mind of the designer

mind of the designer

Post by David Scheid » Mon, 08 Apr 2013 02:43:37


I've got a bike with an Alfine 8 gear hub.  It's got a Versa VRS8
brifter.  I noticed the cable was fraying where the little stop bolt
clamps on it, and the stupid in line adjuster was borked, so it's time
for a new cable, housing, and inline adjsuter.  Acquire parts, start
to put it toether, and discover, after I've inserted the cable in the
shifter, that it uses a Campy cable.  Who the hell decides "I'm making
a shifter that's for a Shimano hub, lets make it take a silly unusual
cable that no one will expect!"  

Also, it's really hard to get a shimano head out of the socket.  A
dental pick with a complex shape was very useful.  ,

--
sig 71

 
 
 

mind of the designer

Post by Frank Krygowsk » Mon, 08 Apr 2013 03:23:36


Quote:
> Who the hell decides "I'm making
> a shifter that's for a Shimano hub, lets make it take a silly unusual
> cable that no one will expect!"

Maybe someone whose previous job was at Microsoft?

- Frank Krygowski

 
 
 

mind of the designer

Post by Jame » Mon, 08 Apr 2013 06:13:48


Quote:

>> Who the hell decides "I'm making
>> a shifter that's for a Shimano hub, lets make it take a silly unusual
>> cable that no one will expect!"

> Maybe someone whose previous job was at Microsoft?

Of course an ex Apple employee would design a hub that only fits a frame
also designed by an ex Apple employee, and is incompatible with
everything else.  The bottom bracket would be a BB31, and the integrated
bottle holders on the frame would require you to purchase their bottles
at $50 each.

Of course it would function well, and have a nice big colour LCD screen
on the handlebars.

--
JS

 
 
 

mind of the designer

Post by AMuz » Mon, 08 Apr 2013 06:35:01


Quote:


>>> Who the hell decides "I'm making
>>> a shifter that's for a Shimano hub, lets make it take a
>>> silly unusual
>>> cable that no one will expect!"

>> Maybe someone whose previous job was at Microsoft?

> Of course an ex Apple employee would design a hub that only
> fits a frame also designed by an ex Apple employee, and is
> incompatible with everything else.  The bottom bracket would
> be a BB31, and the integrated bottle holders on the frame
> would require you to purchase their bottles at $50 each.

> Of course it would function well, and have a nice big colour
> LCD screen on the handlebars.

But, as with Next, it could be magnesium, which burns
spectacularly.

--
Andrew Muzi
  <www.yellowjersey.org/>
  Open every day since 1 April, 1971

 
 
 

mind of the designer

Post by Jeff Lieberman » Mon, 08 Apr 2013 09:40:39

On Sat, 6 Apr 2013 17:43:37 +0000 (UTC), David Scheidt

Quote:

>I've got a bike with an Alfine 8 gear hub.  It's got a Versa VRS8
>brifter.  I noticed the cable was fraying where the little stop bolt
>clamps on it, and the stupid in line adjuster was borked, so it's time
>for a new cable, housing, and inline adjsuter.  Acquire parts, start
>to put it toether, and discover, after I've inserted the cable in the
>shifter, that it uses a Campy cable.  Who the hell decides "I'm making
>a shifter that's for a Shimano hub, lets make it take a silly unusual
>cable that no one will expect!"  

Many times, the decision of what sub-component to use is based on what
the designer had on hand, or which salesman arrived first with a
suitable sample.  Price also has an effect.  Please do not attribute
to malice, what could best be explained by laziness and convenience.

Quote:
>Also, it's really hard to get a shimano head out of the socket.  A
>dental pick with a complex shape was very useful.  ,

What you need is the overpriced special tool designed specifically for
the purpose.  Bad designs are very good for selling special tools.

--

150 Felker St #D    http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann     AE6KS    831-336-2558

 
 
 

mind of the designer

Post by Frank Krygowsk » Mon, 08 Apr 2013 10:00:44


Quote:



> >>> Who the hell decides "I'm making
> >>> a shifter that's for a Shimano hub, lets make it take a
> >>> silly unusual
> >>> cable that no one will expect!"

> >> Maybe someone whose previous job was at Microsoft?

> > Of course an ex Apple employee would design a hub that only
> > fits a frame also designed by an ex Apple employee, and is
> > incompatible with everything else. ?The bottom bracket would
> > be a BB31, and the integrated bottle holders on the frame
> > would require you to purchase their bottles at $50 each.

> > Of course it would function well, and have a nice big colour
> > LCD screen on the handlebars.

> But, as with Next, it could be magnesium, which burns
> spectacularly.

Actually, it turns out burning a NeXT chassis was never very easy at
all.  Here's an account of an attempt:
http://simson.net/hacks/cubefire.html

- Frank Krygowski

 
 
 

mind of the designer

Post by Dan » Mon, 08 Apr 2013 15:50:41


Quote:




> > >>> Who the hell decides "I'm making
> > >>> a shifter that's for a Shimano hub, lets make it take a
> > >>> silly unusual
> > >>> cable that no one will expect!"

> > >> Maybe someone whose previous job was at Microsoft?

> > > Of course an ex Apple employee would design a hub that only
> > > fits a frame also designed by an ex Apple employee, and is
> > > incompatible with everything else.  The bottom bracket would
> > > be a BB31, and the integrated bottle holders on the frame
> > > would require you to purchase their bottles at $50 each.

> > > Of course it would function well, and have a nice big colour
> > > LCD screen on the handlebars.

> > But, as with Next, it could be magnesium, which burns
> > spectacularly.

> Actually, it turns out burning a NeXT chassis was never very easy at
> all.  Here's an account of an attempt:http://simson.net/hacks/cubefire.html

(Solid) magnesium is not easy to ignite, but once it gets going, it
*is* spectacular.
 
 
 

mind of the designer

Post by Dan » Mon, 08 Apr 2013 15:50:53


Quote:
> On Sat, 6 Apr 2013 17:43:37 +0000 (UTC), David Scheidt


> >I've got a bike with an Alfine 8 gear hub.  It's got a Versa VRS8
> >brifter.  I noticed the cable was fraying where the little stop bolt
> >clamps on it, and the stupid in line adjuster was borked, so it's time
> >for a new cable, housing, and inline adjsuter.  Acquire parts, start
> >to put it toether, and discover, after I've inserted the cable in the
> >shifter, that it uses a Campy cable.  Who the hell decides "I'm making
> >a shifter that's for a Shimano hub, lets make it take a silly unusual
> >cable that no one will expect!"

> Many times, the decision of what sub-component to use is based on what
> the designer had on hand, or which salesman arrived first with a
> suitable sample.  Price also has an effect.  Please do not attribute
> to malice, what could best be explained by laziness and convenience.

> >Also, it's really hard to get a shimano head out of the socket.  A
> >dental pick with a complex shape was very useful.  ,

> What you need is the overpriced special tool designed specifically for
> the purpose.  Bad designs are very good for selling special tools.

systems
 
 
 

mind of the designer

Post by AMuz » Tue, 09 Apr 2013 04:43:39


Quote:




>>>>> Who the hell decides "I'm making
>>>>> a shifter that's for a Shimano hub, lets make it take a
>>>>> silly unusual
>>>>> cable that no one will expect!"

>>>> Maybe someone whose previous job was at Microsoft?

>>> Of course an ex Apple employee would design a hub that only
>>> fits a frame also designed by an ex Apple employee, and is
>>> incompatible with everything else.  The bottom bracket would
>>> be a BB31, and the integrated bottle holders on the frame
>>> would require you to purchase their bottles at $50 each.

>>> Of course it would function well, and have a nice big colour
>>> LCD screen on the handlebars.

>> But, as with Next, it could be magnesium, which burns
>> spectacularly.

> Actually, it turns out burning a NeXT chassis was never very easy at
> all.  Here's an account of an attempt:
> http://simson.net/hacks/cubefire.html

> - Frank Krygowski

Yeah, I've read that.  Never had such a large chunk of it
myself but magnesium burns just spectacularly. You oughta
try it.

--
Andrew Muzi
  <www.yellowjersey.org/>
  Open every day since 1 April, 1971

 
 
 

mind of the designer

Post by Jeff Lieberman » Tue, 09 Apr 2013 06:03:15

On Sat, 6 Apr 2013 18:00:44 -0700 (PDT), Frank Krygowski

Quote:

>> But, as with Next, it could be magnesium, which burns
>> spectacularly.

The autoignition temperature of magnesium is 473C.  It takes some
effort to get it to that temperature.  The problem is that magnesium
is a fair heat conductor, and will therefore try to cool down a hot
spot.  What usually happens is that it looks like it's starting to
burn, but then goes out.  After a few tries, the same thing happens
over and over.  Then, usually out of nowhere, the magnesium
autoignites and burns at about 3000C.  Until the magnesium gets to
that temperature, it won't burn.

Quote:
>Actually, it turns out burning a NeXT chassis was never very easy at
>all.  Here's an account of an attempt:
>http://simson.net/hacks/cubefire.html
>- Frank Krygowski

Photos:
<http://www.flickr.com/photos/nitroba/sets/72157594435480450/>

Several problems.  I already mentioned the heat spreading and
subsequent cooling problem.  Cast magnesium is never pure magnesium.
It's usually an alloy of aluminum, zinc and other elements,
<http://mg.tripod.com/asm_prop.htm>
where the non-magnesium contents can be as high as 15%.  Usually,
Aluminum is 5-12% of the mix, resulting in higher heat conductivity,
which makes autoignition more difficult.  That's probably what
happened in the NeXT Cube video.

Someone usually brings up the common magnesium "fire starter".
<http://www.google.com/patents/US4188192>
These are also not pure magnesium.  The magnesium content can vary
from 20-80%.  The remainder is a mix of pyrophoric (ignites
spontaneously when exposed to air or water) material, designed to make
it easier to ignite.  With the fire starter, the sparks ignite the
pyrophic material, which then ignites the magnesium.  Casting a
chassis or bike frame out of this stuff would be rather dangerous.
However, there's a problem.  Some of the Chinese clones (Coleman)
don't work.  
<http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=frDMAOlIGaY>
Doan brand works.

--

150 Felker St #D    http://www.LearnByDestroying.com
Santa Cruz CA 95060 http://802.11junk.com
Skype: JeffLiebermann     AE6KS    831-336-2558

 
 
 

mind of the designer

Post by Frank Krygowsk » Tue, 09 Apr 2013 07:38:38


Quote:





> >>>>> Who the hell decides "I'm making
> >>>>> a shifter that's for a Shimano hub, lets make it take a
> >>>>> silly unusual
> >>>>> cable that no one will expect!"

> >>>> Maybe someone whose previous job was at Microsoft?

> >>> Of course an ex Apple employee would design a hub that only
> >>> fits a frame also designed by an ex Apple employee, and is
> >>> incompatible with everything else. ?The bottom bracket would
> >>> be a BB31, and the integrated bottle holders on the frame
> >>> would require you to purchase their bottles at $50 each.

> >>> Of course it would function well, and have a nice big colour
> >>> LCD screen on the handlebars.

> >> But, as with Next, it could be magnesium, which burns
> >> spectacularly.

> > Actually, it turns out burning a NeXT chassis was never very easy at
> > all. ?Here's an account of an attempt:
> >http://SportToday.org/

> > - Frank Krygowski

> Yeah, I've read that. ?Never had such a large chunk of it
> myself but magnesium burns just spectacularly. You oughta
> try it.

My cousins and I did that in their ba***t when I was about 14 years
old.  They had a thin ribbon of commercially pure titanium.  I don't
know where they got it, but yes, it was extremely bright - or at
least, it seemed extremely bright down there in the ba***t.

Titanium chips will burn too, under the right conditions.  I knew a
machinist who said he learned that the hard way.

- Frank Krygowski

 
 
 

mind of the designer

Post by datakol » Tue, 09 Apr 2013 09:29:11

http://www.zagato-cars.com/contents/media/alfa_romeo_tz_1_007_sebring...