Cougar my view

Cougar my view

Post by David Drive » Fri, 07 Jun 1996 04:00:00


I would like to make a few points about the destruction of Keighley
Cougars on Sunday by Salford. I dont normally write to these groups due
to the fact that they are usually just letters attacking other people
teams. But I thought you might like to know the views of the fans on the
terraces, who have paid good money to see their side cave in.
I am a Keighley Cougars fan but that doesnt stop me been impressed with
Salfords attacking style of play. Most of the Keighley fans were
expecting to lose but not by such a great margin. I believe one of the
reasons for the loss was due to negative play, before I left the house
last Sunday I had said to my father  that we would be killed if we played
down the middle of the Park. Nobody in there right mind takes on forwards
three stones heavier and four inches taller with the midgets we have
playing at Keighley. Are only chance was to move the ball about and back
up the man in procession, something Keighley fail to do week in week out.
Salford on the other hand moved the ball around and got the ball away in
the tackle, this is the only way to break down defenses, and something
Wigan and St. Helens do every week. Phil Larder will no doubt say in
this weeks Keighley News that we lacked six of are first team players.
While this might be true, all the thir*** men playing on Sunday were
full time professionals and were all playing in there position apart from
the Scrum Half. These men are supposed to be there to replace injured
players, but to put it bluntly are not good enough. Of the men on Sunday
only Keith Dixon (too light), Joe Berry (too small), Steve Hall (doesnt
pass the ball), David Larder(too small, too light) and Andrew King showed
any kind of passion for the team they were playing for. On the scrum half
position we had a very good replacement in Darren Appleby who some like
myself think was better than first choice Chris Robinson. What does
Larder do but sell him to Batley, we now have no Scrum half at the club
apart from Andy Eyres injured and a young lad Gwilliams who is still
learning.
You have to take your hat of to Salford for putting together a great set
of players.  The secret to any successful team is to have large players
with pace and strength, if a thir*** stone man runs into a six*** stone
man he is going to come of second best as on Sunday.
I would also like to ask rival supporters why they hate Keighley Cougars
so much, the team as spent loads of money improving the ground and team
to better themselves. We are only trying to get better and bring a little
success to a town that as ever had any. I try to like all teams as I
support Rugby League and dont wish to see Lindsay sell use out to Union.
 In fact I think you will found that Keighley Cougar fans dont dislike
any other team apart from them been rivals for promotion. Only the
Bradford Bulls are disliked, but this is more down to there council
taking Keighley community charge  money to pay for all its facilitates,
so you cant blame the Bulls for that really.
On a final point I most comment on the attacks by Salford supporters on
this newsgroups about the ground. Keighleys ground is one of the newest
grounds in the league, only the main stand is over four years old. It had
to be said that the fencing which gave way was only there to pin
adverti***ts too. It was not designed for Salford fans to jump up and
down on.
PS. For further comments on what went wrong in my opinion on Sunday check
out my web site at http://SportToday.org/;
where I pull no punches in what I class to be bad coaching and tactics.
My outspoken views are probably one reason why my Internet site gets no
help or assistance from the club where as the inferior  Cougarmania Site
get a mention every week in the program. All the best Salford for when
you get in the Super League if you do,  be warned Lindsays about and he
might just but let in another team that is half way down the second
division.

A disillusioned Cougar fan .

 
 
 

Cougar my view

Post by Paul McNal » Sat, 08 Jun 1996 04:00:00

On Thu, 06 Jun 1996 18:35:01 -0700, David Driver

Quote:

>On a final point I most comment on the attacks by Salford supporters on
>this newsgroups about the ground. Keighleys ground is one of the newest
>grounds in the league, only the main stand is over four years old. It had
>to be said that the fencing which gave way was only there to pin
>adverti***ts too. It was not designed for Salford fans to jump up and
>down on.

Let me start by saying I wholeheartedly agree with the rest of your
post but the section above is total bollocks. Let's just clear one
thing up, fencing should not just be there in any ground in any sport
"just to pin adverti***ts too" and even if it is, those nails
pinning it were rusty, dangerous and disgraceful. Every ground in the
country has to pass stringent safety checks. The fencing around The
Willows which ads "pinned on" is steel, cemented into the ground and
stress tested regularly. On two occasions over the past couple of
years sections of the ground have been temp. closed because stress
tests were unable to be carried out on time for one reason or another.
People could get  pushed against our fences and they simply wouldn't
give way.
Another thing. There is a distinct lack of crush barriers which I
thought had to be installed on grounds with a capacity of over 4500.
The barriers should be there to stop mass pessure being applied to the
perimeter fencing and also to rest your coffee on!
And the last point. Salford fans were not "jumping up and down on
them". As I've said, there was a surge (ever been to a football match)
and people fell down the terrace (cos of lack of CBarriers). Perhaps
three or four people hit the fence at pace. Two of which ended up
quite badly hurt which can't be right.
The ground should accomodate the supporters not the supporters
accomadate the ground.
The warning sign is that there were maybe 300 Salford fans under the
posts. God help you if you ever get a couple of thousand St Helens
fans and a similar thing happens. Fan safesty should be more important
than the signing of Sonny Whakaru (who we incidently pulled out of
signing and after Sun. I can see why ;)

Tra!
Paul

 
 
 

Cougar my view

Post by Ryan O'Neil » Sun, 09 Jun 1996 04:00:00


Quote:
> Let's just clear one
> thing up, fencing should not just be there in any ground in any sport
> "just to pin adverti***ts too" and even if it is, those nails
> pinning it were rusty, dangerous and disgraceful. Every ground in the
> country has to pass stringent safety checks.

Quite true Paul, so what exactly are you trying to say ?..... that we haven't had any safety checks.. if you are really keen to know we had a large safety inspection only 2 weeks before last sunday's
match.  You'll be pleased to know the the ground passed with flying colours.

Quote:
> The fencing around The
> Willows which ads "pinned on" is steel, cemented into the ground

Oh... that sounds very safe doesn't it !  Let's picture this... a sudden surge forward in the crowd
and the all of the supporters at the front are crushed... at least with wooden fences they are collapsable under severe pressure , which there happened to be last sunday when about 20 drunk Salfod fans insisted on making fools of themselves by 'rolling
 around the terracing. (I think that there is more chance of a Hillsborough type disaster at the Willows, than there is to happen at Couagr Park).

Quote:
> People could get  pushed against our fences and they simply wouldn't
> give way.

I think this point has been dealt with above !

Quote:
> Another thing. There is a distinct lack of crush barriers which I
> thought had to be installed on grounds with a capacity of over 4500.

You were obviously at a different ground last sunday !   Bradford Council have one of the most
strictest safety regulations in the country when it comes to crash barriers, and for your notice
Cougar Park has crash bariers in adequte numbers to comply with this regulatioin.

Quote:
> The barriers should be there to stop mass pessure being applied to the
> perimeter fencing and also to rest your coffee on!

Or rather beer (from the state of some Salford fans last sunday)

Quote:
> And the last point. Salford fans were not "jumping up and down on
> them". As I've said, there was a surge (ever been to a football match)
> and people fell down the terrace (cos of lack of CBarriers).

This is absolute trash... garbage... and  none-sensical !  The Chief Safety Oficer & Police chief
both agreed that there had been some distrubance in the area of the 'accident' prior to kick off,
with loutish behaviour.  When the game was underway the Salford fans continuously jumped
about, forcing the fencing to collapse.  If you noticed when it fell that the stupid people acctualy
enjoyed falling over and jumping ontop of one another  

Quote:
> Two of which ended up
> quite badly hurt which can't be right.

NO it is not right, but  it was self inflicted, and no matter how much you try and blame the Cougar
club, it was the Salford group's fault (or at least the majoirty) for acting in such a puerile manner .

To say that I was insensed with your message is an nunderstatment.  No matter how much you
try and wriggle the blame onto the Cougars, i'm afraid that the only cause for the accident was the
fans themselves....

In response to an early message that you sent deploring our stadia.... you will be pleased to
know that we have plans submitted to demolish the wooden stand and build a new 'cantuilever'
stand, with the scrattin' shed side also having a stand 'cantilevered' over the top of the terracing.

You beat us very well, and congratulations for that.  But beware at the Willows when we meet
again.  With murmurings already in the pipeline, we will be a different side to what we were last
week !

I hope that this e.mail answers your critisisms fairly.

Yours cougarly

--
Ryan O'Neill
Vote Conservative at the next election... and watch out for cheap imitations, there is a 'Blur' on
the horizon.

 
 
 

Cougar my view

Post by Paul McNal » Tue, 11 Jun 1996 04:00:00

On Sat, 08 Jun 1996 21:11:31 GMT, Ryan O'Neill

Quote:

>Quite true Paul, so what exactly are you trying to say ?..... that we haven't had any safety checks..

 if you are really keen to know we had a large safety inspection only
2 weeks before last sunday's
Quote:
>match.  You'll be pleased to know the the ground passed with flying colours.

The two people who got hurt will be doubtless pleased to know that
too.

Quote:
>> The fencing around The
>> Willows which ads "pinned on" is steel, cemented into the ground

>Oh... that sounds very safe doesn't it !  Let's picture this... a sudden surge forward in the crowd
>and the all of the supporters at the front are crushed... at least with wooden fences they are collapsable under severe pressure , which there happened to be last sunday when about 20 drunk Salfod fans insisted on making fools of themselves by 'rolling
> around the terracing. (I think that there is more chance of a Hillsborough type disaster at the Willows, than there is to happen at Couagr Park).

Just as a matter  of interest Ryan do you believe that  fencing at
stadia should be designed to collapse? I think that history has a
record of various structures collapsing at football matches causing
great injury and death. Heysel Stadium had a wall collapse etc.
The whole point is if a ground a structured properly with correct
crush barrier placing you can NEVER get a build-up of severe pressure.
And besides two lads falling against a fence is hardly severe but if
you have wood nailed to wood it is going to give way and dangerously.

Quote:
>> The barriers should be there to stop mass pessure being applied to the
>> perimeter fencing and also to rest your coffee on!

>Or rather beer (from the state of some Salford fans last sunday)

Fair enough some were drunk, but we're not playing girls hockey here.
We're playing in the big league of spectator sports where some fans
are gonna get pissed but for the sake of peace maybe the police should
have stopped some coming in.

Quote:

>> And the last point. Salford fans were not "jumping up and down on
>> them". As I've said, there was a surge (ever been to a football match)
>> and people fell down the terrace (cos of lack of CBarriers).

>This is absolute trash... garbage... and  none-sensical !  The Chief Safety Oficer & Police chief
>both agreed that there had been some distrubance in the area of the 'accident' prior to kick off,
>with loutish behaviour.  When the game was underway the Salford fans continuously jumped
>about, forcing the fencing to collapse.  If you noticed when it fell that the stupid people acctualy
>enjoyed falling over and jumping ontop of one another  

Behave yourself. What are you talking about, before the kick off? The
incident happened after a try. There was no disturbance, I was there,
nothing different happened than right throughout the game other than
some fans lost their balance and fell when celebrating. Nobody forced
the fence to collapse. NO pressure was applied until the accident. I'm
not entirely sure anybody enjoyed the experience for a few seconds it
was really scary.

Quote:

>> Two of which ended up
>> quite badly hurt which can't be right.

>NO it is not right, but  it was self inflicted, and no matter how much you try and blame the Cougar
>club, it was the Salford group's fault (or at least the majoirty) for acting in such a puerile manner .

What  do your stewards get payed for? There were too many people
behind that goal and if they were misbehaving as badly as you suggest
how come none were ejected?

Quote:

>To say that I was insensed with your message is an nunderstatment.  No matter how much you
>try and wriggle the blame onto the Cougars, i'm afraid that the only cause for the accident was the
>fans themselves....

As I suppose it was at Hillsborough and Heysel. The thing is Ryan, to
people like you the club are never to blame are they? And regardless
of what changes are being made at the moment if the fences fall down
the ground is not up to scratch. Can you imagine the fuss if part of
Old Trafford fell down?

Quote:
>You beat us very well, and congratulations for that.  But beware at the Willows when we meet
>again.  With murmurings already in the pipeline, we will be a different side to what we were last
>week !

For your sake I hope so. It may well be too late by that stage though!

Quote:
>Vote Conservative at the next election... and watch out for cheap imitations, there is a 'Blur' on
>the horizon.

Jesus.
 
 
 

Cougar my view

Post by Vibrating Bum-Faced Goa » Wed, 12 Jun 1996 04:00:00

: NO it is not right, but  it was self inflicted, and no matter how much you try and blame the Cougar
: club, it was the Salford group's fault (or at least the majoirty) for acting in such a puerile manner .

Self inflicted? That has to be the biggest pile of cougarshit I've ever
heard in my life.

: To say that I was insensed with your message is an nunderstatment.  No matter how much you
: try and wriggle the blame onto the Cougars, i'm afraid that the only cause for the accident was the
: fans themselves....

Bollocks Ryan. Every club, even the righteous Cougars, has an obligation
to look after all fans who visit the stadium. It's the responsibility of
the club to make sure they are safe and, if misbehaving and proving a
danger to others, to do something about it.

Keighley does fail in this respect. For example, in the last Joe Phillips
Trophy played at Cougar Park I was verbally abused by someone because I
had the audacity to wear a Bradford Northern shirt. The situation was
getting ugly and I had my 18 month old niece in my arms at the time and
she was very upset at all these big men shouting at each other. I
walked away and told a steward who politely informed I was big enough to
look after myself. He refused to give me his name but my letter to the
club had a full description of him. I would like to think he no longer
works there but, since the club didn't have the courtesy to send so much
as an acknowledgement never mind an apology, I have absolutely no idea.

The upshot is that I'm not going back to that hole again and I wish
nothing but misfortune, relegation and bankrupcy on the Cougars.

: --
: Ryan O'Neill
: Vote Conservative at the next election... and watch out for cheap imitations, there is a 'Blur' on
: the horizon.

Natural Law man myself, you get a better class of nappy to wear.

--
Bradford Bulls RLFC      | Rugby League Home Page:
Wembley Finalists 1996   | http://www.brad.ac.uk/~cgrussel/
British Beef - You won't | Full club-by-club guide to the 1996
get better!              | European Super League season

 
 
 

Cougar my view

Post by Adam Lawrenc » Wed, 12 Jun 1996 04:00:00


Quote:
>Keighley does fail in this respect. For example, in the last Joe Phillips
>Trophy played at Cougar Park I was verbally abused by someone because I
>had the audacity to wear a Bradford Northern shirt. The situation was
>getting ugly and I had my 18 month old niece in my arms at the time and
>she was very upset at all these big men shouting at each other. I
>walked away and told a steward who politely informed I was big enough to
>look after myself. He refused to give me his name but my letter to the
>club had a full description of him. I would like to think he no longer
>works there but, since the club didn't have the courtesy to send so much
>as an acknowledgement never mind an apology, I have absolutely no idea.

>The upshot is that I'm not going back to that hole again and I wish
>nothing but misfortune, relegation and bankrupcy on the Cougars.

There is, as we all know, a very fine line between supporting your team
and creating an intimidating atmosphere in which the visiting team feels
uncomfortable, and outright hostility. That's why I think so many people are worried about the tendency of Bradford, Keightley, etc, to wind up
the crowd. I know, I know, it's all in good fun, and generally it is.
But there comes a time when baying fans and booing the opposition can go
too far.

We all of us go on and on about how great the spirit is at League
grounds. No segregation, virtually no ***, etc, etc, etc. But if SL
is going to work, we are going to have to attract lots of new fans
who've no heritage in the game. Maybe they'll be football fans, maybe
they'll come from other sports. Either way, there aren't that many big
spectator sports which retain the kind of terrace atmosphere we have. I
worry that, if the game is successful in growing its audience, we'll
lose it.

If the players get intimidated, how are the fans going to feel.

Adam

 
 
 

Cougar my view

Post by COAJC » Thu, 13 Jun 1996 04:00:00

Quote:
> The upshot is that I'm not going back to that hole again and I wish
> nothing but misfortune, relegation and bankrupcy on the Cougars.

Great words,
        Before I knew better, I used to consider Keighley as my 'second
team', as I was well impressed by the way they had gone from facing
bancrupcy to the top, and in such 'style'.
        So, I decided to go to Cougar Park one time in the last 'proper'
season, as Leeds had played on a Friday night. I decided to wear my Leeds
shirt, to show my allegance and I've never been barracaded by so much
bollocks in my life. The 'cougar-maniacs' were, and probably still are
the biggest set of w***ers going. I don't like to generalise as I'm sure
there are a few decent fans, as at any club, but if they'd any sense,
they'd have left by now anyway. Upon leaving at half time - my old man
couldn't stand any more - it made me wonder that if that's how a money
paying neutral is treated, god help the opposition. The ground's a pit as
well, and I hope that Bramley or anybody gets fast-tracked to SL, just to
fob you lot off again, because it was ***y funny when you were so
'cruelly' denied entry last time.

If there's a Cougar fan out there that'd like to constructively defend
their club I'm all ears, but it would take a hell of a lot of persuading
to get me any where near Cougar Park (or Lawkholme Lane as I prefer to
call it)

Salford 45 Keighley 8, what a great result that was - and this coming
from a Yorkshireman.

Cheers, Al.

 
 
 

Cougar my view

Post by Adam Lawrenc » Thu, 13 Jun 1996 04:00:00

Quote:

>> The upshot is that I'm not going back to that hole again and I wish
>> nothing but misfortune, relegation and bankrupcy on the Cougars.

>Great words,
>    Before I knew better, I used to consider Keighley as my 'second
>team', as I was well impressed by the way they had gone from facing
>bancrupcy to the top, and in such 'style'.
>    So, I decided to go to Cougar Park one time in the last 'proper'
>season, as Leeds had played on a Friday night. I decided to wear my Leeds
>shirt, to show my allegance and I've never been barracaded by so much
>bollocks in my life. The 'cougar-maniacs' were, and probably still are
>the biggest set of w***ers going.

It's weird that the two worst tales of Cougar Park should be from
neutrals. I went there last time we played, wearing my Fartown shirt, it
was a good game, big crowd, pouring rin, etc. - plenty of banter, but no
particular aggression. Maybe there's safety in numbers?

Adam

 
 
 

Cougar my view

Post by Stephen M » Thu, 13 Jun 1996 04:00:00

: It's weird that the two worst tales of Cougar Park should be from
: neutrals. I went there last time we played, wearing my Fartown shirt, it
: was a good game, big crowd, pouring rin, etc. - plenty of banter, but no
: particular aggression. Maybe there's safety in numbers?

: Adam

I hate going there, it's ***y awful.  Their fans have to be the most
obnoxious and ignorant lot in the league,  and all this cougarmania
business is frankly embarrassing.  

It's also one of the worst grounds I've been to.  At least some of the
other ***grounds ( Watersheddings, Recreation ground, Tattersfield
etc..) had a bit of charm and felt like they had tradition, Cougar Park
is just a hole.

I hope they never go up.

Stephen


 
 
 

Cougar my view

Post by COAJC » Fri, 14 Jun 1996 04:00:00

S

Quote:

> I hate going there, it's ***y awful.  Their fans have to be the most
> obnoxious and ignorant lot in the league,  and all this cougarmania
> business is frankly embarrassing.

> It's also one of the worst grounds I've been to.  At least some of the
> other ***grounds ( Watersheddings, Recreation ground, Tattersfield
> etc..) had a bit of charm and felt like they had tradition, Cougar Park
> is just a hole.

> I hope they never go up.

> Stephen

 The man speaks sense, good words fella'!!

  Cheers, Al.

 
 
 

Cougar my view

Post by Paul Dinsda » Fri, 14 Jun 1996 04:00:00

Quote:

>Great words, Before I knew better, I used to consider Keighley as my

'second team'...

Quote:
>If there's a Cougar fan out there that'd like to constructively defend

their club I'm all ears, but it would take a hell of a lot of persuading
to get me any where near Cougar Park (or Lawkholme Lane as I prefer to
call it)

I fail to see how anybody could 'constructively defend' anything against
such an irrational tirade, but let me have a go.

I once went to Spain. While I was there somebody stole a pen out of my
jacket pocket. Therefore ALL Spaniards are thieving bastards and also 'the
biggest set of w***ers going'. Oh, and by the way Peter Sutcliffe (aka The
Yorkshire Ripper) comes from Bradford, therefore ALL Bradfordians go round
***ing young women.

Just as barmy as your argument.

Like most Leeds fans these days, you winge on interminably, yet without
providing any evidence of what this 'barricade of bollocks' consisted. If
it was so bad, why didn't you complain to the club, or failing that the
RFL? You must be extremely naive if you turn up at any league ground in
Yorkshire as a so-called 'neutral' wearing a Leeds shirt and expect to get
away without a lot of good natured mickey taking.

--
Paul Dinsdale

 
 
 

Cougar my view

Post by Paul Dinsda » Fri, 14 Jun 1996 04:00:00


Quote:

> I hate going there, it's ***y awful.  Their fans have to be the most
> obnoxious and ignorant lot in the league,  and all this cougarmania
> business is frankly embarrassing.  

> It's also one of the worst grounds I've been to.  At least some of the
> other ***grounds ( Watersheddings, Recreation ground, Tattersfield
> etc..) had a bit of charm and felt like they had tradition, Cougar Park
> is just a hole.

Tattersfield? You're obviously a real regular league supporter, eh?

If that's how you feel about Keighley, why go there at all?  It seems to
me that all these pillocks that enjoy Cougar bashing are jealous of the
club's success. The Cougars ground *was* a tip 5/6 years ago. But
obviously they can't transform it into a palace overnight.

And as for obnoxiousness, ignorance and lack of charm - physician, heal thyself.

--
Paul Dinsdale

 
 
 

Cougar my view

Post by Paul Dinsda » Fri, 14 Jun 1996 04:00:00


Quote:
>Keighley does fail in this respect. For example, in the last Joe Phillips

Trophy played at Cougar Park I was verbally abused by someone... I walked
away and told a steward who politely informed I was big enough to look
after myself..

Quote:
>The upshot is that I'm not going back to that hole again and I wish

nothing but misfortune, relegation and bankrupcy on the Cougars.

Dear Mr Goats

You don't elaborate on what constituted verbal abuse, so it is difficult
to comment on your allegations, other than it seems to come down to an
altercation between yourself and ONE other person. I'm a regular at Cougar
Park and over many years have rarely witnessed the sort of behaviour to
which you allude. If it was as bad as you suggest then I can assure you
most Cougarites would be among the first to deplore it. My experience of
the stewards at Keighley is that they are more diligent than those of the
majority of clubs, and if one of them failed to investigate your
complaint, he should be disciplined.

However, to extrapolate from one incident to wish doom and destruction on
the whole club seems to me to be rather silly. Many clubs, not least
Bradford, have learned some valuable lessons from Keighley's community
approach, and the attitude of a single ill-mannered so-called 'fan' hardly
detracts from that.

--
Paul Dinsdale

 
 
 

Cougar my view

Post by Paul McNal » Fri, 14 Jun 1996 04:00:00


Quote:

>Tattersfield? You're obviously a real regular league supporter, eh?

>If that's how you feel about Keighley, why go there at all?  It seems to
>me that all these pillocks that enjoy Cougar bashing are jealous of the
>club's success. The Cougars ground *was* a tip 5/6 years ago. But
>obviously they can't transform it into a palace overnight.

What on earth are you talking about? I started this thread because of
the accident there at the Salford game. That was not so much Cougar
bashing as being realistic.
If people have had bad experiences then that's not Cougar bashing
either.
I have my doubts that very few people on here are jealous of
Keighley's success. I, as a Salford fan, can't really find that much
to be jealous about, nor will any of the Bradford, Leeds etc
supporters.
As for transforming it into a palace, we don't expect a palace just
somewhere nice and safe will do nicely thnk you.

It's this holier than thou/Cougars are the best thing to happen to RL
therefore everybody hates us bollocks that really gets people's backs
up. The attitude of your chairman's son/chairman masquerading as him
on here speaks volumes about the club's attitude.
The "we're not at fault" stance is at best naive and at worst
arrogant.
Okay, maybe you were hard done to the year you were refused promotion
but not as hard done to as some of the other clubs out there. There's
a chip on the Cougars shoulder that's getting heavier all the time
simply because they cannot accept they are a) not in the SL and b) not
even the best team in that division.

Stop thinking the world's against you for Christ's sake.

Paul

 
 
 

Cougar my view

Post by J. Charnoc » Fri, 14 Jun 1996 04:00:00

Quote:

> I hate going there, it's ***y awful.  Their fans have to be the most
> obnoxious and ignorant lot in the league,  and all this cougarmania
> business is frankly embarrassing.

I didn't manage to get to Cougar Park for the game agaianst Salford, so
I can't comment on the behaviour of the home fans,but at the Willows
last season the Keighley travelling fans were all very friendly,
typical rugby league fans. (OK, they won that game, but they were
friendly even before kick off, so that isn't the reason they were happy)
You shouldn't blame all the fans for the actions of a few. After all,
even at soccer matches the bad fans are in a minority, though they do
unfortunately get all the attention. (Yes, I do go to soccer games
occasionally, and I suppose I shall end up going to more next year,
with no winter rugby.)