Last three days taper before marathon

Last three days taper before marathon

Post by Edwa » Thu, 10 Apr 2003 18:15:43


I am running London on Sunday and according to my schedule (Bruce
Tulloh's Sub 3.00 in Runners World)

Today (Wednesday)  4m slow (30min)
Thursday  Rest
Friday    Rest
Saturday  2m (15m) easy
Sunday    26.2 m (2h xxm)

2 questions:

Is rest on Thurs and Fri correct?

Is the 2m on Saturday good, and would some strides be a good idea?

I have followed this schedule reasonably closely and am feeling good,
but just wondered if this was the best way to complete the week.

TIA

Edward

 
 
 

Last three days taper before marathon

Post by am » Thu, 10 Apr 2003 23:41:56

Quote:

> I am running London on Sunday and according to my schedule (Bruce
> Tulloh's Sub 3.00 in Runners World)

> Today (Wednesday)  4m slow (30min)
> Thursday  Rest
> Friday    Rest
> Saturday  2m (15m) easy
> Sunday    26.2 m (2h xxm)

> 2 questions:

> Is rest on Thurs and Fri correct?

If you've followed the program up to now and feel good about it why
question it in the last 3 days?

Nothing you can do in the last 3 days, other than injuring yourself or
running a workout you can't recover from, is going to help or hurt.

Quote:

> Is the 2m on Saturday good, and would some strides be a good idea?

Strides have greater potential for injuring you than for helping you.

Quote:

> I have followed this schedule reasonably closely and am feeling good,
> but just wondered if this was the best way to complete the week.

Sounds reasonable to me.

my $0.02
Andy

 
 
 

Last three days taper before marathon

Post by rick » Thu, 10 Apr 2003 23:46:31

Quote:
> Is rest on Thurs and Fri correct?

I such running  light-normal just before the marathon.
I get jumpy if I take too many rest days.
Trying NEW things so close to a marathon may  not work.

 
 
 

Last three days taper before marathon

Post by Rivermis » Fri, 11 Apr 2003 03:25:27

I wouldn't even run the 2 miles the day before.


Quote:
> I am running London on Sunday and according to my schedule (Bruce
> Tulloh's Sub 3.00 in Runners World)

> Today (Wednesday)  4m slow (30min)
> Thursday  Rest
> Friday    Rest
> Saturday  2m (15m) easy
> Sunday    26.2 m (2h xxm)

> 2 questions:

> Is rest on Thurs and Fri correct?

> Is the 2m on Saturday good, and would some strides be a good idea?

> I have followed this schedule reasonably closely and am feeling good,
> but just wondered if this was the best way to complete the week.

> TIA

> Edward

 
 
 

Last three days taper before marathon

Post by Michael E. Care » Fri, 11 Apr 2003 06:52:12

I am a firm believer in using interval taper to prepare for a big race.
This would have me doing a few short intense intervals on Thursday and
Friday.  I always do absolutely nothing the day before a marathon.

If this is your first, or you really are not concerned that much with your
time, then I would not suggest interval taper.

Michael


Quote:
> I am running London on Sunday and according to my schedule (Bruce
> Tulloh's Sub 3.00 in Runners World)

> Today (Wednesday)  4m slow (30min)
> Thursday  Rest
> Friday    Rest
> Saturday  2m (15m) easy
> Sunday    26.2 m (2h xxm)

> 2 questions:

> Is rest on Thurs and Fri correct?

> Is the 2m on Saturday good, and would some strides be a good idea?

> I have followed this schedule reasonably closely and am feeling good,
> but just wondered if this was the best way to complete the week.

> TIA

> Edward

 
 
 

Last three days taper before marathon

Post by steve commo » Fri, 11 Apr 2003 07:57:20

Quote:

>Is rest on Thurs and Fri correct?

Yes. Perfect even. This is when you'll store the major part of the
glycogen you'll be needing on Sunday. If you can, spend as much time as
possible sitting or lying down. If you're used to it, a complete
stretching session can be good.

Also, get plenty of sleep these nights, Saturday's less important but
Friday's essential.

Quote:
>Is the 2m on Saturday good, and would some strides be a good idea?

Sounds OK. I used to do 20' easy + 5x200m at race pace put I don't think
it made any difference over a 20' jog.

Quote:
>I have followed this schedule reasonably closely and am feeling good,
>but just wondered if this was the best way to complete the week.

An unreserved yes!

Eat plenty of pasta, rice, potatoes and such and plenty of water. Fish
and poultry if you eat meat. Nothing too spicey and go easy on the
veggies on Saturday and avoid anything that "ferments" (cabbage, cauli,
baked beans :-).

Oh and no piss-up on Friday night :-)

 
 
 

Last three days taper before marathon

Post by Chris Smit » Fri, 11 Apr 2003 10:26:10

Quote:


> >Is rest on Thurs and Fri correct?

> Yes. Perfect even. This is when you'll store the major part of the
> glycogen you'll be needing on Sunday. If you can, spend as much time as
> possible sitting or lying down. If you're used to it, a complete
> stretching session can be good.

Steve, I bow to your speed and marathon chops compared to mine, but let me
ask you to say more about this answer. I have read (I think Pfitzinger) that
during glycogen loading in the two to three days prior to marathon day, it's
helpful to do a very short, very slow run as an added stimulus to glycogen
storing. What's your take on that?
thanks.
chris
 
 
 

Last three days taper before marathon

Post by Edwa » Fri, 11 Apr 2003 17:31:33

Quote:



> > >Is rest on Thurs and Fri correct?

> > Yes. Perfect even. This is when you'll store the major part of the
> > glycogen you'll be needing on Sunday. If you can, spend as much time as
> > possible sitting or lying down. If you're used to it, a complete
> > stretching session can be good.

> Steve, I bow to your speed and marathon chops compared to mine, but let me
> ask you to say more about this answer. I have read (I think Pfitzinger) that
> during glycogen loading in the two to three days prior to marathon day, it's
> helpful to do a very short, very slow run as an added stimulus to glycogen
> storing. What's your take on that?
> thanks.
> chris

Thanks for all the info guys - so much conflicting advice (have posted
this on runners world uk London Marathon Forum too).

What I am concerned with is that after such a heavy training schedule
in the foregoing three months, stopping for two days might lead my
body to "shut down".  That is what my training partner thinks (he is a
1m 45s 800 metre guy, and knows a thing or two about running).

I also thought I read somewhere about the run helping glycogen
loading, though I recalled that the run was supposed to be
eyeballs-out!  So confusing.

Edward

 
 
 

Last three days taper before marathon

Post by Edwa » Fri, 11 Apr 2003 19:49:35

Quote:

> I am running London on Sunday and according to my schedule (Bruce
> Tulloh's Sub 3.00 in Runners World)

> Today (Wednesday)  4m slow (30min)
> Thursday  Rest
> Friday    Rest
> Saturday  2m (15m) easy
> Sunday    26.2 m (2h xxm)

> 2 questions:

> Is rest on Thurs and Fri correct?

> Is the 2m on Saturday good, and would some strides be a good idea?

> I have followed this schedule reasonably closely and am feeling good,
> but just wondered if this was the best way to complete the week.

> TIA

> Edward

Have decided to do circuit training today - there is some running but
I can do that really slowly, and the rest of the stuff is just mild CV
work and muscle toning.  I just want to remind my body that there is a
big effort coming up and not to go to sleep!

Thanks for all the responses anyway - will let you know how it goes!

Edward

 
 
 

Last three days taper before marathon

Post by ah.. » Fri, 11 Apr 2003 22:32:39

Quote:
> What I am concerned with is that after such a heavy training schedule
> in the foregoing three months, stopping for two days might lead my
> body to "shut down".  That is what my training partner thinks (he is a
> 1m 45s 800 metre guy, and knows a thing or two about running).

--Don't worry!  If I race Sat I would take Thurs off and do about 3-4
ridiculously easy miles on Fri to loosen out and stretch.  I ALWAYS feel like
***the day before a marathon from backing off so much, but ALWAYS feel like
a prizefighter on the big morning.
Andy Hass
 
 
 

Last three days taper before marathon

Post by Keith Gemeinhar » Sat, 12 Apr 2003 00:00:31

I agree with what Andy said, and I'll add ...

If you don't feel restless during your taper, you're not doing it right.
If you're worried you're not running enough, you're doing it right.
If you find yourself having trouble sleeping, you're probably doing it
right.

-Keith

Quote:

>>What I am concerned with is that after such a heavy training schedule
>>in the foregoing three months, stopping for two days might lead my
>>body to "shut down".  That is what my training partner thinks (he is a
>>1m 45s 800 metre guy, and knows a thing or two about running).

> --Don't worry!  If I race Sat I would take Thurs off and do about 3-4
> ridiculously easy miles on Fri to loosen out and stretch.  I ALWAYS feel like
> ***the day before a marathon from backing off so much, but ALWAYS feel like
> a prizefighter on the big morning.
> Andy Hass

--
Keith Gemeinhart
Technology Service Corp.
Sebring, FL
--
 
 
 

Last three days taper before marathon

Post by Dot » Sat, 12 Apr 2003 01:10:26

Quote:

> I also thought I read somewhere about the run helping glycogen
> loading, though I recalled that the run was supposed to be
> eyeballs-out!  So confusing.

> Edward

I haven't had time to look for the article in my stack, but sometime
(maybe last fall) there was an article, probably by Owen Anderson and
probably in Running Research News but not sure. My recollection was that
a 3-min (yes, only 3 min) hard workout reduced glycogen (more so than
longer less intense runs), and then reload from there. But if you
haven't tried it before, now is not the time, esp. since there are
probably other parts to the article that I can't remember and may be
essential to the technique.

Good luck.

Dot

--
"Success is different things to different people"
-Bernd Heinrich in Racing the Antelope

 
 
 

Last three days taper before marathon

Post by steve commo » Sat, 12 Apr 2003 09:54:31

Quote:

>Steve, I bow to your speed and marathon chops compared to mine, but let me
>ask you to say more about this answer. I have read (I think Pfitzinger) that
>during glycogen loading in the two to three days prior to marathon day, it's
>helpful to do a very short, very slow run as an added stimulus to glycogen
>storing. What's your take on that?

If the training is really light, yes, I expect it should be OK. But I
hadn't heard that it actually helped. Interesting. And not at all
unreasonable. The light runs would maybe keep the enzymes levels higher
than by resting completely... Hmmmmmm.

I was aware of the "eyeballs out" run theory, but that was proposed (and
is still is), as the last run *before* carbo-loading (Wednesday or
Thursday morning before breakfast).

This turns out not to be particularly good value-for-money compared to
the tiredness and injury risks it can cause. One isolated run doesn't
have much effect on the overall enzymes activity.

Same with the strict "Scandinavian" diet. Not worth the hassle,
tiredness and risks, except maybe at international level.

Research by Taylor (1972) showed that the enzymes which is supposed to
be stimulated by the "exhaustion" run is actually very active already in
trained endurance athletes (5 times more than sedentary subjects).

Adolfsson provided more on this by having subjects pedal with only one
leg.

The conclusion was that, for a correctly-trained endurance athlete, 3
days of light training, on reduced carb diet, followed by three days
light training on high-carb diet was perfectly good enough, if  not
considerably better overall.

 
 
 

Last three days taper before marathon

Post by lust » Sat, 12 Apr 2003 19:50:48

Quote:

> Same with the strict "Scandinavian" diet. Not worth the hassle,
> tiredness and risks, except maybe at international level.

It is also the current "Scandinavian belief" that the (up to 3-day
fat-and-protein diet isnt really required and that the exhaustion
run need not be harder than 90-120(1) mins at moderate effort.

However, for some athletes the "old brute method" does bring a
better result; its just that a goal race isnt the proper time
to find out that you are not one of them...

(1) depending, of course, on the individual training load, but
a bit longer than "the average training run"

Quote:
> The conclusion was that, for a correctly-trained endurance athlete, 3
> days of light training, on reduced carb diet, followed by three days
> light training on high-carb diet was perfectly good enough, if  not
> considerably better overall.

Quite. If one wants to exeriment, one can then try either the PG-
rated - which I`ve found out to work for me - or the ***
Scandinavian stuff.

Anders