Change Edge Sprial -- Revisited

Change Edge Sprial -- Revisited

Post by Jane » Fri, 10 Dec 2004 09:24:03


In searching rssir archives, I knew I'd come across an earlier post of
mine. I *had* this change edge spiral, from LFI to LFO.  I haven't
practiced it since, what, April?  Now I can no longer get it.

I was in a contorted position, making me wonder how someone could
actually move on a blade in that position.....on the LFI portion.  Then
of course, I lost all power and speed so that the LFO portion was at a
crawl.  Many swimming motions with my arms, which didn't increase my
momentum!

I have forgotten the feeling of this move, and the "flick" of the edge
to change, rather than forcing the edge change. U saw myself in the
glass and immediately burst out laughing.

In experimenting with this today, which probably looked pretty funny, I
found my R leg was not behind me, but*** like a broken rudder out
to the side, and I seemed to be trying to turn the sprial with my
shoulders!  It's almost like I was resisting the move, unable to rely
on the edge with proper body position to get me there.

Am trying to come up with ways to combat these various blocks and
forces.......I am going back to simply an arabesque position, rather
than a high spiral, and trying to get the feeling that way again.  I
noticed it improved when my skating foot made a complete large half
circle, with the edge change "flick" occurring perpindicular to the
long axis. I hardly scraped.  Looking for more of these!

 
 
 

Change Edge Sprial -- Revisited

Post by The Walsh Famil » Fri, 10 Dec 2004 10:08:09

Boy I've always wanted to do these.  I can wrestle from inside to out side
but never any edge flick, more a crab skid on the flat until I get the foot
over to the other side of my ?center of mass?  I think that the free leg is
sort of to the inside on the FI edge when Michelle Quan and Sasha Cohen did
them.  Let us know what you come up with.
Lyle


Quote:
> In searching rssir archives, I knew I'd come across an earlier post of
> mine. I *had* this change edge spiral, from LFI to LFO.  I haven't
> practiced it since, what, April?  Now I can no longer get it.

> I was in a contorted position, making me wonder how someone could
> actually move on a blade in that position.....on the LFI portion.  Then
> of course, I lost all power and speed so that the LFO portion was at a
> crawl.  Many swimming motions with my arms, which didn't increase my
> momentum!

> I have forgotten the feeling of this move, and the "flick" of the edge
> to change, rather than forcing the edge change. U saw myself in the
> glass and immediately burst out laughing.

> In experimenting with this today, which probably looked pretty funny, I
> found my R leg was not behind me, but*** like a broken rudder out
> to the side, and I seemed to be trying to turn the sprial with my
> shoulders!  It's almost like I was resisting the move, unable to rely
> on the edge with proper body position to get me there.

> Am trying to come up with ways to combat these various blocks and
> forces.......I am going back to simply an arabesque position, rather
> than a high spiral, and trying to get the feeling that way again.  I
> noticed it improved when my skating foot made a complete large half
> circle, with the edge change "flick" occurring perpindicular to the
> long axis. I hardly scraped.  Looking for more of these!


 
 
 

Change Edge Sprial -- Revisited

Post by Kay » Fri, 10 Dec 2004 10:07:10

Do it in an upright position first. If you do it as a basic upright glide,
you can get the change w/o the added complication of the spiral pose. It's
all about feeling your balance and pointing your belly button in the
direction you want to go.  WhenI do this move, I don't move anything. Arms
stay still, it's purely a weight shift.

Kay
www.skatejournal.com


Quote:
> In searching rssir archives, I knew I'd come across an earlier post of
> mine. I *had* this change edge spiral, from LFI to LFO.  I haven't
> practiced it since, what, April?  Now I can no longer get it.


 
 
 

Change Edge Sprial -- Revisited

Post by George » Sat, 11 Dec 2004 08:05:58

Hey, I managed this for the first time today! Feels cool. I started with an
upright body position and the free leg pointed back. I gradually lowered the
upper body. As you can guess it's harder this way. Still unsure what makes
it happen, it's like you will the FI edge to become an FO and eventually it
does. No movements are really necessary, it feels like it's some muscles
deep in the back and pelvis that do it. An imperceptible lifting of the free
hip and turning out of the skating foot maybe? Turning the free leg out hard
also seemed to help. Don't know, needs work. It took me a loooong time to
change edge. I was on a scrapy flat for quite a while after the inside edge
before finaly it decides to go and roll to the outside. Then when I finally
got on the outside, it spiraled too deeply!

It's a good exercise for control, and also strength. Empty rink helps.

GP



Quote:
> Boy I've always wanted to do these.  I can wrestle from inside to out side
> but never any edge flick, more a crab skid on the flat until I get the
foot
> over to the other side of my ?center of mass?  I think that the free leg
is
> sort of to the inside on the FI edge when Michelle Quan and Sasha Cohen
did
> them.  Let us know what you come up with.
> Lyle



> > In searching rssir archives, I knew I'd come across an earlier post of
> > mine. I *had* this change edge spiral, from LFI to LFO.  I haven't
> > practiced it since, what, April?  Now I can no longer get it.

> > I was in a contorted position, making me wonder how someone could
> > actually move on a blade in that position.....on the LFI portion.  Then
> > of course, I lost all power and speed so that the LFO portion was at a
> > crawl.  Many swimming motions with my arms, which didn't increase my
> > momentum!

> > I have forgotten the feeling of this move, and the "flick" of the edge
> > to change, rather than forcing the edge change. U saw myself in the
> > glass and immediately burst out laughing.

> > In experimenting with this today, which probably looked pretty funny, I
> > found my R leg was not behind me, but*** like a broken rudder out
> > to the side, and I seemed to be trying to turn the sprial with my
> > shoulders!  It's almost like I was resisting the move, unable to rely
> > on the edge with proper body position to get me there.

> > Am trying to come up with ways to combat these various blocks and
> > forces.......I am going back to simply an arabesque position, rather
> > than a high spiral, and trying to get the feeling that way again.  I
> > noticed it improved when my skating foot made a complete large half
> > circle, with the edge change "flick" occurring perpindicular to the
> > long axis. I hardly scraped.  Looking for more of these!

 
 
 

Change Edge Sprial -- Revisited

Post by George » Sun, 12 Dec 2004 03:30:33

Has anyone tried this backwards? I have a feeling it might be easier. Take
BW power pulls for example.

GP

 
 
 

Change Edge Sprial -- Revisited

Post by Jane » Sun, 12 Dec 2004 07:55:47

Come on, you be the first one!  Let me know how it went if you try it.
I can still barely get the forward version, though I had better success
today following Kay's advice.
 
 
 

Change Edge Sprial -- Revisited

Post by Kay » Sun, 12 Dec 2004 21:26:26


Quote:
> Has anyone tried this backwards? I have a feeling it might be easier. Take
> BW power pulls for example.

Let me be the first to say "yes".  I do a beautiful RBI to RBO spiral that
covers 2/3 of the rink. It is actually harder to do than forward, IMO. I do
it in an upright pose w/ a very high free leg. On the BO edge, I like to
change position to an attitude. It is very pretty. For an exit, I step
forward to a LFI3 into a CW layback spin on the right foot.

To do this, you must pull very fast back xovers around the end of the rink,
hit your BI edge and position as you come out of the end, ride the curve
into the center of the rink where you will shift weight and hit a flat in
transition to a BO. A change of arm pose and leg pose is nice here. Ride the
BO into an opposite curve. You are creating a serpentine. Step out foward on
the opposite foot. The FI3 entrance into a forward spin is optional, but
worth achieving.

Kay
www.skatejournal.com

 
 
 

Change Edge Sprial -- Revisited

Post by Jane » Mon, 13 Dec 2004 07:40:53

Quote:


> > Has anyone tried this backwards? I have a feeling it might be
easier. Take
> > BW power pulls for example.

> Let me be the first to say "yes".  I do a beautiful RBI to RBO spiral
that
> covers 2/3 of the rink. It is actually harder to do than forward,
IMO. >
> Kay
> www.skatejournal.com

Kay, you are definitely high up there on that pedestal I have for
talented skaters.
 
 
 

Change Edge Sprial -- Revisited

Post by Roge » Tue, 14 Dec 2004 17:48:42


Quote:
>In searching rssir archives, I knew I'd come across an earlier post of
>mine. I *had* this change edge spiral, from LFI to LFO.  I haven't
>practiced it since, what, April?  Now I can no longer get it.

>I was in a contorted position, making me wonder how someone could
>actually move on a blade in that position.....on the LFI portion.  Then
>of course, I lost all power and speed so that the LFO portion was at a
>crawl.  Many swimming motions with my arms, which didn't increase my
>momentum!

Here's how an "old guy" used to do it and found them very easy.
They didn't take tremendous speed but to get a long one took a fair
amount.  The change edge was basically effortless.

Quote:

>I have forgotten the feeling of this move, and the "flick" of the edge

There was no flick of the edge for me.

Quote:
>to change, rather than forcing the edge change. U saw myself in the
>glass and immediately burst out laughing.

>In experimenting with this today, which probably looked pretty funny, I
>found my R leg was not behind me, but*** like a broken rudder out
>to the side, and I seemed to be trying to turn the sprial with my
>shoulders!  It's almost like I was resisting the move, unable to rely
>on the edge with proper body position to get me there.

Like many men I lay my arm on the free leg side back on the leg. That
gives me good feedback as to the leg position. It has to be back, or
it is going to shift your weight in that direction.  One thing that
helped me was to "push and point" that free foot as if I were using my
toes to push against something.  I had good extension, but not a lot
of height...Maybe a foot above my butt.

Once the weight and balance are solved, it's basically "for me"
looking in one direction or the other just as we did when first
learning to glide and change direction by changing the direction we
were looking.  Some need to rotate the entire body to get the weight
shift, but with practice you can get a nice spiral to follow the
hockey circles.    It took me about 2 weeks to really get comfortable
doing spirals, but it took a lot longer to get the change edge.  I
used to practice 4 edges RFI, RFO, LFI, and LFO until I could easily
trace the edge of the circle all the way around. Once around I'd bring
the free leg down and forward so it became the skating leg and raised
the other for another circle with no stroking en between.  It was all
momentum.

At a reasonable speed I finally reached the point where I could start
in the middle and do a figure 8 using most of the arena.

Quote:

>Am trying to come up with ways to combat these various blocks and
>forces.......I am going back to simply an arabesque position, rather

Just work on the free leg extension and height as far as or a bit
above your back side. The work on the balance. Once you reach the
point where you can more your hands and arms around and turn your head
from left to right it should become as easy as gliding on one foot.  

I used to like to do spirals for two reasons.  One, it seemed to
impress most of the skaters <:-)) and two, it really helped my bad
back.  I really didn't have a lot of back strength.

Quote:
>than a high spiral, and trying to get the feeling that way again.  I
>noticed it improved when my skating foot made a complete large half
>circle, with the edge change "flick" occurring perpindicular to the
>long axis. I hardly scraped.  Looking for more of these!

Try gliding on one foot in an upright position and changing direction
by only shifting your weight. Do not try to move the skate. Just let
it ride on which ever edge is natural.  To begin you may need to turn
your shoulders, then only your head and neck.   Eventually you should
reach a point where you only lean slightly to change edge and
direction at will.  It's a really good feeling.

Good Luck,

Roger Halstead (K8RI & ARRL life member)
(N833R, S# CD-2 Worlds oldest Debonair)
www.rogerhalstead.com