double bight bowline

double bight bowline

Post by Phil Hod » Thu, 07 Nov 2002 02:29:47



Quote:
> >>some<< knots.  Have they tested a knot introduced in Summit & Nylon Hwy
> ca. 1990 by Austian Heinz Prohaska?  --"double bight bowline" was one name
> he gave it (but "Prohaska Bowline" is better).  This is simpler than the
> "rethreaded [misleading name!] bowline", and should do the job!?

In this context, does "bight" refer to the path of the "rabbit"?
If so, there seem to be several viable ways to double this portion
of the knot.  Did Prohaska test these and decide one was better?
How did he tie the "double bight bowline"?

Phil

 
 
 

double bight bowline

Post by David Kastru » Thu, 07 Nov 2002 03:48:01

Quote:


> > >>some<< knots.  Have they tested a knot introduced in Summit & Nylon Hwy
> > ca. 1990 by Austian Heinz Prohaska?  --"double bight bowline" was one name
> > he gave it (but "Prohaska Bowline" is better).  This is simpler than the
> > "rethreaded [misleading name!] bowline", and should do the job!?

> In this context, does "bight" refer to the path of the "rabbit"?

No, to the bight.  That which goes through the tie-in points.

Quote:
> If so, there seem to be several viable ways to double this portion
> of the knot.  Did Prohaska test these and decide one was better?
> How did he tie the "double bight bowline"?

Tie a single bowline.  Go through the tie-in points again and
rethread until you top out.

--
David Kastrup, Kriemhildstr. 15, 44793 Bochum

 
 
 

double bight bowline

Post by jeslawrenc » Thu, 07 Nov 2002 11:56:03

I misposted this in ref to an earlier question... but what about the triple
bowline (or bowline on a bight) which as a tie-in always served me in good
stead as an
impromptu (crude) harness... especially useful in rescues.... the rabbit
ends up as the bodyloop, and the two legloops are formed by the
remainder....its quick, and simple......... and if adjusted well,
inescapable even by upside down `victims'......


Quote:


> > > >>some<< knots.  Have they tested a knot introduced in Summit & Nylon
Hwy
> > > ca. 1990 by Austian Heinz Prohaska?  --"double bight bowline" was one
name
> > > he gave it (but "Prohaska Bowline" is better).  This is simpler than
the
> > > "rethreaded [misleading name!] bowline", and should do the job!?

> > In this context, does "bight" refer to the path of the "rabbit"?

> No, to the bight.  That which goes through the tie-in points.

> > If so, there seem to be several viable ways to double this portion
> > of the knot.  Did Prohaska test these and decide one was better?
> > How did he tie the "double bight bowline"?

> Tie a single bowline.  Go through the tie-in points again and
> rethread until you top out.

> --
> David Kastrup, Kriemhildstr. 15, 44793 Bochum


 
 
 

double bight bowline

Post by Nafod » Thu, 07 Nov 2002 22:51:42

David Kastrup ...

Quote:


> > > >>some<< knots.  Have they tested a knot introduced in Summit & Nylon Hwy
> > > ca. 1990 by Austian Heinz Prohaska?  --"double bight bowline" was one name
> > > he gave it (but "Prohaska Bowline" is better).  This is simpler than the
> > > "rethreaded [misleading name!] bowline", and should do the job!?

> > In this context, does "bight" refer to the path of the "rabbit"?

> No, to the bight.  That which goes through the tie-in points.

> > If so, there seem to be several viable ways to double this portion
> > of the knot.  Did Prohaska test these and decide one was better?
> > How did he tie the "double bight bowline"?

> Tie a single bowline.  Go through the tie-in points again and
> rethread until you top out.

I still get confused by all of the different names for these knots. I
do know that the knot you just described is known as a "bowline on a
bight", being so named because you can tie the knot in the middle of
rope without needing access to either end. Of course you can't tie in
to the harness using the "on the bight" method, you have to use the
"double pass" method of feeding it back.

It's my tie-in knot of choice now.

 
 
 

double bight bowline

Post by Mike Swan » Fri, 08 Nov 2002 01:49:13

Quote:
> I still get confused by all of the different names for these knots. I
> do know that the knot you just described is known as a "bowline on a
> bight", being so named because you can tie the knot in the middle of
> rope without needing access to either end. Of course you can't tie in
> to the harness using the "on the bight" method, you have to use the
> "double pass" method of feeding it back.

> It's my tie-in knot of choice now.

It's also worth knowing if you use a chest harness.  Tie into sit-harness
using bowline, and tie into chest-harness using the re-threaded part.  Lets
you adjust the tightness of the 2 attachments, and keeps you tied in when
you put on/take off the chest harness.

Mike

 
 
 

double bight bowline

Post by Dan Lehm » Fri, 08 Nov 2002 06:08:21

Quote:
> David Kastrup ...


> > > > >>some<< knots.  Have they tested a knot introduced in Summit & Nylon Hwy
> > > > ca. 1990 by Austian Heinz Prohaska?  --"double bight bowline" was one name
> > > > he gave it (but "Prohaska Bowline" is better).  This is simpler than the
> > > > "rethreaded [misleading name!] bowline", and should do the job!?

> > > In this context, does "bight" refer to the path of the "rabbit"?

> > No, to the bight.  That which goes through the tie-in points.

Well, let me answer this, since it's about the Prohaska not Re-Threaded Bwl.!

"Double-bight" is a mis-leading name; a better name would connote re-tucking
the end and binding a leg of the eye.  But I'll prefer "Prohaska Bowline".

For the ProBwl, tie a single bowline and orient it before you on a table, say,
such that the single, fully loaded part (the "standing part" (SPart)), runs
away from you, and crosses UNDER the first part it crosses.  The loop/eye of
the knot has two legs:  one of them leads into the nipping turn formed by
the SPart; the other leads through this nip and turns around the SPart (to
form the "collar") and comes back through the nip beside itself and is the
end.  (E.g., the double bwl. recently referenced at a WWW site was in this
general orientation, SPart entering by crossing UNDER the collar.)

To extend this single bwl. into the Prohaska Bwl., take the end over the
SPart-side leg of the loop and back under that--i.e., wrap this leg--;
then run the end OVER the end-side leg of the loop in passing out through
the SPart's nip--the nip will now nip the end (again), and hold its grip
on the SPart-leg, which in turn helps keep the nip in place.

While this bowline doesn't draw up as snugly as the End-Bound Dbl.Bwl,
it seems to adequately secure the knot against loosening in climbing
situations (though it might fail the test of some vigorous shaking).

Quote:
> I still get confused by all of the different names for these knots.

Because THEY are confused/inconsistent/conflicting.  In a separate thread
about side-oriented rap. bends, with Jost reporting testing done by Edelrid,
we saw the amazing fact that the tester & knot-inventer failed to recognize
that the presented knot differed SIGNIFICANTLY from what had been advanced!
But that knot, too, got the "TFK" name (which I reiterated has already been
better attached to an extended grapevine bend (which is a "double" fisherman's
knot/bend)--e.g., by _On Rope_, 1st ed.).


Quote:
> I do know that the knot you just described is known as a "bowline on a
> bight", being so named because you can tie the knot in the middle of
> rope without needing access to either end.

Ah, you might be right on this, in which case what I previously described
is an alternative method of "re-threading", which offers similar redundancy.

--dl*
====

 
 
 

double bight bowline

Post by Chris Hollida » Fri, 08 Nov 2002 09:35:50

Quote:

>> David Kastrup ...


<snipped all the insanity />

I have never seen a less appropriate use of a narrative description. You
guys need a graphic!

C.