by Endo » Mon, 02 Oct 2006 11:28:43
It seems to rig up really strange. I rigged it on the recommended 430
mast but it seems like the luff sleeve is about 15cm to 20 cm shorter
than recommemded on the sail. I first thought maybe they gave me a 4.7m
that was marked incorrectly, except the boom length seems about right.
Did they***up making this sail and I should return it, or will the
luff sleve stretch over time?
Endo
by clydepe.. » Mon, 02 Oct 2006 11:59:54
Measure the mast and the extension to get the right combined length
with a tape measure.Downhaul to this measured mark, less 5 cm. What
does the sail look like? New sails do stretch, usually about 4 to 5
riggings will loosen them up. Check the North website for rigging
instructions and photos. What does the boom cut out feel like? Is it
super tight? Should not be super tight. Is the leech super floppy?
Like, loose all the way to the boom?
by Roger Jacks » Mon, 02 Oct 2006 13:33:27
> It seems to rig up really strange. I rigged it on the recommended 430
> mast but it seems like the luff sleeve is about 15cm to 20 cm shorter
> than recommemded on the sail. I first thought maybe they gave me a 4.7m
> that was marked incorrectly, except the boom length seems about right.
> Did they***up making this sail and I should return it, or will the
> luff sleve stretch over time?
> Endo
by mewinds.. » Mon, 02 Oct 2006 23:15:10
I've had the instinct in 2005, but 4.7 and 4.2. It was one of the best
sails north has designed. The sail will work fine with the North drop
shape masts as well as most others. 454cm does seem to be a pretty
long luff for the 5.3. My 5.9 usually has that luff. The easiest
thing to do is stick the mast in and downhaul the sail until the
wrinkles in the top of the sail touch the markings (the little white
circles towards the top of the sail. It's pretty much a no brainer if
you go by the min and max markings at the top of the sail. Usually the
settings that are on the sails are dead on, but maybe not in your case.
Remember those are the maximum settings that are printed on the sail,
so you have to take a few centemeters off that to achieve minimum
downhaul.
Usually all the marking are pretty good, but I did have a 4.2 one year
where the harness line markings were too far forward.
Also the 2005 and up Northsails have built in oversized pullies and no
longer have the grommet. They were a huge improvement in easing up
downhauling the sail.
Hope this helps,
Mike Burns
> > I bought a new 2005 North Instinct 5.3m sail.
> > It seems to rig up really strange. I rigged it on the recommended 430
> > mast but it seems like the luff sleeve is about 15cm to 20 cm shorter
> > than recommemded on the sail. I first thought maybe they gave me a 4.7m
> > that was marked incorrectly, except the boom length seems about right.
> > Did they***up making this sail and I should return it, or will the
> > luff sleve stretch over time?
> > Endo
by Florian Feuse » Tue, 03 Oct 2006 05:48:33
The published meaurements of the 05 Instinct are
4.7* 1,64 4,19 Viper Wave / Viper 75 400
5.0* 1,68 4,29 Viper Wave / Viper 75 400
5.3 1,76 4,54 Viper Wave / Viper 75 430
5.7 1,79 4,56 Viper Wave / Viper 75 430
so the 5.0 has a luff of 4.29m, but the 5.3m measures 4.54 - only 2cm
less than the 5.7m?
florian
by Roger Jacks » Tue, 03 Oct 2006 06:25:58
http://SportToday.org/
Your numbers seem to be the mast length, not the overall luff length.
Interesting, because back in the '90's you could rig any North sail to
the numbers on the sail/sailbag and be right on.
I wonder what the real measurement off the sail and sail bag are for the
5.3 m2 Instinct Endo has.
Hope this helps,
Roger
>> Hi Endo,
>> Hmmmmm.... 15-20 cm too short....? That's like 5.9-7.8"
>> I can assure you the luff sleeve isn't going to ever "stretch"
>> this much.
> Sometimes, my most basic math goes out the window with all the
> e***ment and I set the extension 10cm too tall...
> I guess that isn't much of an excuse for the manufacturer, but I think
> their measurements are off.
> The published meaurements of the 05 Instinct are
> 4.7* 1,64 4,19 Viper Wave / Viper 75 400
> 5.0* 1,68 4,29 Viper Wave / Viper 75 400
> 5.3 1,76 4,54 Viper Wave / Viper 75 430
> 5.7 1,79 4,56 Viper Wave / Viper 75 430
> so the 5.0 has a luff of 4.29m, but the 5.3m measures 4.54 - only 2cm
> less than the 5.7m?
> florian
by Endo » Tue, 03 Oct 2006 11:17:36
The 2005 instinct comes with a pulley (no grommet) so I don't think it
has to do with adding a pulley hook. But I did notice the pulley is
pretty far up the luff sleeve compared to any other sail I've seen.
Still, when I rigged it on a 430, I needed only 10 cm extension (440cm
total).
I'm used to downhauling until the sail pulley almost touches the
extension pulley (i.e. almost no rope left). All my other North sails
are like this. Maybe the Instinct is not?
When I downhauled it, I though the leech had the expected amount of
looseness. Although the 3rd panel seemed rather loose compared to the
top 2. I'm used to seeing a more progressive amount of looseness in the
leech.
Funny thing is, the wind dropped so I rigged a 5.8m on my 430
mast......and the mast broke after about an hour of riding......hmmmm.
Coincidence? Or did I damage the mast earlier by over-downhauling it on
my 5.3m?
After I ripped my 5.8m with a broken mast, I switched back to the 5.3m
but with my 400cm mast. It seemed to rig better, but still not as
nicely as my other North sails.
Endo
by Glenn Woodel » Tue, 03 Oct 2006 12:19:06
From the way you describe the leech here, it sounds like you may not
have had the correct mast or since it broke, it may have been
defective. How old was the mast that broke?
I don't think you can over-downhaul a mast enough to break it within
normal means.
Glenn
>The 2005 instinct comes with a pulley (no grommet) so I don't think it
>has to do with adding a pulley hook. But I did notice the pulley is
>pretty far up the luff sleeve compared to any other sail I've seen.
>Still, when I rigged it on a 430, I needed only 10 cm extension (440cm
>total).
>I'm used to downhauling until the sail pulley almost touches the
>extension pulley (i.e. almost no rope left). All my other North sails
>are like this. Maybe the Instinct is not?
>When I downhauled it, I though the leech had the expected amount of
>looseness. Although the 3rd panel seemed rather loose compared to the
>top 2. I'm used to seeing a more progressive amount of looseness in the
>leech.
>Funny thing is, the wind dropped so I rigged a 5.8m on my 430
>mast......and the mast broke after about an hour of riding......hmmmm.
>Coincidence? Or did I damage the mast earlier by over-downhauling it on
>my 5.3m?
>After I ripped my 5.8m with a broken mast, I switched back to the 5.3m
>but with my 400cm mast. It seemed to rig better, but still not as
>nicely as my other North sails.
>Endo
>> I wonder what the real measurement off the sail and sail bag are for the
>> 5.3 m2 Instinct Endo has.
>> Hope this helps,
>> Roger
by mewinds.. » Tue, 03 Oct 2006 23:58:34
Mike
> The 2005 instinct comes with a pulley (no grommet) so I don't think it
> has to do with adding a pulley hook. But I did notice the pulley is
> pretty far up the luff sleeve compared to any other sail I've seen.
> Still, when I rigged it on a 430, I needed only 10 cm extension (440cm
> total).
> I'm used to downhauling until the sail pulley almost touches the
> extension pulley (i.e. almost no rope left). All my other North sails
> are like this. Maybe the Instinct is not?
> When I downhauled it, I though the leech had the expected amount of
> looseness. Although the 3rd panel seemed rather loose compared to the
> top 2. I'm used to seeing a more progressive amount of looseness in the
> leech.
> Funny thing is, the wind dropped so I rigged a 5.8m on my 430
> mast......and the mast broke after about an hour of riding......hmmmm.
> Coincidence? Or did I damage the mast earlier by over-downhauling it on
> my 5.3m?
> After I ripped my 5.8m with a broken mast, I switched back to the 5.3m
> but with my 400cm mast. It seemed to rig better, but still not as
> nicely as my other North sails.
> Endo
> > I wonder what the real measurement off the sail and sail bag are for the
> > 5.3 m2 Instinct Endo has.
> > Hope this helps,
> > Roger
by Endo » Wed, 04 Oct 2006 10:18:44
I saw your reviews of other North sails at Windsurfing Hatteras. That's
actually where I bought the sail.
Do you have any experience rigging a 2005 North Instinct on a skinny
mast? I'm thinking of replacing my broken 430 Tidal Wave with a Hot
Sails Maui HotRod skinny 430 or perhaps a Powerex Z-wave 430 (regular
diameter).
I have no experience with RDM masts but might be willing to give it a
try.
Endo
> Mike
by mewinds.. » Thu, 05 Oct 2006 10:57:03
I haven't rigged the 2005s on skinnies but the 06's work even better on
skinnies than regular masts, not to say they don't work on regular
masts as well. I just switched to skinnies this year. I picked up
some Naish firesticks and am very happy with them. I have a 460
NoLimitz and it works great as well. I'm going to stick with the
NoLimitz from here on in. They're still at a decent price and have a
lifetime warrenty. I think Windsurfing Hatteras is starting to sell
them as well. That's where I got my 460. I've heard of people
breaking the fiberspars. The other brands I don't have any first hand
experience with so can't say either way.
Great to see people reading are the reviews.
Glad I could help,
Mike
> I saw your reviews of other North sails at Windsurfing Hatteras. That's
> actually where I bought the sail.
> Do you have any experience rigging a 2005 North Instinct on a skinny
> mast? I'm thinking of replacing my broken 430 Tidal Wave with a Hot
> Sails Maui HotRod skinny 430 or perhaps a Powerex Z-wave 430 (regular
> diameter).
> I have no experience with RDM masts but might be willing to give it a
> try.
> Endo
> > 10 cm of extention sounds about right for the 5.3s on a 430. I think
> > it's safe to assume that they made a typo that has gone unchecked
> > until now. The instinct rigs the same way as all the other norths have
> > for years. The pullies will come down really close to the extension
> > when downhauled properly. Since you're used to North, it's probably
> > best for you to ignore the numbers and just go by the min/max markings
> > at the top of the sail.
> > Mike
by Florian Feuse » Fri, 06 Oct 2006 00:18:48
> I haven't rigged the 2005s on skinnies but the 06's work even better on
> skinnies than regular masts, not to say they don't work on regular
> masts as well. I just switched to skinnies this year. I picked up
> some Naish firesticks and am very happy with them. I have a 460
> NoLimitz and it works great as well. I'm going to stick with the
> NoLimitz from here on in. They're still at a decent price and have a
> lifetime warrenty. I think Windsurfing Hatteras is starting to sell
> them as well. That's where I got my 460. I've heard of people
> breaking the fiberspars. The other brands I don't have any first hand
> experience with so can't say either way.
> Great to see people reading are the reviews.
> Glad I could help,
> Mike
Have you looked into the North Skinnies (needles)?
A bit pricey, perhaps, but I am curious bout the performance.
florian
by mewinds.. » Sat, 07 Oct 2006 01:50:26
I was told the North Skinnies didn't come into the US for 2006
partially because of the high price $700+. I've sailed the regular
diameter Norths for years and have always been happy with them. I
tried to get the skinnies last fall, but couldn't. Not sure if they
came in later on in the season. I'm really happy with the NoLimitz,
and the price is way cheaper, so I'm sticking with them.
BTW my 2006 100% carbon Naish skinnies will be for sale late this fall
after I get my new masts. I have two 400s and a 430. Let me know if
anyone is interested.
Looks like wind until Sunday. I'm going to Napeague Friday.
Mike
> > Hey Endo,
> > I haven't rigged the 2005s on skinnies but the 06's work even better on
> > skinnies than regular masts, not to say they don't work on regular
> > masts as well. I just switched to skinnies this year. I picked up
> > some Naish firesticks and am very happy with them. I have a 460
> > NoLimitz and it works great as well. I'm going to stick with the
> > NoLimitz from here on in. They're still at a decent price and have a
> > lifetime warrenty. I think Windsurfing Hatteras is starting to sell
> > them as well. That's where I got my 460. I've heard of people
> > breaking the fiberspars. The other brands I don't have any first hand
> > experience with so can't say either way.
> > Great to see people reading are the reviews.
> > Glad I could help,
> > Mike
> hi Mike,
> Have you looked into the North Skinnies (needles)?
> A bit pricey, perhaps, but I am curious bout the performance.
> florian
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