----------->Entry level beginners kite page

----------->Entry level beginners kite page

Post by goodwinds2.. » Sun, 07 Jan 2001 08:28:08


What about developing a template that many of the sites could use out
there as part of their content?  For starters:

A user tested list of beginners kites
A way to link to the kite store nearest to you
Some helpful hints on getting started
How to tie a larkshead (I'm serious!)
Safety tips
Links to local clubs / organizations

Other stuff?

The one problem I've seen with many of the sites out there is that a
lot of them repeat the same information.  Its hard to know what the
purpose is behind some of the content (other than to fill space).

What I'd love to see is a user supported URL.  Nothing with extensions
on it [ kites.beginners.websitenow.com ]

We could also have cards designed that could be handed out when flying
to give to new users.  It would have the link right on there to get
more info.  In checking with Register.com, the only single name site
for sale is kites.ws.  The guy wanted $1,000 fo it.

I have no problem with forking over the $35 to get the domain
registered.  If we could come up with a catchy name, thats still
available then we're on our way.  Am I off here?  Should we just use
the offer thats out there for kitz.com?

Also, I've got a local copy of Fusion 5.0 and I can program the area
map.  Its a very simple CGI script.  People could click on where they
live and get a list of stores in the area.

So two alternatives:

Make a general page that can be cloned around the world to any kite
website that wanted it

Register a unique name, buy some space (as low as $9.95/month) and have
a dedicated, non-commercial, newbie site.

There are also TONS of free web hosting companies out there (websitenow
being one of them), but the way they get paid is by having a banner
tacked to the top of the site.  Register.com will also host a FREE 3
page site for you, but you can't import your own templates for design --
its a pre-fab site design you need to pick from.  Still its free and we
can import content as we like.

What about getting the AKA to give some space?  Or what about Kitelife?

Thoughts?

Sent via Deja.com
http://www.deja.com/

 
 
 

----------->Entry level beginners kite page

Post by goodwinds2.. » Sun, 07 Jan 2001 08:35:53

Correction....I mentioned the site that already established and its
kitez.com (not kitz).

I say PERFECT!  There could be an area map on there, as well as
a "beginners" link.

I know space is money, so I'm willing to chip in just so the content is
there.  This way other sites could link to those pages for all their
newbies.

BTW...whats up with the "Kite Ring" I see on a lot of the web pages out
there?  Has this idea already been done?  Are all kite sites linked,
somehow, through the kite ring? (sounds like something out of Tolken)


Quote:

> What about developing a template that many of the sites could use out
> there as part of their content?  For starters:

> A user tested list of beginners kites
> A way to link to the kite store nearest to you
> Some helpful hints on getting started
> How to tie a larkshead (I'm serious!)
> Safety tips
> Links to local clubs / organizations

> Other stuff?

> The one problem I've seen with many of the sites out there is that a
> lot of them repeat the same information.  Its hard to know what the
> purpose is behind some of the content (other than to fill space).

> What I'd love to see is a user supported URL.  Nothing with extensions
> on it [ kites.beginners.websitenow.com ]

> We could also have cards designed that could be handed out when flying
> to give to new users.  It would have the link right on there to get
> more info.  In checking with Register.com, the only single name site
> for sale is kites.ws.  The guy wanted $1,000 fo it.

> I have no problem with forking over the $35 to get the domain
> registered.  If we could come up with a catchy name, thats still
> available then we're on our way.  Am I off here?  Should we just use
> the offer thats out there for kitz.com?

> Also, I've got a local copy of Fusion 5.0 and I can program the area
> map.  Its a very simple CGI script.  People could click on where they
> live and get a list of stores in the area.

> So two alternatives:

> Make a general page that can be cloned around the world to any kite
> website that wanted it

> Register a unique name, buy some space (as low as $9.95/month) and
have
> a dedicated, non-commercial, newbie site.

> There are also TONS of free web hosting companies out there
(websitenow
> being one of them), but the way they get paid is by having a banner
> tacked to the top of the site.  Register.com will also host a FREE 3
> page site for you, but you can't import your own templates for
design --
> its a pre-fab site design you need to pick from.  Still its free and
we
> can import content as we like.

> What about getting the AKA to give some space?  Or what about
Kitelife?

> Thoughts?

> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

Sent via Deja.com
http://www.deja.com/

 
 
 

----------->Entry level beginners kite page

Post by goodwinds2.. » Sun, 07 Jan 2001 08:39:35

I already realize that if this were to take off, someone's site could
be getting a lot of traffic.  Traffic means more bandwidth and of
course, more bandwidth = more cost per month.


Quote:

> What about developing a template that many of the sites could use out
> there as part of their content?  For starters:

> A user tested list of beginners kites
> A way to link to the kite store nearest to you
> Some helpful hints on getting started
> How to tie a larkshead (I'm serious!)
> Safety tips
> Links to local clubs / organizations

> Other stuff?

> The one problem I've seen with many of the sites out there is that a
> lot of them repeat the same information.  Its hard to know what the
> purpose is behind some of the content (other than to fill space).

> What I'd love to see is a user supported URL.  Nothing with extensions
> on it [ kites.beginners.websitenow.com ]

> We could also have cards designed that could be handed out when flying
> to give to new users.  It would have the link right on there to get
> more info.  In checking with Register.com, the only single name site
> for sale is kites.ws.  The guy wanted $1,000 fo it.

> I have no problem with forking over the $35 to get the domain
> registered.  If we could come up with a catchy name, thats still
> available then we're on our way.  Am I off here?  Should we just use
> the offer thats out there for kitz.com?

> Also, I've got a local copy of Fusion 5.0 and I can program the area
> map.  Its a very simple CGI script.  People could click on where they
> live and get a list of stores in the area.

> So two alternatives:

> Make a general page that can be cloned around the world to any kite
> website that wanted it

> Register a unique name, buy some space (as low as $9.95/month) and
have
> a dedicated, non-commercial, newbie site.

> There are also TONS of free web hosting companies out there
(websitenow
> being one of them), but the way they get paid is by having a banner
> tacked to the top of the site.  Register.com will also host a FREE 3
> page site for you, but you can't import your own templates for
design --
> its a pre-fab site design you need to pick from.  Still its free and
we
> can import content as we like.

> What about getting the AKA to give some space?  Or what about
Kitelife?

> Thoughts?

> Sent via Deja.com
> http://www.deja.com/

Sent via Deja.com
http://www.deja.com/

 
 
 

----------->Entry level beginners kite page

Post by Andrew Beatti » Sun, 07 Jan 2001 09:11:37

Quote:

> Should we just use
> the offer thats out there for kitz.com?

Errr... kitz.com is an engineering company.

The entire kitez.com namespace is occupied by the kitez.com search
engine (and is an example of "you can do anything" at ourshack.com...)

I currently use www.kites.tug.com for rec.kites stuff, which might be
an appropriate place to do it, but if you want a domain specificaly
for the project, that's fine (we have to hand over the $35 to
NotworkSolutions or the like, but we can provide nameservice for
as many domains as we like...)

--
Andrew Beattie

The LAZIEST way to find kite pages ---------> http://www.kitez.com/
********** Win a T-shirt at http://www.kitez.com/tshirt.html **********
My own stuff (Shona, Chevron, Veronica) ----> http://www.tug.com/
Resources for rec.kites --------------------> http://www.kites.tug.com/
Friendly, flexible host for your net stuff -> http://www.ourshack.com/

 
 
 

----------->Entry level beginners kite page

Post by Andrew Beatti » Sun, 07 Jan 2001 09:24:23

Quote:

> I already realize that if this were to take off, someone's site could
> be getting a lot of traffic.  Traffic means more bandwidth and of
> course, more bandwidth = more cost per month.

Not a problem.  Believe me.

--
Andrew Beattie

The LAZIEST way to find kite pages ---------> http://www.kitez.com/
********** Win a T-shirt at http://www.kitez.com/tshirt.html **********
My own stuff (Shona, Chevron, Veronica) ----> http://www.tug.com/
Resources for rec.kites --------------------> http://www.kites.tug.com/
Friendly, flexible host for your net stuff -> http://www.ourshack.com/

 
 
 

----------->Entry level beginners kite page

Post by Ellen Smit » Sun, 07 Jan 2001 09:31:28

Quote:

> What about developing a template that many of the sites could use out
> there as part of their content?  For starters:

> A user tested list of beginners kites
> A way to link to the kite store nearest to you
> Some helpful hints on getting started
> How to tie a larkshead (I'm serious!)
> Safety tips
> Links to local clubs / organizations

Sounds good.

Quote:
> What I'd love to see is a user supported URL.  Nothing with extensions
> on it [ kites.beginners.websitenow.com ]

> We could also have cards designed that could be handed out when flying
> to give to new users.  It would have the link right on there to get
> more info.  In checking with Register.com, the only single name site
> for sale is kites.ws.  The guy wanted $1,000 fo it.

> I have no problem with forking over the $35 to get the domain
> registered.  If we could come up with a catchy name, thats still
> available then we're on our way.  Am I off here?  Should we just use
> the offer thats out there for kitz.com?

I think Andrew B. and his crew over at Ourshack will take VERY good care
of us. If it were up to me however, I wouldn't mind seeing a catchy
domain name like say, StuntKite101.com

I love the biz cards idea. It's so cheap and easy to print up cards
using the computer. Imagine if we all make cards with the url to "our
site" and hand them out to folks all over the world. Talk about some
Grassroots promotion.

Quote:
> Also, I've got a local copy of Fusion 5.0 and I can program the area
> map.  Its a very simple CGI script.  People could click on where they
> live and get a list of stores in the area.

That's really cool. Can you do something along the lines of what they
have at Festivals.com?

Quote:
> So two alternatives:
> Make a general page that can be cloned around the world to any kite
> website that wanted it

Yeah..that sounds good.

Quote:
> Register a unique name, buy some space (as low as $9.95/month) and have
> a dedicated, non-commercial, newbie site.

With mirrors? I wonder if Andrew B. [BTW/we gotta get some sort of
nickname for you dude, cuz this is getting confusing] could handle the
registration, initial housing and then approve the mirror sites. He's
one smart guy.

Quote:
> What about getting the AKA to give some space?  Or what about Kitelife?
> Thoughts?

Uh...maybe we should do this without any particular affliations other
than being fellow rec.kiters?

Ellen

 
 
 

----------->Entry level beginners kite page

Post by Bruce Hartma » Sun, 07 Jan 2001 10:04:33

Just for reference's sake, there's a UK company called homepagenames.com
(backed by Tucows) that only charges $17 a year for domain registration...
thanks to them I own a fleet of domain names.

Bruce


Quote:

> > Should we just use
> > the offer thats out there for kitz.com?

> Errr... kitz.com is an engineering company.

> The entire kitez.com namespace is occupied by the kitez.com search
> engine (and is an example of "you can do anything" at ourshack.com...)

> I currently use www.kites.tug.com for rec.kites stuff, which might be
> an appropriate place to do it, but if you want a domain specificaly
> for the project, that's fine (we have to hand over the $35 to
> NotworkSolutions or the like, but we can provide nameservice for
> as many domains as we like...)

> --
> Andrew Beattie

> The LAZIEST way to find kite pages ---------> http://www.kitez.com/
> ********** Win a T-shirt at http://www.kitez.com/tshirt.html **********
> My own stuff (Shona, Chevron, Veronica) ----> http://www.tug.com/
> Resources for rec.kites --------------------> http://www.kites.tug.com/
> Friendly, flexible host for your net stuff -> http://www.ourshack.com/

 
 
 

----------->Entry level beginners kite page

Post by joe » Sun, 07 Jan 2001 12:16:04

All,
       These are great ideas and I'll help however I can but as my
Grandfather would say "revenue, how are you going to get revenue?".    I
know its not about revenue its about improving the sport but it will
collapse on itself w/o adequate revenue.   Look at anything dot.com over the
past year.           What about the AKA shouldn't they be the biggest
advocates / sponsors of something like this?
        Some additional points:
        1.  I ( and many others)  live in an area with no local kite shops.
I web shop.    I teach people how to fly all the time and then I point them
to the web and they are on their own.  (Business cards with the web address
would be great for this)   Somehow there needs to be a link to the
suppliers/dealers/mfg to get a newbie a "first kite" (one of the recommended
ones) at some extremely low  price.    Wallmart has not helped any of us in
this matter.
        2.  AKA needs to be involved in this because they provide to the
festivals a LTF kit.   If any of you used the kit last year you know it was
good but it had a big drawback.   None of the kites in the kit were familiar
to any of us (at our local) who were there to teach.   Would have been nice
to know wind range etc. in english!     They were not familiar (U.S.)
brands. We ended up using our own gear.     If we are doing this the LTF kit
should be stocked with the "recommended" kites inorder to get people at the
festival a true test ride.
        The overall idea has merit and there is plenty of junkies out here
with the energy to make it happen.   Again how can I a non-web meister help?
Joe Ludwig
Quote:

> Uh...maybe we should do this without any particular affliations other
> than being fellow rec.kiters?

> Ellen

 
 
 

----------->Entry level beginners kite page

Post by Ellen Smit » Sun, 07 Jan 2001 13:07:13

Quote:

> All,
> These are great ideas and I'll help however I can but as my
> Grandfather would say "revenue, how are you going to get revenue?".    I
> know its not about revenue its about improving the sport but it will
> collapse on itself w/o adequate revenue.  

Good point. Andrew B. has supplied us with webspace, if not permanently,
at least temporarily. So that's covered. I figure the content will be
supplied either here, and transferred to the site or emailed if it's an
independent contribution such as a tip or recommendation of a flying
field, etc. I'm not clear where you see that there will be much if any
expense other than what should be paid to OurShack.

See, a big part of why we're getting all testy round here is cuz we're
frustrated with many of the same things. Turns out we are pretty much
all bummin about the same thing. So instead of sitting at our keyboards
ragging on each other, we can be sending off cool tips and stuff to this
public domain website, a freeware for kiters site, "knowing" that
somewhere down the road our efforts will invigorate growth in the sport,
as well as maybe enlighten us to more positive enjoyment of each other
and what we all have to offer each other.

First of all, we're gonna get that darn recommended starter kite list
put together. ;)

Quote:
>Some additional points:
>1.  I ( and many others)  live in an area with no local kite shops.
> I web shop.    I teach people how to fly all the time and then I point them
> to the web and they are on their own.  (Business cards with the web address
> would be great for this)   Somehow there needs to be a link to the
> suppliers/dealers/mfg to get a newbie a "first kite" (one of the recommended
> ones) at some extremely low  price.    Wallmart has not helped any of us in
> this matter.

This hasn't been discussed yet. Wonder how others feel about listing
retailers/manufacturer/e-stores. I'm not wild about the idea of actually
getting involved with that sort of thing. I would rather put together a
generic type discussion on how to locate a kite store or e-store and
what to ask, look for and expect in the way of service. This would
enable them to make good decisions on their own. But if someone has a
better idea, I'm open.

Quote:
>2.  AKA needs to be involved in this because they provide to the
> festivals a LTF kit.   If any of you used the kit last year you know it was
> good but it had a big drawback.   None of the kites in the kit were familiar
> to any of us (at our local) who were there to teach.   Would have been nice
> to know wind range etc. in english!     They were not familiar (U.S.)
> brands. We ended up using our own gear.     If we are doing this the LTF kit
> should be stocked with the "recommended" kites inorder to get people at the
> festival a true test ride.

Well, remember that the AKA is a local club and the newsie is
International...*grin*

Quote:
>The overall idea has merit and there is plenty of junkies out here
> with the energy to make it happen.   Again how can I a non-web meister help?
> Joe Ludwig

TIPS! Lots of tips. Start jotting them down. If there's one thing I've
learned about new kite flyers, they love the idea of getting under the
hood - they want to know how it all works. Project Flyer Jumpstart!

Ellen

 
 
 

----------->Entry level beginners kite page

Post by Pelicano » Sun, 07 Jan 2001 14:07:29

Andrew B. is The "Gaffer"

Quote:
>BTW/we gotta get some sort of
>nickname for you dude, cuz this is getting confusing

---------------
Jim Byrne
 
 
 

----------->Entry level beginners kite page

Post by Scott » Sun, 07 Jan 2001 14:58:41

At last a great thread to reply too.....

What Kiting needs is a good online community portal web site.... (there are
a couple of guys out there doing a great job at the moment, but I feel,
there's room for something special)

"What is a Web Portal" I here you ask;  A 'Kite portal' Web community.  It
is the most comprehensive, integrated collection of community building
software (database driven) in the industry. Easily manage a business
directory; Membership; ad server, promotions and contests, catalogs, news
and newsletters, events calendars, message boards, personal web page and
more.

If any company is out there interested in sponsoring one... I do have the
database driven web application to create this....



Quote:
> Andrew B. is The "Gaffer"

> >BTW/we gotta get some sort of
> >nickname for you dude, cuz this is getting confusing

> ---------------
> Jim Byrne

 
 
 

----------->Entry level beginners kite page

Post by Andrew Beatti » Sun, 07 Jan 2001 17:05:14

Quote:

> I think Andrew B. and his crew over at Ourshack will take VERY good care
> of us. If it were up to me however, I wouldn't mind seeing a catchy
> domain name like say, StuntKite101.com

That's a good suggestion.

The very name defines what the project is about.  This is a
*beginner's* page.  "Start here"...  The very name has helped
to crystalise in my mind exactly what we're trying to do here.

It *should* have it's own name, because that:
 - Dissassociates if from *me*.  I'm merely a part of the project,
   but it shouldn't in any way be seen as my project.
 - Dissassociates it from Ourshack.  If Ourshack might be a good
   place this year, but there might be a much better place next year,
   and it makes sense to keep it separate.

I have a couple of better (IMHO) suggestions for the domain name,
but I don't want to announce them in public.

Quote:
> That's really cool. Can you do something along the lines of what they
> have at Festivals.com?

Doesn't look like a problem.  Truth is, that I've not actualy *done*
an image map before, but I'm sure it's just a matter of a few lines
of Perl...

Quote:
> With mirrors? I wonder if Andrew B. [BTW/we gotta get some sort of
> nickname for you dude, cuz this is getting confusing] could handle the
> registration, initial housing and then approve the mirror sites. He's
> one smart guy.

You can call me Gaffer if you like.  I can mirror sites at the drop
of a hat.  Doing things like irc.dal.net -> a whole list of irc
servers is easy.  Doing things like having ellen.stuntkite101.com
gaffer.stuntkite101.com and walter.stuntkite101 pointing to different
places round the world is easy too.

Quote:
> I'm not clear where you see that there will be much if any
> expense other than what should be paid to OurShack.

Don't get hung up on the expense.  There is no need for the
"project" to subscribe.  For our immediate needs, I can handle
it.  But as things progress, it might make sense for *example*
for Ellen to take out a subscription and stick her personal
pages on ourshack, put her business pages here, and get more
heavily involved in the administration of this project...

I've got to catch a 'plane to orlando in a minute, but when I
get a chance, I'll set up a e-group-like mailing list to take
this discussion off-line (if I do it at ourshack, then we can

relevant).

--
Andrew Beattie

The LAZIEST way to find kite pages ---------> http://www.kitez.com/
********** Win a T-shirt at http://www.kitez.com/tshirt.html **********
My own stuff (Shona, Chevron, Veronica) ----> http://www.tug.com/
Resources for rec.kites --------------------> http://www.kites.tug.com/
Friendly, flexible host for your net stuff -> http://www.ourshack.com/

 
 
 

----------->Entry level beginners kite page

Post by NGKite » Mon, 08 Jan 2001 00:08:48


Quote:

> > That's really cool. Can you do something along the lines of what they
> > have at Festivals.com?

> Doesn't look like a problem.  Truth is, that I've not actualy *done*
> an image map before, but I'm sure it's just a matter of a few lines
> of Perl...

With some of the new design tools (f'rinstance, my favorite -- Dreamweaver),
image maps are a breeze. No need for any fancy programming....

I am a web-designer by profession. I can assist with this project as
well....

Ed Selby
Wind Is Free

 
 
 

----------->Entry level beginners kite page

Post by goodwinds2.. » Mon, 08 Jan 2001 03:27:35

Can we not take this discussion off-line?  IMO, its a rec.kites thing
and I'd like to see some real talent come out of the woodworks and
contribute to this.  But if we did have an e-groups type of list, it
would help keep everyone on the same page (is there a way to mirror
rec.kites into the e-group?).

I also like the idea of a unique URL.  It could mirror over to
Kitez.com for the content, but when we're handing out those business
cards we need a name that they all can remember if they misplace the
card. I like kites101.com.  There are some others, and I'd hope that if
we brainstormed in here they wouldn't get stolen.

So we've got:

Ellen
Gaffer
Ed Selby
Scotty Joe

Others I'm missing?

IMO, Ellen raises a good point with the international scope of this and
how its outside of the AKA.  Its a simple decision to make right now,
but if left to later on down the road its not so easy.

And the area map...I was thinking about this last night over a few
beers.  I got a little scared at how big the damn thing might be.
Still, its one of the best ideas about the site.  How do we structure
it so a person can go in there and with "minimal" clicks find the kite
store nearest to them?  Imagine a global listing of kite stores?

If we're referring newbie's to the kite stores, does it make sense that
the store must carry one of the "consumer reports rec.kites" tested and
approved kites?  Or does that not matter?

Damn....this is exciting.  Totally in line with what I think this sport
needs.  And as for the other suggestion about the database driven
portal....Gggoosshhh...you mean a "Yahoo" for the kite world?  Pinch me
please...



Quote:



> > > That's really cool. Can you do something along the lines of what
they
> > > have at Festivals.com?

> > Doesn't look like a problem.  Truth is, that I've not actualy *done*
> > an image map before, but I'm sure it's just a matter of a few lines
> > of Perl...

> With some of the new design tools (f'rinstance, my favorite --
Dreamweaver),
> image maps are a breeze. No need for any fancy programming....

> I am a web-designer by profession. I can assist with this project as
> well....

> Ed Selby
> Wind Is Free

Sent via Deja.com
http://www.deja.com/
 
 
 

----------->Entry level beginners kite page

Post by Scott » Tue, 09 Jan 2001 02:19:05

Hi

This is Scotty.... well this is one of the most interesting threads in the
rec.kites for months.... So there is people out there that actually feel the
same way as I do about the need for a great web site that will support the
kiting community....

Well, since you where the one that started this exciting thread I guess, you
have been nominated as the leader... ha ha.... please get in touch with the
others... so we can arrange some sort of Net Meeting or ICQ, to discuss this
project in full...

Cheers
Scotty


Quote:
> Can we not take this discussion off-line?  IMO, its a rec.kites thing
> and I'd like to see some real talent come out of the woodworks and
> contribute to this.  But if we did have an e-groups type of list, it
> would help keep everyone on the same page (is there a way to mirror
> rec.kites into the e-group?).

> I also like the idea of a unique URL.  It could mirror over to
> Kitez.com for the content, but when we're handing out those business
> cards we need a name that they all can remember if they misplace the
> card. I like kites101.com.  There are some others, and I'd hope that if
> we brainstormed in here they wouldn't get stolen.

> So we've got:

> Ellen
> Gaffer
> Ed Selby
> Scotty Joe

> Others I'm missing?

> IMO, Ellen raises a good point with the international scope of this and
> how its outside of the AKA.  Its a simple decision to make right now,
> but if left to later on down the road its not so easy.

> And the area map...I was thinking about this last night over a few
> beers.  I got a little scared at how big the damn thing might be.
> Still, its one of the best ideas about the site.  How do we structure
> it so a person can go in there and with "minimal" clicks find the kite
> store nearest to them?  Imagine a global listing of kite stores?

> If we're referring newbie's to the kite stores, does it make sense that
> the store must carry one of the "consumer reports rec.kites" tested and
> approved kites?  Or does that not matter?

> Damn....this is exciting.  Totally in line with what I think this sport
> needs.  And as for the other suggestion about the database driven
> portal....Gggoosshhh...you mean a "Yahoo" for the kite world?  Pinch me
> please...





> > > > That's really cool. Can you do something along the lines of what
> they
> > > > have at Festivals.com?

> > > Doesn't look like a problem.  Truth is, that I've not actualy *done*
> > > an image map before, but I'm sure it's just a matter of a few lines
> > > of Perl...

> > With some of the new design tools (f'rinstance, my favorite --
> Dreamweaver),
> > image maps are a breeze. No need for any fancy programming....

> > I am a web-designer by profession. I can assist with this project as
> > well....

> > Ed Selby
> > Wind Is Free

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