Sport Today

I've talked to some really good racers who use WindWing Race Pro's (similar
to mine), and the word I get is that it is very difficult to get *too much*
downhaul.  "Downhaul it as hard as you can, and you probably still won't have
too much".

Since I started taking heed to this advice, I'm pretty sure I have noticed an
improvement in the sails' power and range, especially top end speed.

SO HERE'S THE PROBLEM:  I keep breaking stuff due to the downhaul required

I've broken 3 downhauls in the past month (one only lasted about 3 riggings).
After the last one broke,  I figured I'd get smart and replace it with the
next size bigger line.  The first time I rigged this, the pulley on the mast
extension blew out due to the extra force I was able to exert.  The mast
extension was a Mistral unit that I got so it would easily snap into my
Mistral Energy mast track.

The short term solution has been to begin using the pulley (that fits into
the downhaul grommet on the sail) that came with the mast extension.  This
reduces friction substantially compared to just routing the lines through
the grommet (I always made sure they weren't twisted).  Reduced friction
==> less force required by me ==> less stress on the base ==> nothing's
broken so far.  The problem with this, and the reason I had not been using
the pulley is that it adds at least an inch of clearance between the sail
and the board -> not so fast.

Has anyone else had so much trouble breaking downhauls?

Any clever solutions - Carbon/Kevlar downhaul lines for $10/foot perhaps?

Also, breaking the Mistral extension has made me think about what to use
for a permanent replacement.  My Fleetwood is in really good shape, but
it doesn't have that reinforcement ring around the bottom that I've seen
on some of the newer ones.  

Another thing I'd like is to be able to pull straight down.  With the
Mistral and the Fiberspar extensions, you have to pull somewhat sideways to
clear the cleat.  How is the Streamlined ext, it looks like a pretty clean
design, does anyone know how strong it is?

Thanks for any suggestions/related experiences.

Ed Wilson

Mistral Energy, WindWing Slalom Comps

Kirk out
PS  I'm pretty big  (210 lbs)and fairly strong so your mileage could
vary if you are closer to 100 lbs.

my mileage does vary. i sometimes have to use kirk to downhaul my sails.
my recommendation is to become kirk's buddy.

narayan

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Are you using something other than this plastic thing? or are you using
this, but it is in fact strong enough to handle all the force?  (what kind
of sails are you using?)

If it might work, it would definitely be worth trying.

Thanks for your input

Ed

P.S.  I bought a Chinook base yesterday - It looked to be the toughest in the
      store, and was not too expensive either.

Fortunately, Ted Huang taught me a nifty trick for downhauling sails.
When you are ready to put the final downhaul on the sail, put on your
*harness* and tie the downhaul line to the harness hook using a bowline.
To tighten, put your foot against the base of the mast and push.  Move the
knot and repeat if desired.  I have minimal trouble putting adequate
downhaul my WindWing sail using this technique.

No back strain.
No rope burn.
No sweat.
...way cool.

Here is another trick to ease your inadequate downhaul blues.  Put lots
of OUTHAUL on the sail before downhauling.  This bends the mast so that
downhauling is much much easier.  (Of course, you will probably ;^) want
to readjust the outhaul after you are finished with the downhaul...)

RE:  Broken mast bases.
I have been very happy with my Nautix Jumbo mastbase.  It is
constructed very robustly and the mast extension rings do not slide
off like the rings on other mastbases (Mistral, for example).
Check it out.

     -- Mark

 Hi,
        I use "clamcleats" pulley hooks, they do a couple of types,
each of which is coated aluminium with three (?) rollers and an integral
cleat.

 The "hook" type (I use) has 3 rollers, a hefty hook and a cleat in a
neat package which fits the cringles in most windsurfing sails. It
doesn't work with those incredibly stupid NP fittings which I understand
that they are finally scrapping.

 The "base" type has a hole for a stop knot, three rollers and a cleat
and is designed so that it can hang below the bottom of the mast
extension by a cm or so.

 By using these fittings and the appropriate opposite end you can set
up a 6:1 downhaul with minimal friction which can be attached to your
sail in no time. It will downhaul the sail to about a centimetre or
so above the UJ by overlapping the pulley fittings.

 If you are racing you may care about the extra centimetre of downhaul.

 If you are sailing for fun then the 10 minutes it saves you every time
you rig up a sail may well be worth it. I get 10 mins by adding the
time spent setting up the downhaul ropes to the time spent trying to
get the **** thing tight enough and add in a little extra for the times
you can't find your easy-rigg/boom tube/Kirk.

        W. (why rig when you could be sailing?)

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BTW has anyone seen/used the North ergo trim system. This is a ratchet winch
type of thinigy that slips into your mast base and enables you to tension the
downhaul by pushing a lever. According to North "Each movement tensions the
luff by about 2cm and removes all wrinkles associated with bad rigging". It
retails over here for about 15 pounds (~US$30).

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Mark Nass

The problem I have (hopefully, had) is (was) just breaking stuff.  Last
Friday, after I posted, I went sailing up at Coyote.  I used my pulley
hook, flattened the sail, got sufficient downhaul, and cleated the
downhaul line.  Then I head over to the outhaul to release it (to set it
~1 inch negative), and I hear this loud pop, look over, and see that the
pulley in the mast extension has exploded, just like the first one did.  
It was a Mistral extension, with a plastic pulley housing, the plastic
broke, and the pulley simply pulled free.

It appeared to me to be that the extension was just not designed to take
that much downhaul.  If you notice how extension designs have changed in
recent years, many of them (WSH, Fleetwood, Chinook, at least) now have
reinforcing rings of aluminum around the bottom, required by the increased
loading.

I replaced the extension with a Chinook, which looks very strong, and also
has a cleating system where you pull straight down and then cleat it
sideways.  One problem I had had with the Mistral was that you had to
pull slightly sideways when downhauling - this seemed to cause more
abrasion on the downhaul line, perhaps causing it to fail earlier.  By
the way, the Fiberspar extensions appear to have the same pulley housing
as the Mistral, so watch out.

I hope these changes will make my system work better now, and suggest to
anyone with mega-downhaul sails to keep this in mind in choosing a new
mast extension.

Ed

[various doubts about Chinook pulley strength deleted]

Well, like I said, I haven't had one break. What I didn't say was:
1. I've used them for 3 years.
2. I use them on both outhaul and downhaul.
3. They are made of metal and plastic, metal through the grommet and plastic
   wheels, where there is minimal lateral stress.
4. I sail Northwave sails, which employ lots of downhaul, most recently the
   '92 PRX line of sails.
5. They probably cost at least 5$ each from a shop? I don't know, I buy them
   in bulk from Chinook.
6. I am completely happy with them and have no archaic longings for pulley
   hooks or threading of line.

In order to give you an idea of how much downhaul I use and a method of
cranking it, I generally use a spare boom extension to wrap the downhaul
line around. Then, with both hands on the extension on either side of the line
and with a foot against the mastbase, I can REALLY apply that downhaul,
completely closing the gap. And no, I have never broken a boom extension,
but some cheap stick or pole would work as well, I suppose.

Last Saturday a guy had one of the North downhaul levers which seemed to
work OK if your sail needs a LOT of downhaul. The main thing is that the
lever is clumsy and you only get an inch of downhaul per 'moverment'. After
each 'movement' you have to tighten the downhaul rope around the lever.
It is all pretty clever, but it would be nice if it was racheted so that
you wouldn't have to re-adjust the downhaul rope each time.

-Mark

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