Thanks John Quayle

Thanks John Quayle

Post by Leigh Gillespi » Sat, 23 Nov 1996 04:00:00



Quote:
> The problems with the superleague draw are:
> 1. There are two big interruptions after the half way stage (ie as everyone
> is winding up for the finals series).  These follow rounds 12 & 15.  This
> is despite superleague having problems with interruptions by representative
> games in the ARL draws of the past.  Imagine what Wayne Bennett will say if
> his beloved Langer gets injured during the World Club Championship and
> Brisbane fail to make the Grand Final.

        I don't quite see this as the same problem. In the ARL they were
interruptions in which the players were taken away to play for someone
else in games that did not benefit the club. Here they are still playing
with their team for their club. The only differences are they are playing
in a different comp for six weeks but more importantly that different comp
is actually worth as much to the club as the premiership. The prize money
for each looks like being around $2m (depending on who you ask). In that
case someone like Bennett would probably be more concerned with having his
players fit for the World Club Championship as that comp has fewer matches
with fewer second chances if the club drops games.

Quote:
> 2.  The players are now being asked to play up to 39 games (plus
> international tour games) per season as opposed to a maximum of 26 in the
> old draws (plus international tour games)

        Again I don't see this as problem but actually a plus. Clubs are
now paying players up to ten times what they used to be payed as a result
of the SL war inflation. Before this inflation some clubs were already
struggling to pay players from the income of 22 regular season matches and
perhaps 4 finals matches. If the bill is now around two and a half times
the size ($4m as opposed to $1.8m) overall that means clubs need to
increase their income by at least two and a half times. Sponsorship
increases (promised to clubs by SL) and larger grants will cover some of
this but the rest will have to come from increased gates. Now in the
current climate crowds aren't likely to increase dramatically so the only
solution is to play more games. Basically the bottom line is we're paying
these guys an awful lot more, so they better do a bit more in return to
earn it.

(this is point I raised earlier this year before the appeal result - I
was suggesting that with the twenty team comp we should have been playing
about a thirty round season to make up for the increased player payments)

Quote:
> The solution to the draw interruptions would be to have the club
> championship after the local competitions (or before like the Super 12).

        Obviously that would prove easier to schedule and co-ordinate
(and be a darn sight easier to understand) than the current setup.
Personally I'd prefer it post season rather than pre-season. It should be
the climax and focus of the year, not the curtain raiser to something
domestic. Have the premiership finished by the end of August and then go
into the preliminary rounds of the Championship.

Catchya round, Leigh

* * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * * *
* Leigh T. Gillespie                  *    "It takes leather balls      *
* Phone - Australia (077) 791219      *     to play Rugby!"             *

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Thanks John Quayle

Post by John Hull » Sat, 23 Nov 1996 04:00:00



Quote:

> > Yes changing a referees uniform is most certainly going to take the
game to
> > new heights ;-)  
>    As for the referees uniforms they may not take the game to new
> heights but they certainly can't do the game any harm. The ARL aqua blue
> outfits looked ***y awful, especially on our less shapely whistle
> blowers. The referees aren't suppose to look like clowns (ie. bungling
> idiots) even if they are in reality (you'll recall I raised this matter
> earlier in the year before SL announced their refs uniform).

The referees uniforms are important as part of the presentation of the
game, particularly on TV. One thing League does have is clear refereeing
signals, which also helps people understand the game.
We also seem at last to be getting away from the referees who thought they
were stars, and towards referees who are trying to officiate and let the
players get on with it.

John

 
 
 

Thanks John Quayle

Post by Not Leigh Gillespi » Tue, 26 Nov 1996 04:00:00

        Just to confuse youse all, this isn't actually my post (hence the
from line). It's a forward of a message from Chris Russell because his
news server is doing impressions of dying swans (now isn't that good `ol
English logic - if it don't work, ship it off to other side of the
planet). Anyhow what follows leaves me a little bit more worried about
this whole SL draw thingy...


: > mid year interclub challenge.  IMO this has an ugly monster lurking within
: > with this idea of points scored in the challenge also counting as points in
: > the domestic comp.  Just wait to see a team miss out on the finals by 2
: > points even though they won more games than the team ahead of them
: > in the domestic comp but failed to win as many in the international challenge
: > because they were in the tougher draw.  Controversy waiting to happen.

:       But is that the way it's going to work? I'm hearing conflicting
: reports. According the Chris Russell's post on the matter that was the
: original plan but now the domestic premiership and the world club
: champiomship are essentially separate comps (like the old Panasonic Cup

That's my best guess looking at the draw though Leigh. The paper I got
the draw from mentioned nothing explicit neither way other than saying
how teams from each pool in each country qualified for their respective
finals series. That it explicitly said 'respective finals series' led me
to believe what I wrote, I could be mistaken.

: was played concurrently with the premiership but had no direct bearing on
: it). If this is the case then well and good but I do agree with you on the
: above case you cite (although if one looks at the NFL we see this senario
: all over the place with teams playing sides from outside their own
: division and even from outside their own conference - I still don't like
: it but it seems to work as we don't hear too many complaints from over
: there)

The NFL are absolute masters of media manipulation and spoon feeding the
fans though.

:       As for the referees uniforms they may not take the game to new
: heights but they certainly can't do the game any harm. The ARL aqua blue
: outfits looked ***y awful, especially on our less shapely whistle
: blowers. The referees aren't suppose to look like clowns (ie. bungling
: idiots) even if they are in reality (you'll recall I raised this matter
: earlier in the year before SL announced their refs uniform).

For the record, I think the kit the UK ref's wear is ace. Especially the
black and green pinstripe thing. A begging letter to Greg McCallum is in
the offing.

--
Chris Russell                       | Unofficial Rugby League Home Page:
Electronic Imaging Unit             |
University of Bradford              | ...is looking for a new home. Can  

TEL: +44 1274 385463                | on their web server please? 500+ hits
FAX: +44 1274 687834                | per day approx...

 
 
 

Thanks John Quayle

Post by Chris Co » Tue, 26 Nov 1996 04:00:00

Quote:



> : > mid year interclub challenge.  IMO this has an ugly monster lurking within
> : > with this idea of points scored in the challenge also counting as points in
> : > the domestic comp.  Just wait to see a team miss out on the finals by 2
> : > points even though they won more games than the team ahead of them
> : > in the domestic comp but failed to win as many in the international challenge
> : > because they were in the tougher draw.  Controversy waiting to happen.

> :       But is that the way it's going to work? I'm hearing conflicting
> : reports. According the Chris Russell's post on the matter that was the
> : original plan but now the domestic premiership and the world club
> : champiomship are essentially separate comps (like the old Panasonic Cup

> That's my best guess looking at the draw though Leigh. The paper I got
> the draw from mentioned nothing explicit neither way other than saying
> how teams from each pool in each country qualified for their respective
> finals series. That it explicitly said 'respective finals series' led me
> to believe what I wrote, I could be mistaken.

OK to clear up the point.  Here is what was mentioned in a Super League
press release I received from the Broncos:

<quote>

Explanatory Notes - The Australasian Super League Draw
------------------------------------------------------

<simple crud about number of teams etc snipped>

- Points from the World Club Championship will not count towards the
Australasian Super League or EuroLeague.

<end quote>

So I guess that answers your worries then doesn't it? :)  From that I
assume they mean both competitions are completely separate, with the
Pools decided on finishing places in respective domestic competitions in
1996.

Chris
--

     The Brisbane Broncos Home Page:
http://www2.eis.net.au/~chrisc/bronco.htm

                                LET'S GO BRONCOS!

 
 
 

Thanks John Quayle

Post by Vibrating Bum-Faced Goa » Thu, 28 Nov 1996 04:00:00


:       Just to confuse youse all, this isn't actually my post (hence the
: from line). It's a forward of a message from Chris Russell because his
: news server is doing impressions of dying swans (now isn't that good `ol
: English logic - if it don't work, ship it off to other side of the
: planet).

Ha, works though. :)

: Anyhow what follows leaves me a little bit more worried about
: this whole SL draw thingy...

Which bit? Me wanting a green referee's shirt or the possibility of an
all-Oz or all-European final.

Cheers Leigh,
Chris.

 
 
 

Thanks John Quayle

Post by Vibrating Bum-Faced Goa » Thu, 28 Nov 1996 04:00:00


: > That's my best guess looking at the draw though Leigh. The paper I got
: > the draw from mentioned nothing explicit neither way other than saying
: > how teams from each pool in each country qualified for their respective
: > finals series. That it explicitly said 'respective finals series' led me
: > to believe what I wrote, I could be mistaken.

: Explanatory Notes - The Australasian Super League Draw
: ------------------------------------------------------

: <simple crud about number of teams etc snipped>

: - Points from the World Club Championship will not count towards the
: Australasian Super League or EuroLeague.

: <end quote>

: So I guess that answers your worries then doesn't it? :)  From that I
: assume they mean both competitions are completely separate, with the
: Pools decided on finishing places in respective domestic competitions in
: 1996.

I understand that it's a seperate competition entirely Chris. That's
definitely good IMO, the ***bit is the apparent possibility of there
being a final involving two teams from the same country. Whilst this is
probably a good way of determining which clubs are indeed the best in the
world it does kack all to spread the game.

Imagine if a final in a given year was, say, Brisbane v Canberra, and the
final was being held in Newcastle (UK) to help spread the game up there.
No *** would go and no *** would fork out for the air-time for
commercials on the TV over here.

If it was guaranteed from the kick-off that from start to finish this was
a trans-hemisphere contest you could guarantee bigger TV revenues.

--
Chris Russell                       | Unofficial Rugby League Home Page:
Electronic Imaging Unit             |
University of Bradford              | ...is looking for a new home. Can  

TEL: +44 1274 385463                | on their web server please? 500+ hits
FAX: +44 1274 687834                | per day approx...

 
 
 

Thanks John Quayle

Post by Chris Co » Thu, 28 Nov 1996 04:00:00

Quote:

> I understand that it's a seperate competition entirely Chris. That's
> definitely good IMO, the ***bit is the apparent possibility of there
> being a final involving two teams from the same country. Whilst this is
> probably a good way of determining which clubs are indeed the best in the
> world it does kack all to spread the game.

*sound of brain clicking into gear* I'm sorry, I understand now! ;)
Excuse my slow brain, I finished Uni last week and my head is still back
there I think.  That is a worry.  What can you do though?  If you rig it
to have one Aussie and one Pommy team in the final, as you say, you
might not get the two best teams in the final.  The only way you could
really change it would be to have the finals set up in two pools similar
to the old ARL 8-team finals series:

A ESL 1 v ESL 2
B ESL 3 v ESL 4 (loser eliminated)
C ASL 1 v ASL 2
D ASL 3 v ASL $ (loser eliminated)

E Loser A v Winner B (loser eliminated)
F Loser C v Winner D (loser eliminated)

G Winner A v Winner E (loser eliminated)
H Winner C v Winner F (loser eliminated)

I Winner G v Winner H

Or a proper quarter-semi-final system

A ESL 1 v ESL 4
B ESL 2 v ESL 3
C ASL 1 v ASL 4
D ASL 2 v ASL 3

E A v B
F C v D

E v F

Both systems mean there's a strong possibility the best teams don't meet
in the final.

Quote:
> Imagine if a final in a given year was, say, Brisbane v Canberra, and the
> final was being held in Newcastle (UK) to help spread the game up there.
> No *** would go and no *** would fork out for the air-time for
> commercials on the TV over here.

> If it was guaranteed from the kick-off that from start to finish this was
> a trans-hemisphere contest you could guarantee bigger TV revenues.

Probably, but it depends on the feeling about sacrificing the Super
League tag "best of the best" for better revenue.  (Don't start paying
me out on the best of the best thing saying it can't be without Manly,
Roosters, Parra etc, I know that).

Chris
--

     The Brisbane Broncos Home Page:
http://SportToday.org/~chrisc/bronco.htm

                                LET'S GO BRONCOS!

 
 
 

Thanks John Quayle

Post by Peter Gillander » Fri, 29 Nov 1996 04:00:00



Quote:

> : So I guess that answers your worries then doesn't it? :)  From that I
> : assume they mean both competitions are completely separate, with the
> : Pools decided on finishing places in respective domestic competitions
in
> : 1996.

> I understand that it's a seperate competition entirely Chris. That's
> definitely good IMO, the ***bit is the apparent possibility of there
> being a final involving two teams from the same country. Whilst this is
> probably a good way of determining which clubs are indeed the best in the
> world it does kack all to spread the game.

> Imagine if a final in a given year was, say, Brisbane v Canberra, and the
> final was being held in Newcastle (UK) to help spread the game up there.
> No *** would go and no *** would fork out for the air-time for
> commercials on the TV over here.

> If it was guaranteed from the kick-off that from start to finish this was
> a trans-hemisphere contest you could guarantee bigger TV revenues.

Eh? How is it possible to guarantee that? Apart from rigging it, of course!
Do you want one semi-final to be all Northern hemisphere,
and the other one all Southern hemisphere?
Unless you do, you cannot guarantee a North v South final.
But then you have two semi-finals that are NOT trans-hemisphere contests.

Either you have the OPPORTUNITY of North v South in all games,
or the GUARANTEE of North v South in particular games.
You cannot have both. The rules of mathematics do not allow. Sorry.

Peter Gillanders