Sport Today

I'm in the market for an 8.5 meter sail.  We get a lot of afternoon sea
breezes here in Melbourne, Australia at this time of year... in the 7 to
10 knot range.

I'm planing on my 9'4" board (custom,carbon fibre 7kg Windtech) only 50%
of the time using my Pryde V8, 7 meter sail...  and would like to plane
more.  I weigh 90 kg (200+lbs).

Can any one advise me on sails of this size that they know about?  And
what size mast and boom I'll need?

Many thanks in advance,

Mark

--
                                __   /\  May the wind be at your side
Mark 'Cecil' DeFriest          /  \_/  \    since it's no good coming

Windsurfing Obsessive         \   ___   /  
Melbourne   Australia          \_/   \*/
                                      __
                                      \/ http://www.pb.com.au/pb/homes/12000.htm

: I'm in the market for an 8.5 meter sail.  We get a lot of afternoon sea
: breezes here in Melbourne, Australia at this time of year... in the 7 to
: 10 knot range.
:
I'd suggest an 8.5 Niel Pryde V8 or 8.3 VX3.  I use a VX2 8.3 and weigh 195 lbs and
can plane in 8-9 knots.  You will unfortunately find that you'll have to invest
in quite a bit of new equipment.  A 490 cm or longer (perhaps a 520) mast is a must.
A fiberspar reflex 5000 is ideal, but others with a lesser carbon content can save
money.  An important feature is trying to avoid too much weight, but the bend
characteristics can also help in pumping. Stiff long booms are also important
210 cm fiberspar booms is what I use.  If you try to use booms that are too short
with long extensions  they will flex like a noodle, be uncomfortable, and not allow the
sail to hold its shape.  Finally you will need a fin appropriate to light wind and
big sails.  Curtis and FIns International are the best for this in my opinion, but
they should be 44 to 48 cm long.

There are sails which are lighter than the V8  (North Pyro for example), but I feel
that you still need a number of camber inducers to keep the shape and provide for
some measure of control if the wind picks up.  The down side of large sails is the
potential for getting overpowered if the wind picks up to 18 knots.  The race sails
will allow you to cover the higher wind conditions. I use the 8.3 until I need a 6.5.
If you are relatively sure that you won't run into much above 10 knots, a lighter
sail might be in order.

Aerotech, Sailworks, North and Neil Pryde all make good large sails.  Sailworks are unique
in requiring very stiff masts.  I'd stick with North or Neil Pryde.  the North Pyro 8.5
is worth a look if you don't anticipate much over 10 knots, otherwise I'd go with the NP V8.

--

--
Jack Faller
Deparment of Chemistry
Yale University

You might want to check out the new Windwing Synthesis 8.3.

Truncated tip, decoupled head, 7 custom RBS carbon/epoxy battens and 3
removeable cams (run it with 0, 1, 2, or 3 cams.) It's fairly light yet
durable and very tunable for low-end power and top end handling. Price
is competitive. It will rig on most 490-500 CC masts and for extra
pumping or light to moderate sailors, a 460 + 40cm fixed base extension
will save you big bucks and make a fun rig.

See it in the next WindTracks or Wind Surfing mag.

Neil Pryde and North make good sails but they aren't the only ones and
they don't make anything this versatile.

G'day Cecil,

I have a '97 NP V8 8.5.  I agree with Jack's comments.  I have a couple of
further comments.

I'm using the sail on a longboard (Fanatic Cat).  I find that the V8 does not
have the grunt to get the board onto the plane in light winds that 7.5 m2
raceboard sails have.  THis includes the IMCO 7.4 (mind you any short board
sailor would cringe when you see how they rig IMCO sails for light wind - the
leading edges of the battens are about perpendicular to the mast).  However,
once the wind gets up and the board is on the plane, the V8 performs better.

You should seriously consider an adjustable outhaul and possibly also downhaul.
Although these are commonly used by longboarders, I feel that there are
significant advantages for shortboard sailors.  If nothing else, you can
increase the wind range of the sail - it will certainly allow you to flatten
off the sail should you get caught offshore in increasing wind.  There are also
advantages in upwind and downwind sailing with an adjustable outhaul.

I agree with Jack with respect to the boom.  I use a 250cm NP aluminium boom -
the one with the***adjustment.  Although it is in the middle of the
extension, the boom feels noticeably spongy compared to its use on my 7.0m2 or
shorter booms on smaller sails.  I have stuck with the boom simply because of
the cost of carbon.  If you go carbon, go all carbon, rather than carbon arms
and aluminium head and clew.

I'm using the NP CK75 490 mast wth 45cm ART extension - works well.

Cheers, Bob

The combo planed earlier than anything else on the water. Later on some
more powerful sails came out (YES sails, North IQ3), but none could mach
the range of Pryde. I could use the sail up to 20 knots windspeed. That
helped me win our national championships.

Most of the time I used 48 cm fin. 44 was better for off-the-wind speed,
whereas 48 helped me point better. Planing threshold was more or less
the same.

VX3 is definitely a racing sail. It must be pumped to get planing and it
loves to be rigged flat. Adjustable outhaul proved to be effective on
broad reaches. Easing the downhaul did not help planing, but made the
sail slower and heavier instead. The sail requires 520 CK95 mast
(IMCS32), and I would never try anything else.

My experience on big recreational sails is throughly negative. The
apparent wind is always strong once you are planing. In 8 knots of wind
you actually sail very close upwind all the time since your speed
relative to wind speed is very high. The lack of stability and full
shape of recreational sails make effective short board planing almost
impossible. Long boards can get away with such sails, since the sailing
style and speeds are totally different.

One should keep in mind that usually only the biggest size of
manufacturer's racing range is truly a minimum conditions sail. Next
year the light wind size is propably 9+ m2, and 8.3's are used in winds
around 15-20 kts.

Markus Huhtinen
L-10
Joensuu, Finland

Check it out!
Chuck

Sailworks does not reccomend a mast stiffer than 490/26 for any
current models sails.  Some older models ('92~'96 ) in the largest
size use a 500/27.5.

Sailworks makes three different mid-8.0 meter sails:

S-X Racing 8.4          8 batten 4 cams.  High tension racng sail
Retro 8.5               6 battens, no cams. Intended for slalom boards
Retro Raceboard 8.5     6 battens, no cams. Low aspect longboard sail

                        (replaces Regatta model)

Bruce Peterson
Sailworks

Many thanks for the excellent advice given on this thread at my initial request.

For the record, I have decided to buy a Neil Pryde 8.5 meter V8 sail to go
on a C30 490 mast.

Why?  The larger sails don't seem to make it across the Pacific here in
Australia - in fact Pryde is only shipping two across... arriving on
December 20th... and I've got one of them.  The other sails many of you
mentioned are may be better, but are just not available over here.... at
least not in the 8.5 size.

I've not gone with the CK90 or CK55 mast because I ran out of money -
although not ideal, the C30 will hopefully do the trick (it's a 27 MCS).

I'm unlikely to obtain the sail before Christmas (customs clearance and
local freight)... but when I do I hope I can sail it on my 9'4" 110 litre
board.... I'll report back when I've had a chance to give it a go.

Again thanks heaps for all of your help.

--
                                __   /\  May the wind be at your side
Mark 'Cecil' DeFriest          /  \_/  \    since it's no good coming

Windsurfing Obsessive         \   ___   /  
Melbourne   Australia          \_/   \*/
                                      __
                                      \/ http://www.pb.com.au/pb/homes/12000.htm