Statement Regarding "Drives" Accident (Philadelphia)

Statement Regarding "Drives" Accident (Philadelphia)

Post by bicycle thera » Wed, 26 Aug 1998 04:00:00


The following statement provides information concerning the July 8,
1997 bicycle accident involving Alice Sherlock that took place on West
River Drive in Philadelphia, PA.  The lawsuit is still continuing
against the other defendants.  We, Bicycle Therapy, Inc, Carlos and
Lee Rogers have been asked to circulate this statement among the
cycling community.  We apologize for any intrusion if this statement
is erroneously sent to any newsgroup or e.mail list.

STATEMENT

In return for ending a lawsuit brought against our store, Bicycle
Therapy, and ourselves personally, we have agreed, as members of the
Philadelphia cycling community, to make a monetary contribution to
help Ms. Sherlock defray the medical expenses associated with the
injuries she received as a result of the July 7, 1997 bicycle accident
that took place on West River Drive in Philadelphia.

As we have always maintained, we have great sympathy and are sorry for
what happened to Ms. Sherlock and the injuries that she sustained.
Although we were participating in the "Drives" on the night of the
accident, we did not witness Ms. Sherlock's crash, and we have
no information that would indicate that Ms. Sherlock was personally
responsible for what happened.

Although the "Drives" is a Philadelphia tradition enjoyed by many
local cyclists, participants must realize that they share the road
with others and must exercise care and caution when passing
recreational cyclists, rollerbladers, joggers, etc.

The lawsuit has been difficult for everyone involved and perhaps, if
those who had information about how the accident occurred would have
come forward, the need for litigation could have been avoided.

We hope that this unfortunate accident will not stop Ms. Sherlock from
continuing to cycle.  As owners of Bicycle Therapy, we welcome her
patronage at our shop, and we wish her all the best in her continuing
recovery.

Finally, we urge anyone who has any information about the
circumstances of the accident to come forward to assist Ms. Sherlock
in determining the cause of the accident.

Thank you,
Carlos Rogers
Lee Rogers
Bicycle Therapy, Inc
Philadelphia, PA

 
 
 

Statement Regarding "Drives" Accident (Philadelphia)

Post by Michael P. Hall » Wed, 26 Aug 1998 04:00:00

Say it isn't so!  I am glad to see you guys out from under this
but sorry you had to agree to a settlement.  I hope it didn't
cost you that much.
Quote:

> The following statement provides information concerning the July 8,
> 1997 bicycle accident involving Alice Sherlock that took place on West
> River Drive in Philadelphia, PA.  The lawsuit is still continuing
> against the other defendants.  We, Bicycle Therapy, Inc, Carlos and
> Lee Rogers have been asked to circulate this statement among the
> cycling community.  We apologize for any intrusion if this statement
> is erroneously sent to any newsgroup or e.mail list.

> STATEMENT

> In return for ending a lawsuit brought against our store, Bicycle
> Therapy, and ourselves personally, we have agreed, as members of the
> Philadelphia cycling community, to make a monetary contribution to
> help Ms. Sherlock defray the medical expenses associated with the
> injuries she received as a result of the July 7, 1997 bicycle accident
> that took place on West River Drive in Philadelphia.

> As we have always maintained, we have great sympathy and are sorry for
> what happened to Ms. Sherlock and the injuries that she sustained.
> Although we were participating in the "Drives" on the night of the
> accident, we did not witness Ms. Sherlock's crash, and we have
> no information that would indicate that Ms. Sherlock was personally
> responsible for what happened.

> Although the "Drives" is a Philadelphia tradition enjoyed by many
> local cyclists, participants must realize that they share the road
> with others and must exercise care and caution when passing
> recreational cyclists, rollerbladers, joggers, etc.

> The lawsuit has been difficult for everyone involved and perhaps, if
> those who had information about how the accident occurred would have
> come forward, the need for litigation could have been avoided.

> We hope that this unfortunate accident will not stop Ms. Sherlock from
> continuing to cycle.  As owners of Bicycle Therapy, we welcome her
> patronage at our shop, and we wish her all the best in her continuing
> recovery.

> Finally, we urge anyone who has any information about the
> circumstances of the accident to come forward to assist Ms. Sherlock
> in determining the cause of the accident.

> Thank you,
> Carlos Rogers
> Lee Rogers
> Bicycle Therapy, Inc
> Philadelphia, PA


 
 
 

Statement Regarding "Drives" Accident (Philadelphia)

Post by Adam Ri » Wed, 26 Aug 1998 04:00:00

Quote:

>In return for ending a lawsuit brought against our store, Bicycle
>Therapy, and ourselves personally, we have agreed, as members of the
>Philadelphia cycling community, to make a monetary contribution to
>help Ms. Sherlock defray the medical expenses associated with the
>injuries she received as a result of the July 7, 1997 bicycle accident
>that took place on West River Drive in Philadelphia.

This Alice Sherlock sounds like a real piece of work. I guess shops will
just stop sponsoring rides from now on. To be on the safe side, they
should stop selling bikes, too.

Maybe I'll file a suit against Alice for the mental anguish I have
suffered by contemplating her actions and the possible ramifications
thereof.

Cripes.


Austin TX USA | http://www.crossroads.net | XJ: Translation Jobs

 
 
 

Statement Regarding "Drives" Accident (Philadelphia)

Post by JPoulos4 » Wed, 26 Aug 1998 04:00:00

   That case with the Sherlock woman is the epitome of what is wrong with
America.  Someone may have been startled by a group of speeding cyclists and
swerved into them then sues people who were not even involved yet tried to help
her.  I normally could care less for leg shaving helmet wearing riders but this
is awful.  Sue the people directly responsible that is the American way but
leave innocent people alone.
 
 
 

Statement Regarding "Drives" Accident (Philadelphia)

Post by Jessica L. Moshe » Wed, 26 Aug 1998 04:00:00

Disclaimer:  I don't know anything about this case beyond the statement.

Quote:

> This Alice Sherlock sounds like a real piece of work. I guess shops will
> just stop sponsoring rides from now on. To be on the safe side, they
> should stop selling bikes, too.

Well, insurance and waivers are good things.

Quote:
> Maybe I'll file a suit against Alice for the mental anguish I have
> suffered by contemplating her actions and the possible ramifications
> thereof.

> Cripes.

Sometimes I wonder what would have happened to innovations in the past
few hundred years if we had had today's liability concerns.  Take the
invention of the Ordinary, for one...although we still ended up with the
Safety design...

--
---------------------------------------------------------
Jessica L. Mosher                     UniKix Technologies

"As soon as something transcends what one's expectations
are, you have to create a new category, rather than let
the category embrace them."  --Art Spiegelman

 
 
 

Statement Regarding "Drives" Accident (Philadelphia)

Post by Jeff DelPa » Wed, 26 Aug 1998 04:00:00


Quote:


>>In return for ending a lawsuit brought against our store, Bicycle
>>Therapy, and ourselves personally, we have agreed, as members of the
>>Philadelphia cycling community, to make a monetary contribution to
>>help Ms. Sherlock defray the medical expenses associated with the
>>injuries she received as a result of the July 7, 1997 bicycle accident
>>that took place on West River Drive in Philadelphia.

>This Alice Sherlock sounds like a real piece of work. I guess shops will
>just stop sponsoring rides from now on. To be on the safe side, they
>should stop selling bikes, too.

The initial suit was brought by her health insurance company,
attempting to recover their costs.  They have a whole department
devoted to this task, which they call "subrogation".

Yup, insurance companies have discovered that its more profitiable to
take the money you give them, and use it to sue people, rather than
pay claims with it.  It doesn't matter how sensible the grounds are
for including someone in the suit, with staff lawyers, it doesn't cost
significantly more to put 100 names on the paperwork as 1. Some of
them, when faced with defense costs, decide that paying to make them
go away is the lesser of two evils.

Alice may or may not agree with what her insurer did, she is likely
not allowed to comment. (nor will she see any of the money, the check
will go directly to the insurance company).  She had two choices, not
impede the suit, or let the insurance company out of paying for her
bill.

Yes, some people sue on their own in such cases.  Some even find a
lawyer to do it on contingent fee.  However since it does cost money
to mount such a case, most attorneys are careful about taking on the
low probability ones.  In this case, with no identifiably organizer
(that might have some sort of liability insurance, or assets), or list
of participants, it would difficult to find an independent lawyer
willing to gamble on what would likely be an expensive suit to bring,
that might just result in a meaningless judgement.

It wasn't an event, it was just a start time.  No sponsor, a large
number of (judgement resistant, if it has the age distribution typical
for a fast training ride) private citizens, that may or may not know
each others full names.

<dp>

 
 
 

Statement Regarding "Drives" Accident (Philadelphia)

Post by Dave Bail » Wed, 26 Aug 1998 04:00:00

Quote:


>>In return for ending a lawsuit brought against our store, Bicycle
>>Therapy, and ourselves personally, we have agreed, as members of the
>>Philadelphia cycling community, to make a monetary contribution to
>>help Ms. Sherlock defray the medical expenses associated with the
>>injuries she received as a result of the July 7, 1997 bicycle accident
>>that took place on West River Drive in Philadelphia.

>This Alice Sherlock sounds like a real piece of work. I guess shops will
>just stop sponsoring rides from now on. To be on the safe side, they
>should stop selling bikes, too.

>Maybe I'll file a suit against Alice for the mental anguish I have
>suffered by contemplating her actions and the possible ramifications
>thereof.

>Cripes.


>Austin TX USA | http://SportToday.org/ | XJ: Translation Jobs

How would you feel if you were out cruising along and suddenly got
mowed down by a group ride at full speed?  I sympathize with Alice
Sherlock, not the self-serving ***s (whoever they are) who
collectively let their ride get out of hand to the point where
somebody got ***led.  I'm not saying that Bicycle Therapy
specifically is responsible, and I wasn't there, but I think it's
bullshit to side with a bunch of people who clearly don't know
how to share the road.  I'm sure you know how crazy some group
rides can get.  It's just what happens when you stick too many
cat 3's in one place.

--
Dave Bailey

 
 
 

Statement Regarding "Drives" Accident (Philadelphia)

Post by Andrew Albrigh » Wed, 26 Aug 1998 04:00:00

Quote:

> How would you feel if you were out cruising along and suddenly got
> mowed down by a group ride at full speed?

That would suck.

But you show as much ignorance as you accuse Adam of.
Another scenario is that she turned her head left (when she heard bikes
passing on her left) and at the same time steered left into a large
group of cyclists.  As was pointed out when we had this thread before,
we probably won't ever know what really happened.

Quote:
> I sympathize with Alice
> Sherlock, not the self-serving ***s (whoever they are) who
> collectively let their ride get out of hand to the point where
> somebody got ***led.

Also, there was a bike path literally 10 yds from where she got hit on
the road, probably a better place for her.  (I only ride on the road
there when with a large group of riders.)

Quote:
> I'm sure you know how crazy some group
> rides can get.  It's just what happens when you stick too many
> cat 3's in one place.

Cat 3's are probably a minority on that ride.

Andrew Albright

 
 
 

Statement Regarding "Drives" Accident (Philadelphia)

Post by dann » Wed, 26 Aug 1998 04:00:00

You are an idiot.
Quote:
>How would you feel if you were out cruising along and suddenly got
>mowed down by a group ride at full speed?  I sympathize with Alice
>Sherlock, not the self-serving ***s (whoever they are) who
>collectively let their ride get out of hand to the point where
>somebody got ***led.  I'm not saying that Bicycle Therapy
>specifically is responsible, and I wasn't there, but I think it's
>bullshit to side with a bunch of people who clearly don't know
>how to share the road.  I'm sure you know how crazy some group
>rides can get.  It's just what happens when you stick too many
>cat 3's in one place.

>--
>Dave Bailey


 
 
 

Statement Regarding "Drives" Accident (Philadelphia)

Post by Andrew Albrigh » Wed, 26 Aug 1998 04:00:00

Quote:

> Great, so we're all equally ignorant in this matter.  Why do you
> think it is that not a single person on the ride knows what happened?

Here is why dipshit.  Because if you were on the ride and you saw what
happened and you open your mouth, then you are/were automatically sued,
whether or not you did anything wrong.  People riding at the back (at
least 100m probably) were sued and apparently had to pay for making it
known that they were on the ride.  People who took her flowers in the
hospital got sued.  Who needs to get sued?

Andrew Albright

 
 
 

Statement Regarding "Drives" Accident (Philadelphia)

Post by Bill Zaum » Wed, 26 Aug 1998 04:00:00


Quote:

> including *** fractures.  Nether the less, I can't help but wonder at
> the judgment of a recreational rider using a roadway and sharing her
> ride with cars doing 35 - 50 mph when there is a lovely bike path
> adjacent to the road.  She was familiar enough with the Drives to know
> of the existence of that path and the traffic conditions of the drives.

I don't want to comment on the details of this particular incident, but
it is worth pointing out that there are bike commuters who are very
competent at riding in traffic but who have little experience riding
in groups with the spacing between bikes that racers are comfortable
with.

A few months ago, I saw a group pass someone who complained quite
strenously that he did not have enough clearance. I think such desires
should be respected.  It would have been easy for the group to
use more of the traffic lane to pass this person (they already had
used enough that a car would not have been able to pass without
crossing over the centerline anyway).

Bill

 
 
 

Statement Regarding "Drives" Accident (Philadelphia)

Post by Peter Durdalle » Thu, 27 Aug 1998 04:00:00

Dave,

I understand your initial reaction.  Many, many rides including several
here in the phily area are just as you describe.  But not this one.  The
drives ride is a phila institution.  It was in existence even before I
came to phily in the early 70's.  And indeed for many years it was a
hell bent for leather, damn the tourists ride.

But this had changed in the past 3- 4 years.  (And I'll be the first to
say that I never thought it could have)  This change was brought about
by the responsible riding attitudes of the better riders who come out
every Tues. night and some of the club leaders in the area.

They started additional rides for slower riders and helped these folks
make the transition to skilled riding as opposed to speed only (Tri
State Velo in particular).  The high speed group began to ride strict
double pace line (rotating) with unsafe heroics left out of the mix.
(really we used to have people riding in both lanes and even in the
oncoming lanes during the "sprint finale".

Due the diligence of many, this ride became what I would call a shining
example of safe and responsible high speed training.

How this gal came to be hit is still not clear.  But she was an
inexperienced rider, I expect that she panicked as the a line of riders
came past her that was longer than she expected. You know how it is when
you don't counter steer as you turn your head; you go the way you are
looking.  I feel for the gal.  I have a friend who was in attendance at
the ER when she was brought in.  She suffered significant injury
including *** fractures.  Nether the less, I can't help but wonder at
the judgment of a recreational rider using a roadway and sharing her
ride with cars doing 35 - 50 mph when there is a lovely bike path
adjacent to the road.  She was familiar enough with the Drives to know
of the existence of that path and the traffic conditions of the drives.

All of the riders who I have talked to from that night are clear that
they left her plenty of room as they passed.  I know these folks.  I
believe them.

The degree of caring exhibited by the riders there and Bicycle Therapy
has been exemplary in this case.  They did not deserve to be hounded as
they have been.

Peter Durdaller,
Phila, PA

Quote:

> How would you feel if you were out cruising along and suddenly got
> mowed down by a group ride at full speed?  I sympathize with Alice
> Sherlock, not the self-serving ***s (whoever they are) who
> collectively let their ride get out of hand to the point where
> somebody got ***led.  I'm not saying that Bicycle Therapy
> specifically is responsible, and I wasn't there, but I think it's
> bullshit to side with a bunch of people who clearly don't know
> how to share the road.  I'm sure you know how crazy some group
> rides can get.  It's just what happens when you stick too many
> cat 3's in one place.

> --
> Dave Bailey


 
 
 

Statement Regarding "Drives" Accident (Philadelphia)

Post by Dave Bail » Thu, 27 Aug 1998 04:00:00

Quote:


>>How would you feel if you were out cruising along and suddenly got
>>mowed down by a group ride at full speed?  I sympathize with Alice
>>Sherlock, not the self-serving ***s (whoever they are) who
>>collectively let their ride get out of hand to the point where
>>somebody got ***led.  I'm not saying that Bicycle Therapy
>>specifically is responsible, and I wasn't there
>                                          ^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^^
>exactly.  so shut the *** up.

>how can you call people "self-serving ***s" when you werent even
>there?

Because of your face.

Quote:
>the "self-serving ***s" that were sued were 2 brothers who own bike
>shop who tried to be good samaritans and took the woman's bike to fix
>free of charge.  the "self-serving ***s" also included a philly
>cop/cyclist who rode in the ambulence with her as well as 2 guys who
>visited her in the hospital and took her flowers.

I never referred to those people specifically.  If the group had been
riding safely, do you think she would have been ***led?  Probably
not, right?  So isn't it true that the group's failure to ride safely
probably contributed directly to that woman's injuries?  And if the
ride was tooling along perfectly safely and the woman just swerved
right into the group, effectively taking herself out, then why aren't
there witness reports to that effect?  Where are the witnesses?
Were there any?  I mean, on a group ride, you'd think at least
somebody would see what happened, right?  Did anybody see?
What did they see?  Or did nobody see anything, which is exactly
what one would expect if the ride passed her too fast too close?
Shit, I mean, if there were witnesses on the ride who saw her swerve
into the ride, that would go a long way toward interfering with a
wrongful lawsuit, right?

--
Dave Bailey

 
 
 

Statement Regarding "Drives" Accident (Philadelphia)

Post by Dave Bail » Thu, 27 Aug 1998 04:00:00

Quote:


>> How would you feel if you were out cruising along and suddenly got
>> mowed down by a group ride at full speed?

>That would suck.

>But you show as much ignorance as you accuse Adam of.
>Another scenario is that she turned her head left (when she heard bikes
>passing on her left) and at the same time steered left into a large
>group of cyclists.  As was pointed out when we had this thread before,
>we probably won't ever know what really happened.

Great, so we're all equally ignorant in this matter.  Why do you
think it is that not a single person on the ride knows what happened?
Were they abducted by aliens, robbed of their memories of the
incident, then returned instantaneously to their bikes?

Quote:
>> I sympathize with Alice
>> Sherlock, not the self-serving ***s (whoever they are) who
>> collectively let their ride get out of hand to the point where
>> somebody got ***led.

>Also, there was a bike path literally 10 yds from where she got hit on
>the road, probably a better place for her.  (I only ride on the road
>there when with a large group of riders.)

Yeah, right.  Fuggen biker.  She shouldn't have been on the fuggen
road if she dinnit wanna git hit, 'ass all.

--
Dave Bailey