Sport Today

As a first topic on this list, I'll ask this.

Back at CMU, we had a saying that a person required three qualities in
order to fence: speed, technique, and ***lust. (and we taught all
three :-)

How do other people feel about this?

--
=======================================================================


Radiation Oncology     ||        (and)                 ||          

=======================================================================

--
=======================================================================


Radiation Oncology     ||        (and)                 ||          

=======================================================================

Also, I'd add intelligence to that list because you have to very quickly
(within about a 3-4 minute bout) assimilate (sp?) your opponent's style and
technique, and counter with your own.

--Sean Burke
Ohio State Fencing

--
Sean M. Burke   \ "Love is what goes on while you're NOT horny. . ."


IRC: Hanz (No, I won't pump U up.)\__________________________________________

Drew

|> =======================================================================


|> Radiation Oncology     ||        (and)                 ||            

|> =======================================================================
|>                                                              

-philo.
--
.....................
dakhlak.... hawn nazl s suruur?
                                (Ziad)
~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

        To keep them, you've got to hook them, and get them past the point
where they're thinking "I can't do this" to "I can do this".  No tips on this,
sorry.  I found that giving me an epee during the first week, and doing much
more than just footwork drills my first months, was enough to keep me going.
(The sixth session I held a blade, I lost 5-0.  Sigh.  But what can you expect
as a freshman new to the sport against a senior from a stronger school?)
And, once I understood what emotions were going on during the fight, and worked
with them instead of against them, I was fine.

                Joseph Beckenbach
--
----

        (speaking from, but not for, Ultra Network Technologies)

Now I also want to mention something that I was taught about the
Speed vs Technique thing.  Someo of us are physically faster
than others, but just because you are slow does not mean that
you can never be a good fencer.  Good technique can make up for a
lot of speed.  For example if you are sort of a slow beginner, but
you do your parry 4 as small as possible, then your repost (sp?)
will be faster then someone who may be physically much quicker
then you are.  Another example, for the slightly more advanced
fencer, is correct parry selection.  If your are attacked in a low
line ( say 7 ) and you try a counter 6, even if you make the parry,
no matter how fast you are, you are going to have a hard time
getting the repost.

So, I guess that you need intelligence and a good combination
of speed and technique to be a good fencer, with technique becomeing
more important at the higher levels of fencing. (Oh, and ***lust
is good for sabre fencers :-) )

Well, I guess that I ramble, but I am sort of e***d that there is
finally a fencing newsgroup :-)

                        Peace,
                                Randy

----------
Randy C. Paffenroth
Mathematician and Sabre Fencer

Bunda!?

I would add two things to the list: strength and endurance.  The first is
especially important for epee fencing.  I was always pretty quick, and I
was taught technique, but I really had to work to build up my arm strength
and my endurance, because anybody who was nearly as fast I was, but stronger
than I was, could take my blade *miles* out of line and skewer me before
I could respond.

The endurance thing was to prevent me from fencing with my elbow resting on
my hip after a few bouts.

I could talk about point accuracy, but I'm assuming that's part of "technique".

+--------------------------------------------------+
|Dave Cochran, Data General Corporation, RTP, NC   |

+--------------------------------------------------+
|"Most dogs are nicer than most people."           |
|                                   --Andy Rooney  |
+--------------------------------------------------+

        Raw speed and brute force will help you overpower beginners, and maybe
some low-intermediates.  After that it will certainly work against you to rely
on those over technique (especially relying on force).  Obviously speed is
an advantage, everything else being equal, but a smarter fencer or one with
better technique will usually beat a faster but less skilled fencer.

        Except against the very best fencers in our club the coach (and
top student) could basically walk towards you - no speed at all - and score
(all the while saying "find it! find it!" as you missed parry after parry).

        "***lust" is likely to merely cloud your thoughts when you need to
be analyzing the opponents reactions so you can find a way to take advantage
of them.  Against beginners you may be able to psych them out by being
agressive, but against intermediates they should be able to nail you if you
let "***lust" factor into your fencing.

--
To be or not to be = 0xff
-
Randell Jesup, Jack-of-quite-a-few-trades, Commodore Engineering.

Disclaimer: Nothing I say is anything other than my personal opinion.

My abstraction is:

  Here is a sport you might want to play.  The main rule is if you succeed in
  stabbing the other guy you get a point.

 which is no different in principle from

  Here is a sport you might want to play.  The main rule is if you succeed in
  throwing the ball through that hoop you get two points.

The fact that the manner of scoring bears a superficial resemblance to a way
people used to kill each other a few centuries ago doesn't really impress me or
interest me.  I realize that certain rules such as foil right-of-way are
justified in terms of the weapons' former killing properties, but so what?

It's also hard to justify the 40-50 millisecond rule for double touches in epee
when electronically scored, in terms of the weapon's previous use as a dueling
weapon.  In the Real World, pinkey touches barely count and double touches are
double touches even if they land a tenth of a second apart, but these rules do
make a much better game, so we use them.

-dk

I think cunning is more important than in most sports, although perhaps not
more important than in other martial arts.

-dk

IOSsnmn

Endurance is important, and especially in a long bout or a long tournament.
I have seen our a couple of our fencers knock the pants off the best of
our opponents in preliminary rounds, only to fizzle in the finals for lack
of energy.

--
---)----------                                                ----------(---

        Chico Fencing Club        California State University, Chico
---)----------                                                ----------(---

The Georgia State champion back in the mid '70's was 6'8" tall, fast as
lightning, and strong as an ox.  I fenced him frequently and rarely even
touched him, much less won a bout.  A move that would take most other
opponents' blades two feet out of line would not cause his blade to
waver more than inch or so, and it was simply because his wrist and
forearm were *so* strong that that he simply resisted the force of your
blade against his.

This ties in nicely with the "French grip" discussion that's going on.
I was taught that French grips would help your accuracy, while pistol
grips would help your strength.  After fencing for a bit with a French
grip, I found that I had quite good accuracy with the dip, but that
my blade could be taken more easily than I liked.

I switched to a Belgian pistol grip and, after a bit of point practice,
ended up winning a few championships and taking a second place overall
at the Southeastern Sectionals.  From there, I went to a German pistol
grip, had to work on my accuracy yet again, but my opponents had to
put a lot more behind their moves to take my blade out of line.  I know
that a lot of this has to do with the extension on the hilt that comes
down over the heel of the hand almost to the wrist (the grip doesn't
magically make one stronger), but I figured "hey, whatever works for
*me*".

+--------------------------------------------------+
|Dave Cochran, Data General Corporation, RTP, NC   |

+--------------------------------------------------+
|"Most dogs are nicer than most people."           |
|                                   --Andy Rooney  |
+--------------------------------------------------+