Ice Tools: DMM Aliens vs. BD Shrikes?

Ice Tools: DMM Aliens vs. BD Shrikes?

Post by James Het » Sat, 15 Jan 2000 04:00:00


Have you checked any Charlet tools?  I haven't tried the new Axar's yet, but
they look like a good all around tool (fairly straight shaft for plunging)
and they're pretty light.  The Pulsar is a proven tool, and the multi-shaft
version allows for a true alpine axe.  I swear by the Quasar's, but they're
probably more than you're looking to spend, and fairly specialized for steep
ice.  I don't know about the Aliens, but I do not like the DMM Predators.
 
 
 

Ice Tools: DMM Aliens vs. BD Shrikes?

Post by Superalpin » Sat, 15 Jan 2000 04:00:00

my vote would be for the shrikes, since i have a much loved pair of x-15's
(bent).  i have used them for everything.  mostly, it comes down to choosing
a tool and becoming comfortable with the handling characteristics of the
picks.  bd's are a little thinner than charlet moser picks.  have fun, and
try to get out more than several times a year.  cheers.

julian smith

 
 
 

Ice Tools: DMM Aliens vs. BD Shrikes?

Post by Thor Lancelot Sim » Sat, 15 Jan 2000 04:00:00


Quote:

>I'm planning on buying some ice tools real soon now and the DMM Aliens and
>BD Shrikes are on my short list.  Any comments on them?

>I live in Southern California and probably will only get to use them several
>times a year--whatever tools I get, my lack of experience and skill will be
>the limiting factor.  Expensive BD carbon fiber Cobras, etc. would probably be
>overkill.  So I'm looking for low to medium-priced tools.  Also, I'm looking
>for tools suitable for both alpine and waterfall climbing. (And yes, I've
>already read the cheap tools review in the latest R&I.)

After looking at a lot of different tools I bought Trango Captain Hooks.

Just before Xmas there were a few places on the web that had them at $159
(which was also their original price for a month or two last year when
they were first introduced, now they list for $199).  I'm going to climb
with them for the first time tomorrow, so I suppose it's possible I'll
just plain hate them.  But everyone I knew who'd used them loved them;
the only bad things I heard were from people who hadn't actually tried
them, but just didn't like Trango gear for one reason or another...

I've got the Clearance Shaft models.  By Monday I'll know whether I
prefer this to the bent shaft on my old X-15s. :-)

--

        "And where do all these highways go, now that we are free?"

 
 
 

Ice Tools: DMM Aliens vs. BD Shrikes?

Post by Thor Lancelot Sim » Sat, 15 Jan 2000 04:00:00


Quote:

>my vote would be for the shrikes, since i have a much loved pair of x-15's
>(bent).  i have used them for everything.  mostly, it comes down to choosing
>a tool and becoming comfortable with the handling characteristics of the
>picks.  bd's are a little thinner than charlet moser picks.  have fun, and
>try to get out more than several times a year.  cheers.

It also has to do with your hand size, right?  I mean, I tried to give
my old X-15s to my girlfriend but it doesn't look like *that* is going
to work since her hand barely fits around the grip!  One of the differences
with the Shrike is supposed to be that the grip is a bit thinner than on
the Black Prophet or X-15, right?

--

        "And where do all these highways go, now that we are free?"

 
 
 

Ice Tools: DMM Aliens vs. BD Shrikes?

Post by Chris Harmsto » Sat, 15 Jan 2000 04:00:00


Quote:

>It also has to do with your hand size, right?  I mean, I tried to give
>my old X-15s to my girlfriend but it doesn't look like *that* is going
>to work since her hand barely fits around the grip!  One of the differences
>with the Shrike is supposed to be that the grip is a bit thinner than on
>the Black Prophet or X-15, right?

The Shrikes are smaller in circumference than the X-15's and the BP's.  


Quality Assurance Manager. Materials Engineer BS, ME.
Black Diamond Equipment Ltd.
2084 East 3900 South, SLC, UT 84124    phone: 801-278-5552

 
 
 

Ice Tools: DMM Aliens vs. BD Shrikes?

Post by Geoff Snyde » Sat, 15 Jan 2000 04:00:00


Quote:

> After looking at a lot of different tools I bought Trango Captain
Hooks.

> Just before Xmas there were a few places on the web that had them at
$159
> (which was also their original price for a month or two last year when
> they were first introduced, now they list for $199).  I'm going to
climb
> with them for the first time tomorrow, so I suppose it's possible I'll
> just plain hate them.  But everyone I knew who'd used them loved them;
> the only bad things I heard were from people who hadn't actually tried
> them, but just didn't like Trango gear for one reason or another...

> I've got the Clearance Shaft models.  By Monday I'll know whether I
> prefer this to the bent shaft on my old X-15s. :-)

Bring your wrench... those picks loosen every pitch.  Better yet, buy
some Loctite.

g

Sent via Deja.com http://www.deja.com/
Before you buy.

 
 
 

Ice Tools: DMM Aliens vs. BD Shrikes?

Post by Thor Lancelot Sim » Sat, 15 Jan 2000 04:00:00



Quote:


>> After looking at a lot of different tools I bought Trango Captain
>Hooks.

>> Just before Xmas there were a few places on the web that had them at
>$159
>> (which was also their original price for a month or two last year when
>> they were first introduced, now they list for $199).  I'm going to
>climb
>> with them for the first time tomorrow, so I suppose it's possible I'll
>> just plain hate them.  But everyone I knew who'd used them loved them;
>> the only bad things I heard were from people who hadn't actually tried
>> them, but just didn't like Trango gear for one reason or another...

>> I've got the Clearance Shaft models.  By Monday I'll know whether I
>> prefer this to the bent shaft on my old X-15s. :-)

>Bring your wrench... those picks loosen every pitch.  Better yet, buy
>some Loctite.

Have you tried Trango's recommended solution of initially tightening
the hell out of them after putting them in the freezer for a few hours?

I did that the day I got them... we'll see how it works out.

--

        "And where do all these highways go, now that we are free?"

 
 
 

Ice Tools: DMM Aliens vs. BD Shrikes?

Post by Eric D. Coome » Sun, 16 Jan 2000 04:00:00



Quote:
> Have you tried Trango's recommended solution of initially tightening
> the hell out of them after putting them in the freezer for a few
hours?

> I did that the day I got them... we'll see how it works out.

Yup, did that as well.  Overall, I think these are some really nice
tools.  I like the swing, they're affordable(relatively speaking),
good weight distribution, but...  Loc-tite... it really seems the only
solution for keeping these suckers tight.  I cranked the hell out of
the bolt, stuck them in the snow, retightened, cranked some more.  By
the time I topped out on one pitch that had a lot crust on top- read,
smacking the ***out of stuff with the side of the head, they were
loose.  I've taken these tools out for 5-6 days so far this year.
I've had to retighten the head bolts after every pitch.  It's a shame
really, I'd like to see a more permanent design fix for the loosening
problems.  I wouldn't hesitate to buy a pair at that point.

Cheers
Eric

 
 
 

Ice Tools: DMM Aliens vs. BD Shrikes?

Post by mikrkc.. » Mon, 17 Jan 2000 04:00:00



Quote:



> > Have you tried Trango's recommended solution of initially tightening
> > the hell out of them after putting them in the freezer for a few
> hours?

> > I did that the day I got them... we'll see how it works out.

> Yup, did that as well.  Overall, I think these are some really nice
> tools.  I like the swing, they're affordable(relatively speaking),
> good weight distribution, but...  Loc-tite... it really seems the only
> solution for keeping these suckers tight.  I cranked the hell out of
> the bolt, stuck them in the snow, retightened, cranked some more.  By
> the time I topped out on one pitch that had a lot crust on top- read,
> smacking the ***out of stuff with the side of the head, they were
> loose.  I've taken these tools out for 5-6 days so far this year.
> I've had to retighten the head bolts after every pitch.  It's a shame
> really, I'd like to see a more permanent design fix for the loosening
> problems.  I wouldn't hesitate to buy a pair at that point.

> Cheers
> Eric

I personally don't think a problem like the above can be fixed; there is
simply too much torque to lossen the screw. I have had the same problems
with my old X15's several years ago. The only solution is to have pick
bonded to the tool like the old charlet moset's; but if you break the
pick then you are really screwed.

Mike Esparza

Sent via Deja.com http://SportToday.org/
Before you buy.

 
 
 

Ice Tools: DMM Aliens vs. BD Shrikes?

Post by Eric D. Coome » Mon, 17 Jan 2000 04:00:00


About head bolts loosening on Trango tools...

Quote:
> I personally don't think a problem like the above can be fixed;
there is
> simply too much torque to lossen the screw.

I've never had a problem with the newer X-15, Prophet or Simond
Pirhana loosening...

Cheers
Eric

 
 
 

Ice Tools: DMM Aliens vs. BD Shrikes?

Post by Dean William » Tue, 18 Jan 2000 04:00:00

Something that might be worth trying is using a ratchet or a socket
wrench to really tighten the bolts.  Every ice tool that I've ever seen
comes with a ridiculous little Allen wrench that hurts your hand if you
put too much effort into tightening the bolts.  With a ratchet, the only
thing you'd have to worry about is breaking the bolt you're trying to
tighten.
Hope this helps.
Dean.
Quote:





> > > Have you tried Trango's recommended solution of initially tightening
> > > the hell out of them after putting them in the freezer for a few
> > hours?

> > > I did that the day I got them... we'll see how it works out.

> > Yup, did that as well.  Overall, I think these are some really nice
> > tools.  I like the swing, they're affordable(relatively speaking),
> > good weight distribution, but...  Loc-tite... it really seems the only
> > solution for keeping these suckers tight.  I cranked the hell out of
> > the bolt, stuck them in the snow, retightened, cranked some more.  By
> > the time I topped out on one pitch that had a lot crust on top- read,
> > smacking the ***out of stuff with the side of the head, they were
> > loose.  I've taken these tools out for 5-6 days so far this year.
> > I've had to retighten the head bolts after every pitch.  It's a shame
> > really, I'd like to see a more permanent design fix for the loosening
> > problems.  I wouldn't hesitate to buy a pair at that point.

> > Cheers
> > Eric

> I personally don't think a problem like the above can be fixed; there is
> simply too much torque to lossen the screw. I have had the same problems
> with my old X15's several years ago. The only solution is to have pick
> bonded to the tool like the old charlet moset's; but if you break the
> pick then you are really screwed
> Mike Esparza

> Sent via Deja.com http://SportToday.org/
> Before you buy.

 
 
 

Ice Tools: DMM Aliens vs. BD Shrikes?

Post by Christopher A Kantarjie » Thu, 20 Jan 2000 04:00:00

Or twisting the Allen bit because you've tried to apply too much torque.
Quote:

> Something that might be worth trying is using a ratchet or a socket
> wrench to really tighten the bolts.  Every ice tool that I've ever seen
> comes with a ridiculous little Allen wrench that hurts your hand if you
> put too much effort into tightening the bolts.  With a ratchet, the only
> thing you'd have to worry about is breaking the bolt you're trying to
> tighten.
> Hope this helps.
> Dean.






> > > > Have you tried Trango's recommended solution of initially tightening
> > > > the hell out of them after putting them in the freezer for a few
> > > hours?

> > > > I did that the day I got them... we'll see how it works out.

> > > Yup, did that as well.  Overall, I think these are some really nice
> > > tools.  I like the swing, they're affordable(relatively speaking),
> > > good weight distribution, but...  Loc-tite... it really seems the only
> > > solution for keeping these suckers tight.  I cranked the hell out of
> > > the bolt, stuck them in the snow, retightened, cranked some more.  By
> > > the time I topped out on one pitch that had a lot crust on top- read,
> > > smacking the ***out of stuff with the side of the head, they were
> > > loose.  I've taken these tools out for 5-6 days so far this year.
> > > I've had to retighten the head bolts after every pitch.  It's a shame
> > > really, I'd like to see a more permanent design fix for the loosening
> > > problems.  I wouldn't hesitate to buy a pair at that point.

> > > Cheers
> > > Eric

> > I personally don't think a problem like the above can be fixed; there is
> > simply too much torque to lossen the screw. I have had the same problems
> > with my old X15's several years ago. The only solution is to have pick
> > bonded to the tool like the old charlet moset's; but if you break the
> > pick then you are really screwed
> > Mike Esparza

> > Sent via Deja.com http://SportToday.org/
> > Before you buy.