Submerged sleds: How long is too long?

Submerged sleds: How long is too long?

Post by Gord » Fri, 21 Jul 2000 04:00:00


I'm looking at aquiring a 98' Arty Cat that was submerged for some time last
winter. The guy says it is running and in good shape but hasn't gone through
the motor or suspension yet....(?)
It has low mileage and I'm looking at this as a project/second sled, haven't
got all the details of the sinking yet. (getting info second hand so far)

What would be the guideline to say "no deal" on my end?  1 week under? 2? A
month or two? Does it matter?
I'm assuming to tear down the motor, carbs, suspension......everthing I
guess.

Anybody ever undertake this sort of project before? I'm good with the deal
as long as I can get a functioning sled with mostly labor input and a few
parts.

Any advice?

 
 
 

Submerged sleds: How long is too long?

Post by Jeff » Fri, 21 Jul 2000 04:00:00

YIKES!!!!

Rust is a VERY bad thing for a motor....
   You might say hello to Mr Squeaky a few times this winter... Cha
Ching $$$
 As long as that doesn`t bother you and you NEVER get into an area you
REALLY need the sled to run without failure.... Sure go ahead. ;-)

p.s. be VERY careful with this deal....
2 good 2 be true??? IT usually IS!!!

How does a 99 ZRT 800 with a million miles on it sounds??? It DOES go ON
water... NEVER went swimming and is VERY reliable. Do you live close to
Maine? ;-)

Good luck.

Jeff B          Up in Maine

 
 
 

Submerged sleds: How long is too long?

Post by MDMe » Sat, 22 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Quote:
>YIKES!!!!

>Rust is a VERY bad thing for a motor....
>   You might say hello to Mr Squeaky a few times this winter... Cha
>Ching $$$

I think Jeff means you might meet Mr Squeaky just because it's a Cat.......  :)

Seriously though, being submerged probably didn't do it any damage, but the
lack of maintenance after removal is the problem.  If they got it running again
right away, Mr. Squeaky probably won't be a problem.  My concern would be
everywhere there is/was grease.  Drivetrain bearings and suspension parts are
likely to be the problem areas.

If the price is cheap enough, go for it.  It's a project anyway, right?

Matt
Doo owner
Manta owner

 
 
 

Submerged sleds: How long is too long?

Post by Troy » Sat, 22 Jul 2000 04:00:00

I feel it is not so much how long it was under, but how long it was since it
was under.  If immediate action is not taken after the sled comes out (to
dry out the motor thoroughly), you could see rust in your main bearings and
wrist pin bearings, and oil pump.  This is a big deal, as crank rebuild can
be expensive.  I would replace all the suspension bearings/driveline
bearings anyway.  You won't likely have any problems in carbs if the sled
was cleaned out and running after the submarining.  Clutches must be gone
through, but since there are only bushings, you won't likely see a big
problem that cannot be corrected inexpensively.  I would also like to know
(If I was buying it) how deep it was under (was all the electrical under
(cdi, handlebar heater circuitry, gauges).
If it runs, that is a start, but that does not eliminate possibility of
bottom end damage/ electrical component damage (rust inside gauges).
If you have more questions, let me know.  I am no expert, but if you are
stumped, maybe I can help.
Troy


Quote:
> I'm looking at aquiring a 98' Arty Cat that was submerged for some time
last
> winter. The guy says it is running and in good shape but hasn't gone
through
> the motor or suspension yet....(?)
> It has low mileage and I'm looking at this as a project/second sled,
haven't
> got all the details of the sinking yet. (getting info second hand so far)

> What would be the guideline to say "no deal" on my end?  1 week under? 2?
A
> month or two? Does it matter?
> I'm assuming to tear down the motor, carbs, suspension......everthing I
> guess.

> Anybody ever undertake this sort of project before? I'm good with the deal
> as long as I can get a functioning sled with mostly labor input and a few
> parts.

> Any advice?

 
 
 

Submerged sleds: How long is too long?

Post by Norm Leonar » Sat, 22 Jul 2000 04:00:00

How long it was underwater isn't the big issue, so long as it ain't
sal***er.     If nobody took time to blow out, inspect and lubricate the
critical engine systems immediately after it was pulled out, I wouldn't pay
any less than a buck per pound for it, 'cause it'll be nothing but a hassle
to restore.     If it was pulled out and simply left to "drip dry" or worse
yet, freeze, you'll have your work cut out for you.     Best bet is to bring
a good sled mechanic along and get his assessment of it.
Of course, for someone who already has the same machine, it'd be a great
source of spare parts!
Good luck.


Quote:
> I'm looking at aquiring a 98' Arty Cat that was submerged for some time
last
> winter. The guy says it is running and in good shape but hasn't gone
through
> the motor or suspension yet....(?)
> It has low mileage and I'm looking at this as a project/second sled,
haven't
> got all the details of the sinking yet. (getting info second hand so far)

> What would be the guideline to say "no deal" on my end?  1 week under? 2?
A
> month or two? Does it matter?
> I'm assuming to tear down the motor, carbs, suspension......everthing I
> guess.

> Anybody ever undertake this sort of project before? I'm good with the deal
> as long as I can get a functioning sled with mostly labor input and a few
> parts.

> Any advice?

 
 
 

Submerged sleds: How long is too long?

Post by Gord » Sat, 22 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Thanks for the input. I have yet to see the sled, but as I understand it, it
was completely submerged for a few weeks until a dive team could recover it.
It was shut down as it went under and it was drained and lubed immediately
after recovering. It is a running sled and they guy "says" it just needs
cleaning. The trade is a good one for me, (89' Ford in need of repair) if
the sled runs.

Since it is an Arty Cat it will never leave the garage without the Polaris
in front and a tow rope in the trunk so I'm not too worried about being
stranded  :)

I'll keep you guys' posted ,
Thanks for the help

 
 
 

Submerged sleds: How long is too long?

Post by Scott Aleckso » Sat, 22 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Quote:

> Since it is an Arty Cat it will never leave the garage without the Polaris
> in front and a tow rope in the trunk so I'm not too worried about being
> stranded  :)

Hmmm, I was just couting up the number of "non-Cat" sleds that I have towed out
with my Cat, but I ran out of fingers and don't feel like taking off my shoes
;-)
 
 
 

Submerged sleds: How long is too long?

Post by RDJ » Sat, 22 Jul 2000 04:00:00

When your boat sinks, the first rule of thumb is "do not recover it until
you are ready to work on the motor". In other words, leave it submerged for
now. Of course, don't leave it underwater for 2 -3 years. What you need to
find out is what they did when they retrieved it, and how soon. You also
have to be able to tell if the guy is lying to you. Seeing as how you are
asking for advice, I would pass on it if it were me.

RDJ
www.geocities.com/Baja/Canyon/9150/

 
 
 

Submerged sleds: How long is too long?

Post by Gord » Sat, 22 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Quote:
> Hmmm, I was just couting up the number of "non-Cat" sleds that I have
towed out
> with my Cat, but I ran out of fingers and don't feel like taking off my

shoes

You mean cuz Arty Cat riders can't tie their own shoes ?  :)

(better duck...here comes that beer can again....Hey what am I saying? I
might be an Arty Cat rider!)

 
 
 

Submerged sleds: How long is too long?

Post by Greg Mi » Sat, 22 Jul 2000 04:00:00

That's a good plan Gordy, that way you'll be able to see when the polaris dies
and you'll have a rope to pull em back with.  But you'll probably get tired of
going that slow and  holding that cat back.......   (most reliable, always pulls
the rear)

01' 800 RMK snow checked
00' 800 RMK
99' 1000 TCat MC
99' 925G   PS
98' 600 PS
97' 600 PE
Let it Snow!!!

Quote:

> Since it is an Arty Cat it will never leave the garage without the Polaris
> in front and a tow rope in the trunk so I'm not too worried about being
> stranded  :)

> I'll keep you guys' posted ,
> Thanks for the help

 
 
 

Submerged sleds: How long is too long?

Post by Smitht » Sat, 22 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Gordy
I don't brag about this but I do have some experience with a submerged sled.
I have a 96 Polaris XLT that was submerged only for a couple of hours and
the advise that I got was DO NOT START IT. I took the engine apart the very
next day and it was just packed solid with silt. That stuff gets into
everything. Anyhow as soon as I took the engine apart rust started setting
in on the cylinder walls so I oiled everything down immediately. I cleaned
everything in the engine and inspected the bearings, crank and cylinder
walls for scoring. There was none that I could see. I reassembled the engine
and I have put more than 2000 miles on it since with out any problems. My
only costs were gaskets and time.  I can only imagine what would have
happened to the moving parts of the engine if I would have started it up
with all that silt in there. No problems with any of the suspension or any
of the sealed bearings. I did pump grease through all the fittings to push
out as much of the contaminants as I could.

If you want to see if there was a lot of silt check underneath the seat the
pressure washer cant get in there. I found that out when I put some tunnel
protectors on last year.

Rust seem to sets in on snowmobile engines like nothing else, that is why
most of use fog our engine in the spring or at least start them
periodically. Anything that can create hot spots in the bearings , etc will
eventually cause an engine to fail. More likely sooner than later. I don't
know what an engine looks like after weeks, months under water but I am
surprised that the engine started.
It was nice of the person to tell you that it was submerged. I guess if I
had an snowmobile that was submerged for that long I might think that I had
nothing to loss if I started it up.

Price all the parts inside the engine and you will have a idea of the cost
to rebuild the engine. Its a bonus if you can salvage anything. If you run
the engine and it burns down it will be more than you want to invest.

You could also take the heads off and inspect the cylinder walls, if they
are bad I wouldn't use the engine for trail ridding. I have some buddies
that like to take those kind of engines and build some air suckin fire
poopin race sleds.

Good luck

TVS

 
 
 

Submerged sleds: How long is too long?

Post by SRXfre » Sun, 23 Jul 2000 04:00:00

I sunk my 96 XCR6SP once, and my buddy was looking at it upside down in the
water, and said, "put it in the paper now".  He wasn't too far off.  It took me
a week of draining everything, regreasing everything, WD40ing everything,
douching out the motor, drying the seat, etc.. The sled never ran the same and
would always inexplicably stall periodically (not good on a -20 Canada night,
when your friends are driving off;-)) and the seat never did dry, even though I
had it*** over a kerosene heater for a week.  It would turn to stone
everytime it got real cold.  Gooooooooooood luck.
'freak
 
 
 

Submerged sleds: How long is too long?

Post by Rob Lyon » Sun, 23 Jul 2000 04:00:00


Quote:
>I sunk my 96 XCR6SP once, and my buddy was looking at it upside down in the
>water, and said, "put it in the paper now".  He wasn't too far off.  It took me
>a week of draining everything, regreasing everything, WD40ing everything,
>douching out the motor, drying the seat, etc.. The sled never ran the same and
>would always inexplicably stall periodically (not good on a -20 Canada night,
>when your friends are driving off;-)) and the seat never did dry, even though I
>had it*** over a kerosene heater for a week.  It would turn to stone
>everytime it got real cold.  Gooooooooooood luck.
>'freak

Hey 'freak !
I didn't know you had owned a "black bomb" also !?!  I often felt like
sinking mine in a lake too!  I used to park it up by the road with the keys
in it, hoping some fool would come along and steal it.  No such luck.

Rob in Vermont

 
 
 

Submerged sleds: How long is too long?

Post by David Courtne » Sun, 23 Jul 2000 04:00:00

    I sunk my first XCR too.  I got it out about 10 hours later and had it
running that day... but, like you say, it would stall at odd times and the
seat NEVER dried out.  It would be like a rock if it was cold out... or I
would get a wet ass if it was warm.
    I removed the foam, cut slits in it and stuffed towels in the slits...
then left it by the furnace for a month.  It never dried out.
    The tach never worked right either... and the speedo was fogged all the
time.


Quote:
> I sunk my 96 XCR6SP once, and my buddy was looking at it upside down in
the
> water, and said, "put it in the paper now".  He wasn't too far off.  It
took me
> a week of draining everything, regreasing everything, WD40ing everything,
> douching out the motor, drying the seat, etc.. The sled never ran the same
and
> would always inexplicably stall periodically (not good on a -20 Canada
night,
> when your friends are driving off;-)) and the seat never did dry, even
though I
> had it*** over a kerosene heater for a week.  It would turn to stone
> everytime it got real cold.  Gooooooooooood luck.
> 'freak

 
 
 

Submerged sleds: How long is too long?

Post by Scott Aleckso » Mon, 24 Jul 2000 04:00:00

Quote:

> > Hmmm, I was just couting up the number of "non-Cat" sleds that I have
> towed out
> > with my Cat, but I ran out of fingers and don't feel like taking off my
> shoes

> You mean cuz Arty Cat riders can't tie their own shoes ?  :)

zippers is bestest
Quote:

> (better duck...here comes that beer can again....Hey what am I saying? I
> might be an Arty Cat rider!)