.S.W. 2033.            Fax: 61 2 662 7621

It may be strange but smart!  Sail designers want to do a lot of things when
they design a line of sails, a lot of things for a lot of people.  A friend
weighs 60 kilos or 132 lbs.  He doesn't want to sail the exact same rig as
an other friend weighing 100 kilos (220 lbs.)even though the wind would be
good for each person in the given conditions.  Sails below 5.0 are usually
move wave/bump and jump oriented than those above.  Even if they are all
Infinitys. See the 1992 North Sails mast compatibility chart  for more
confusion.  Also the 1992 Hot Sails Maui brochure explains rig philosophy
rather well.  
All in all there are things that can be said about the new sail lines:

        1) The more twist that is "built in" to the sails construction,
the less the rig will be depend on the mast to contribute.

        2) Larger sails are not used to pattern the smaller sizes.  That
is smaller sails have not been "scaled" down from the larger sizes (or
vice versa).

        3) Certain designs are meant to be sailed powered - to over-
powered, others work better in light to medium power (fewer of the latter).

        4) Constant curve vs flex top will become a thing of the past as
the correct mast for your weight will be requsite for a particular sail
SIZE.  

        Seeing this is Friday, at least in this part of the world, relax and
add your .02 worth to the list... or take a bite of your ___________ that
you keep in that bottom drawer and read the latest issue of Windsurf that
has shown itself in my mailbox this am... and a gale warning issued for
Saturday!