Volleybal Perceptions

Volleybal Perceptions

Post by Ditmars Veinbac » Sat, 23 Sep 1995 04:00:00


Quote:

>So what the heck is an "east coast" perception?

Flaming Ravioli asside, the coastal perception question brings up a
religious side to volleyball. The sport of Volleyball started 100
years ago in a small New England town. For the first 50 years or so
the east coast dominated. Volleyball power then moved west. Chicago then
to Texas and now to California.

I have attended serveral national championships in the past few years.
The big matches tend to follow the same script. Western team vs. any other
team. Big crowd support for "other" team. Western team dominates. West team
ussually wins... polite applause. "Other" team scores upset victory ...
wild applause followed by lot's of quotes and articles about how "Now
'they' finally have to notice 'us'". Ravi's comments merely feed into
the 'us' vs 'them' mentality. I have several questions for the group.

1) Why is the west coast perceived to be the leaders in volleyball?
Obvious Answer:     Because they are.
Snide Answer:       Good volleyball can only be played where the sun sets over
                    the water.
Environment Answer: The weather is warmer.
                    This makes Florida, Hawaii and Texas look good.
I'm looking for the deeper answer. Is it the program? The coaching?
Organizational leadership? A better public perception of the sport?
Title IX made it impossible to start a men's varsity program? What?

2) What is required to develop a consistent winner outside of CA?

3) I saw many comments this week about parity and NCAA women's reorg. When
will we have regional parity in volleyball? Which region will be promoted to
respectability first?

                        Ditmars

 
 
 

Volleybal Perceptions

Post by L. Ravi Narasimh » Sat, 23 Sep 1995 04:00:00


Quote:

>>So what the heck is an "east coast" perception?
>Flaming Ravioli asside, the coastal perception question brings up a

         ^^^^^^^
Wow, first time I've heard that today.

Quote:
>I have attended serveral national championships in the past few years.
>The big matches tend to follow the same script. Western team vs. any other
>team. Big crowd support for "other" team. Western team dominates. West team
>ussually wins... polite applause. "Other" team scores upset victory ...
>wild applause followed by lot's of quotes and articles about how "Now
>'they' finally have to notice 'us'". Ravi's comments merely feed into
>the 'us' vs 'them' mentality. I have several questions for the group.

Methinks you take things too literally.  

Quote:
>1) Why is the west coast perceived to be the leaders in volleyball?
>Obvious Answer:     Because they are.
>Snide Answer:       Good volleyball can only be played where the sun sets over
>                    the water.
>Environment Answer: The weather is warmer.
>                    This makes Florida, Hawaii and Texas look good.

                                ^^^^^^^^            ^^^^^
Florida, Hawaii, and Texas are West Coast?

Quote:
>I'm looking for the deeper answer. Is it the program? The coaching?
>Organizational leadership? A better public perception of the sport?
>Title IX made it impossible to start a men's varsity program? What?

I think all of the above.  These areas have strong juniors programs.
California has a large concentration of the middle to upper-middle
class families that have the wherewithal to send their kids to clubs
and such.  

Quote:
>2) What is required to develop a consistent winner outside of CA?

More of the messianic efforts at the lower age groups levels.
If this happens,  California schools cannot continue to stockpile
the way they have.  As programs grow throughout the country, players
will not feel the need to come to California for high-caliber
competition.  I believe that's the way basketball and football have
played out.

Quote:
>3) I saw many comments this week about parity and NCAA women's reorg. When
>will we have regional parity in volleyball? Which region will be promoted to
>respectability first?

The regions will have to stabilize first.  It seems the NCAA renames
things every couple of years or so.  

I think serious volleyball fans in California do respect Nebraska,
Florida, Penn State, and other first-rate non-California programs.
Who cares what region they happened to be placed in?

If you are asking about the casual southern California fan who
staggers in to the gym after a hard day of surfing and applied
narcotics, the answer is probably never, no matter how good the rest
of the country gets.  Just like many hardened Ivy Leaguers who think
that there is no intellectual heft west of Philadelphia.

                        --- Oski
                            Paahk yeh caar in Haavahd yaaahd

 
 
 

Volleybal Perceptions

Post by Ditmars Veinbac » Tue, 26 Sep 1995 04:00:00

Quote:

>> >>So what the heck is an "east coast" perception?

>> >Flaming Ravioli asside, the coastal perception question brings up a
>>         ^^^^^^^
>> Wow, first time I've heard that today.

Baked or broiled ravioli is one of my favorite side dishes, but I wouldn't
recommend a diet of it.

Quote:
>> Methinks you take things too literally.  

There is always a hint of truth in any piece of humor. The original
comment which lead to this "east" v "west" sub-thread was that some
announcers emit a "west is best" attitude. I don't agree with the
opinion, but I do see the attitude on a regular basis.  I suggest
that this could be good for the sport.  UCLA was on a mission last
year at the NCAA's, now other programs might want to prove that 1994
wasn't a fluke. Healthy rivalry can produce better competition. What is
needed to produce a broad-based competitive sport like NCAA basketball?

Quote:
>> I think all of the above.  These areas have strong juniors programs.
>> California has a large concentration of the middle to upper-middle
>> class families that have the wherewithal to send their kids to clubs
>> and such.  

I don't buy the "VB is a upper-middle class sport" answer. VB is
similar to basketball. Basketball is perceived as an "urban sport".
How many NBA stars had mummy and daddy supporting their BB education?
I think urban areas could be the growth regions for volleyball.
What is the catalyst to make this happen?

Quote:
>> I think serious volleyball fans in California do respect Nebraska,
>> Florida, Penn State, and other first-rate non-California programs.
>> Who cares what region they happened to be placed in?

Of course they respect these few programs, mainly women's programs, but not the
leagues or HS/Juniors? I like what has happened in the last few years
to Women's VB. Cable TV, Title IX, the basball strike, etc etc has been
a big boost to women's and girl's programs.  I envision more competitive
"eastern" women's programs in the years to come. I expect winners in the
mid-western states, Florida and Texas. These areas are nearing critical mass.
What about the rest of the country? What about men's programs? People have
justly questioned the talent pool for the new NVL. Without a variety of quality
jr's and college teams, VB may be destined to pander weak beer on
the beaches of So. CA.

                        Ditmars
                        There is no parking in Harvard Yard!

 
 
 

Volleybal Perceptions

Post by Dan Ferr » Wed, 27 Sep 1995 04:00:00

: 1) Why is the west coast perceived to be the leaders in volleyball?
: Obvious Answer:     Because they are.
: Snide Answer:       Good volleyball can only be played where the sun sets over
:                     the water.

I don't know, I think the "east coast" players from Ft. Lauderdale,
Cocoa, and Daytona are just as good as the "west coast" players from
Tampa, Siesta Key, and St. Pete.

df

"it's all in the perspective"

 
 
 

Volleybal Perceptions

Post by Julie C. Die » Wed, 27 Sep 1995 04:00:00


Quote:


>: 1) Why is the west coast perceived to be the leaders in volleyball?
>: Obvious Answer:     Because they are.
>: Snide Answer:       Good volleyball can only be played where the sun sets over
>:                     the water.

Snider answer: Because they recruit from the Midwest.

Quote:

>I don't know, I think the "east coast" players from Ft. Lauderdale,
>Cocoa, and Daytona are just as good as the "west coast" players from
>Tampa, Siesta Key, and St. Pete.

If y'all were coaching I think you would be missing out on players from
Chicago (SPRI) etc.  Of course, that doesn't bring up Thater,etc,etc.

Just my 4,000,000 pesos worth

Jim D.

 
 
 

Volleybal Perceptions

Post by L. Ravi Narasimh » Wed, 27 Sep 1995 04:00:00


        [ Vinny, Johnny, and Angela deleted ]

Quote:
>There is always a hint of truth in any piece of humor.

Not in the Vinny, Johnny, and Angela post.

The original

Quote:
>comment which lead to this "east" v "west" sub-thread was that some
>announcers emit a "west is best" attitude. I don't agree with the
>opinion, but I do see the attitude on a regular basis.  I suggest
>that this could be good for the sport.  UCLA was on a mission last
>year at the NCAA's, now other programs might want to prove that 1994
>wasn't a fluke. Healthy rivalry can produce better competition. What is
>needed to produce a broad-based competitive sport like NCAA basketball?

Most volleyball on TV these days is the AVP.  Their announcers are
part of a plan to market a lifestyle, not a sport.  And the
centerpiece of that lifestyle is the sybaritic California beach culture.
Your comments about healthy rivalry are well taken, however, I thought
your original post focussed on why things are rather than where they
ought to be.

Quote:
>>> I think all of the above.  These areas have strong juniors programs.
>>> California has a large concentration of the middle to upper-middle
>>> class families that have the wherewithal to send their kids to clubs
>>> and such.  
>I don't buy the "VB is a upper-middle class sport" answer. VB is
>similar to basketball. Basketball is perceived as an "urban sport".
>How many NBA stars had mummy and daddy supporting their BB education?
>I think urban areas could be the growth regions for volleyball.
>What is the catalyst to make this happen?

Let us think present and future separately.  I strongly believe that
volleyball has thus far been a sport for the country club set.  It
takes money to buy the equipment, pay for the coaching and travel, and
so forth.  Does it have to stay this way?  Hell no.  And thus the need
to continue messianic efforts to take the game to kids who ordinarily
would not be exposed to it and to find ways to pay for those costs.
I would not volunteer any time for this effort, but, I'd contribute to
a good program that did.

I think there is nothing wrong with trying to switch the marketing
emphasis away from youth and beauty to something "longer term."  It is
usually the case that youth and beauty marries rich and powerful.  At
which point it surrenders the Lite Beer, boogie board, and volleyball
for vintage wines, Mercedes, and golf.

Quote:
>>> I think serious volleyball fans in California do respect Nebraska,
>>> Florida, Penn State, and other first-rate non-California programs.
>>> Who cares what region they happened to be placed in?
>Of course they respect these few programs, mainly women's programs, but not the
>leagues or HS/Juniors? I like what has happened in the last few years
>to Women's VB. Cable TV, Title IX, the basball strike, etc etc has been
>a big boost to women's and girl's programs.  I envision more competitive
>"eastern" women's programs in the years to come. I expect winners in the
>mid-western states, Florida and Texas. These areas are nearing critical mass.
>What about the rest of the country? What about men's programs? People have
>justly questioned the talent pool for the new NVL. Without a variety of quality
>jr's and college teams, VB may be destined to pander weak beer on
>the beaches of So. CA.

Well, what about them?  This raises again the separate issue about how to grow
the game.  I'd suggest that NCAA Div. I football be spun off as an
adjunct to a University's academic mission and be tied in with revenue
producing programs such as Graduate and Professional Schools.  Since
that will never happen, I think volleyball must be grown by continuing
to expand the player base and by having rabid fans bring in their
friends/lovers to matches, turning them on to good sport.  The
rivalries ought to develop naturally.

As far as NCAA men's programs, I am worried.  Very worried.

                                --- Oski
                                    Plan 9 from Outer Space