Sport Today

by **Rex Gee Quan L** » Wed, 18 Sep 1991 19:54:31

I'm kinda new to this sport since I haven't really taken it very
seriously until about 2 years ago.

I've read a little bit about how to set, but I still haven't discovered
EXACTLY how one is supposed to set LEGALLY and PRECISELY.

So far I've heard from various people that you're suppose to shape your
fingers to the ball, make a "window" around your eyes, and "flip" the
ball off your fingers just before you think that you might "catch" the
ball. From this information, I have been able to set for the most part
fairly quietly and accurately, but a few people don't like the way I set
because it almost seems like I'm holding or carrying the ball.

So I have a few questions:

Should there be a sound when I make a set?

And how do you get your fingers so that the ball always goes "straight"
off them (i.e. doesn't spin and also goes straight forward or
backwards)?

Finally, sometimes I find my hands making a "window" around my nose
instead of my eyes... Is this legal?

Thanks for any advice!

- Rex

by **Nick Christenson, University of Arizo** » Thu, 19 Sep 1991 06:16:16

Quote:

>I'm kinda new to this sport since I haven't really taken it very
>seriously until about 2 years ago.

Welcome to the sport.

Quote:

>I've read a little bit about how to set, but I still haven't discovered
>EXACTLY how one is supposed to set LEGALLY and PRECISELY.
>So far I've heard from various people that you're suppose to shape your
>fingers to the ball, make a "window" around your eyes, and "flip" the
>ball off your fingers just before you think that you might "catch" the
>ball. From this information, I have been able to set for the most part
>fairly quietly and accurately, but a few people don't like the way I set
>because it almost seems like I'm holding or carrying the ball.

Sounds pretty good, except that you need to make *sure* that you don't
actually catch it because that is, as you know, what we call "illegal."

Quote:

>So I have a few questions:

>Should there be a sound when I make a set?

I think the "silent set" quality is overrated, but it certainly doesn't
hurt. If you hear a loud slapping sound when you set the ball something
is wrong.

Quote:

>And how do you get your fingers so that the ball always goes "straight"
>off them (i.e. doesn't spin and also goes straight forward or
>backwards)?

You practice a lot. I can't really offer anything more specific than that.
Get a teammate to toss you uniform spinless tosses for you to set for
a while. Once you know where those are going, you can more easily
compensate for a pass that comes toward you with significant rotation.

Quote:

>Finally, sometimes I find my hands making a "window" around my nose
>instead of my eyes... Is this legal?

I find myself doing the same thing every now and then. *I* don't think
it's so bad and I haven't found a corellation between that and poor or
illegal sets, but others may have different advice. Let it go much
lower and it's a carry, plain and simple, though.

Final analysis which is little better than a complete guess:
My guess is that you are using too much wrist action to propel the ball.
Unless you're making a jump set or some sort of tricky misdirection set
(and I assume you're not if you're just starting) most of the velocity
on the ball should come from your legs and *not* from your wrists.
If you're using too much wrist action to propell the ball that could
account for your problem. Again, without seeing you set, there's not
much more I can offer to help.

Quote:

>Thanks for any advice!

No problem, I hope this helps.

Quote:

>- Rex

PS: One more suggestion. Go to as many VB games as you can, men's or
women's, sit in the front row and watch the setter. Try to mimic his/her
motion. How much leg, shoulder and wrist movement do they use? Where
are their hands? How far apart are their legs?

Nick Christenson

#include <disclaimer.h>

by **Daynerd Kaena Freitas/1000** » Thu, 19 Sep 1991 00:18:38

Quote:

>I'm kinda new to this sport since I haven't really taken it very
>seriously until about 2 years ago.

>I've read a little bit about how to set, but I still haven't discovered
>EXACTLY how one is supposed to set LEGALLY and PRECISELY.

>So far I've heard from various people that you're suppose to shape your
>fingers to the ball, make a "window" around your eyes, and "flip" the

IMHO, you flip the ball using your wrists NOT your fingers!

Quote:

>ball off your fingers just before you think that you might "catch" the
>ball. From this information, I have been able to set for the most part
>fairly quietly and accurately, but a few people don't like the way I set
>because it almost seems like I'm holding or carrying the ball.

>So I have a few questions:

>Should there be a sound when I make a set?

Rex, I have been a "back-up" setter for many teams I have
played for in Hawaii, and since moving to Austin, TX..I
have become a "starting" setter. But I have been doing it
for approximately 7 years now. The books and coachs can
only teach a person so much. I picked up setting basically
on my own. Sure I had the technique taught to me like
where your hands should be, and the shape "diamond" or "window" in
front of your eyes, etc. But until I really started practicing
and playing as a setter, I really did not know what setting was
all about. The main thing about setting is the rotation.
You must be able to take a ball that may be coming with a
lot of rotation and be able to make it float with little or
no rotation after it hits your hands.
Although considered to have "very" soft hands by my fellow
'A' league teammates, here in Austin, I was considered only a
"backup" to three other setters on 'A' teams I played with in
Hawaii. The time it takes any individual to become a "touch"
setter is really dependant on the individuals ability. There
are some people on teams I have played on who have played
10+ years and can not set. Granted many of them did not choose
to set and probably never practiced it as much, but it comes
off their hands really "ugly." To answer this question, when
you become "good," the sets will almost "flow" off your hands
and the sound will be minimal.

Quote:

>And how do you get your fingers so that the ball always goes "straight"
>off them (i.e. doesn't spin and also goes straight forward or
>backwards)?

You will not be able to ALWAYS get the ball to go straight off
your fingers. A drill I used to like to do to strengthen my
fingers was to stand about a foot from the wall, bounce the ball
at about eye/forehead height using your setters hand(window)
position. Just concentrate on the movement of your wrists back
and forth as the ball leaves your hand. This will allow you
to adjust your fingers quickly to the eratic movements of the
ball. Its a matter of adjustment, done in a "split-second".

Quote:

>Finally, sometimes I find my hands making a "window" around my nose
>instead of my eyes... Is this legal?

Part of the ball MUST be above your head when a set is taken!
Most of the times you will be call for a "lift" if taken
too low.
--
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++---------------++++++++++++++++++++++++
Daynerd Kaena Freitas

by **Arnold Snip** » Thu, 19 Sep 1991 17:44:28

Quote:

>I'm kinda new to this sport since I haven't really taken it very
>seriously until about 2 years ago.

>I've read a little bit about how to set, but I still haven't discovered
>EXACTLY how one is supposed to set LEGALLY and PRECISELY.

>So far I've heard from various people that you're suppose to shape your
>fingers to the ball, make a "window" around your eyes, and "flip" the
>ball off your fingers just before you think that you might "catch" the
>ball. From this information, I have been able to set for the most part
>fairly quietly and accurately, but a few people don't like the way I set
>because it almost seems like I'm holding or carrying the ball.

Being a setter for a few years I would say: Making the window is clearly a
good point. I can't figure out what you do with your arms, I would advise you
to keep them almost straight , and put most power in your set by stretching
your legs. Keeping your arms almost straight above your head makes it easier
to do sets behind you. The holding question is more difficult, the rule book
says that ball-contact should be short; it depends on the referee when
he calls a carry.

Quote:

>So I have a few questions:

>Should there be a sound when I make a set?

I have seen people make sets almost without making a sound, but they were
really GOOD players. You don't need to avoid making a sound with a set.

Quote:

>And how do you get your fingers so that the ball always goes "straight"
>off them (i.e. doesn't spin and also goes straight forward or
>backwards)?

Spin usually appears when you use to much hand-movement; Try to do the
aiming with your hands, adjust power with your knees.Try to watch
good setters.

Quote:

>Finally, sometimes I find my hands making a "window" around my nose
>instead of my eyes... Is this legal?

As long a you don't carry or double hit it's legal, although my experience
is that if you hit the ball to low (***-heigth or something like that)
it mostly results in a carried ball.

--

--[ Arnold ]--

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

by **John Johns** » Fri, 20 Sep 1991 00:29:36

While I'll not claim to be an incredible setter myself, my understanding is
that a good setter might appear to carry the ball because they'll start with
their hands above the point where they'll actually hit the ball, bring their
hands down (making subtle adjustments as the ball comes closer to their hands)
and then make their hit. I guess it is easier to adjust if you sort of let
the ball follow your hands down. Good luck!

John

by **Anthony Bangra** » Fri, 20 Sep 1991 01:40:59

--

Quote:

Nick Christenson writes:

most of the velocity on the ball should come from your legs and
*not* from your wrists

What exactly does this mean? Should you move your wrists or not.
Do you drive through the ball with you legs and leave your wrists
stiff. I've seen good players *just* use their wrists, snapping
them from the start position (the "frame" around your face) to
be open.

start: finish:
o o <-- ball
< > > < <-- hands
| | | | <-- arms

Sorry for the silliness of the illustration. I hope you get the idea :)

------------------------------------------------------------------

"Your lips move, but I can't hear what you're saying..." - P.Floyd

by **Van K.** » Fri, 20 Sep 1991 03:06:09

Would anyone like to explain why setting a ball that is below head height
immediately considered illegal? It seems that setting is itself a carry
and if the same motion is used, it shouldn't matter where the set comes
from.

This reminds me of the refs who see someone digging a ball out of the net
with one arm in the famous lift motion and immediately calls a lift, even
if it was done with a fist.

Van Vo
Washington Univ. VBC

by **sta..** » Fri, 20 Sep 1991 13:03:17

Quote:

> I'm kinda new to this sport since I haven't really taken it very
> seriously until about 2 years ago.

> I've read a little bit about how to set, but I still haven't discovered
> EXACTLY how one is supposed to set LEGALLY and PRECISELY.

> So far I've heard from various people that you're suppose to shape your
> fingers to the ball, make a "window" around your eyes, and "flip" the
> ball off your fingers just before you think that you might "catch" the
> ball. From this information, I have been able to set for the most part
> fairly quietly and accurately, but a few people don't like the way I set
> because it almost seems like I'm holding or carrying the ball.

> So I have a few questions:

> Should there be a sound when I make a set?

> And how do you get your fingers so that the ball always goes "straight"
> off them (i.e. doesn't spin and also goes straight forward or
> backwards)?

> Finally, sometimes I find my hands making a "window" around my nose
> instead of my eyes... Is this legal?

> Thanks for any advice!

> - Rex

Everything I've heard on this topic (well almost) sounds reasonable.
What I've found though, is that sometimes the ball spins off my hands because
my hands are sweaty. Always keep them dry...I've found wiping my hands on the
soles off my shoes helps (ie.wiping off the dust/dirt). Also, when setting (not
jump setting obviously) kepp your knees bent as you take the ball, and as your
arms straighten, so too should your legs.

Antony

by **Jim Bee** » Fri, 20 Sep 1991 22:22:03

Nick Christenson writes:
most of the velocity on the ball should come from your legs and
*not* from your wrists

What exactly does this mean? Should you move your wrists or not.
Do you drive through the ball with you legs and leave your wrists
stiff. I've seen good players *just* use their wrists, snapping

You can use just your wrists but you get a lot more control if most of the power
comes from the legs.

Jim

by **Arnold Snip** » Fri, 20 Sep 1991 20:53:38

Quote:

>--

>Nick Christenson writes:
> most of the velocity on the ball should come from your legs and
> *not* from your wrists

>What exactly does this mean? Should you move your wrists or not.
>Do you drive through the ball with you legs and leave your wrists
>stiff. I've seen good players *just* use their wrists, snapping
>them from the start position (the "frame" around your face) to
>be open.

>start: finish:
> o o <-- ball
> < > > < <-- hands
> | | | | <-- arms

>Sorry for the silliness of the illustration. I hope you get the idea :)

Got the idea, surely I use some wrist motion, but this is only to do
the catch-throw motion and adjusting spin . As others allready reported
the strentgh to do high set-ups comes from the knee movement.

--

--[ Arnold ]--

---------------------------------------------------------------------------

by **EASO** » Sat, 21 Sep 1991 00:10:30

Quote:

> Nick Christenson writes:
> most of the velocity on the ball should come from your legs and
> *not* from your wrists

> Do you drive through the ball with you legs and leave your wrists
> stiff. I've seen good players *just* use their wrists, snapping

>You can use just your wrists but you get a lot more control if most of the power
>comes from the legs.

Where does the Wisdom Of The Net say that the elbows fall in the list of
power sources for a set? Should your elbows point out (to the sides of
your body)? We've hashed out the fingers, wrists, & legs....

Though I'm far from a Good Setter, I've been told to "receive" the ball,
bending my elbows as the ball comes in, closing contact between my hands
(fingers, really) and the ball. The release is the opposite motion,
springing the wrists out. Most of this seems like an arm/elbow action.

Net?

--
Bill Eason - EE (DSP) grad student || campus: Box 28021 GA Tech Station
work: GTRI/CSITL, ERB Room 173 || Atlanta, GA 30332
347 Ferst Drive Atlanta GA, 30332 ||===================================

by **Richard Pottor** » Sat, 21 Sep 1991 07:02:11

I don't claim to be the world's best setter, far from it; but I was taught
to set by Eric Sato; yes, the Gary Sato, setter of the 1988 US Men's
Olympic Volleyball championship team, at an Athletic Sports Foundation
Camp.

We were taught that most of the force on the ball is supplied by snapping
wrists, that leg motion was only something you needed to do if you were
really weak, and or had to set the ball a long way.

They started teaching us to set, Eric, and a few other people like Steve
Suttich, Lynda Johnson, Kent Miller, Greg Giovanizzi, Gary Sato, Leann
Sato, the San Jose Golddiggers' vball coach, and lots of other
"high name recognition people".

The first thing was to have our elbows bent at about a 90 degree angle, the
fingers making a window about a volleyballs width apart, with the palms
facing toward the ball.

Next was to let the ball come into our fingers, not to try to catch it, but
let it settle in and pull our fingers toward our faces.

Once we felt the ball pulling our fingers toward our faces, we were to snap
our wrists, propelling the ball outward and upward. They were saying that
they used this method to increase the time of ball/finger contact without
holding the ball.

I get mixed reactions from the people I play with. When I first started
setting this way, a guy who we paid to referee our games, and who was/is an
excellent sand player thought my sets were great; but my teammates thought
I was holding/carrying the ball.

I still get this kind of comment. High level players compliment me on my
soft hands and great sets; and low level players keep telling me I'm
lifting/catching/throwing the ball.

I remember the people at the saying that the time the ball spends in
contact with your hands is not as important as whether or not the ball
visibly comes to rest while in contact with your hands.

I have sped up my hand motion quite a bit since that camp; I still get
compliments on soft hands (you should see my callouses :-)); and not quite
as many lifting complaints. (I don't take the people who complain about my
setting attack serves, try to set serves with the ball spinning backwards,
etc., take them terribly seriously.)

Anyway, rather than try to learn to set from what I, or anyone else writes,
find a good junior college program and take a beginner class; that's where
they reall start teaching fundementals. Also, The Athletic Sports Foundation
address is 2150 N. Broadway, Walnut Creek, CA 94596; phone (415) 945-7933.
A three day camp is about $100, plus food and lodging.

I have no financial interest in the ASF, except as a satisfied customer.
Call them and see if they'll be in your area, soon.

Ramblin'

by **Daynerd Kaena Freitas/1000** » Fri, 20 Sep 1991 23:26:06

Quote:

>Would anyone like to explain why setting a ball that is below head height
>immediately considered illegal? It seems that setting is itself a carry
>and if the same motion is used, it shouldn't matter where the set comes
>from.

I think its because if you really study the motion.....you will notice
that it is REALLY not the same motion. Place your hands in a normal
setting position forming the "window" in front of your eyes/forehead
and notice your arm/hand positions. Next, bring your hands to a
position lower than your head, notice it looks more like the motion
you would use to "catch" a ball rather than set one. A lot of it
depends on the Ref and how close they call your hands, but when I
am calling "top", depending on the league of course, which in my
case is 'A', I call them close. If that ball comes off a "chest"
on a set, I will definately call it.

Quote:

>This reminds me of the refs who see someone digging a ball out of the net
>with one arm in the famous lift motion and immediately calls a lift, even
>if it was done with a fist.

This is a good point and I have seen this happen a lot but everyone
is human. I have made some calls that did not make me popular either
but some calls will be questionable and other are blatant. If a ref
makes too many "bad" calls he should be replaced. It doesn's always
happen but I have seen it in a few cases.

--
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++---------------++++++++++++++++++++++++
Daynerd Kaena Freitas

by **Daynerd Kaena Freitas/1000** » Sat, 21 Sep 1991 02:16:14

Quote:

> Nick Christenson writes:
> most of the velocity on the ball should come from your legs and
> *not* from your wrists

> What exactly does this mean? Should you move your wrists or not.
> Do you drive through the ball with you legs and leave your wrists
> stiff. I've seen good players *just* use their wrists, snapping

>You can use just your wrists but you get a lot more control if most of the power
>comes from the legs.

Not to be antagonistic or anything but what about jump setting?
does the power come from your legs also? It seems that most
professional, at least indoor, v-ball setters are jump setters.
I am not sure I agree with this statement.
--
+++++++++++++++++++++++++++++---------------++++++++++++++++++++++++
Daynerd Kaena Freitas

by **Graeme Wong S** » Sat, 21 Sep 1991 16:59:54

Another question related to setting is how many fingers do people use to
set? I've seen pictures of various people setting in Volleybal Monthly
and other mags. Some seem to just use the thumb and index fingers, others
thumb, index and middle fingers, other use all they got! Is there a
recommended number to help reduce risks of double hitting when
setting, improve control etc etc etc??

graeme

--

Canon Information Systems Research Australia | Phone: +1 61 2 805 2912
P.O. Box 313 North Ryde, NSW, Australia 2113 | Fax: +1 61 2 805 2929

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