Berezhnaya/Sikharulidze vs Sale/Pelletier controversy - my (russian) 2c

Berezhnaya/Sikharulidze vs Sale/Pelletier controversy - my (russian) 2c

Post by Zelia » Sat, 16 Feb 2002 00:05:38


1. The judging

Those who accuse of block-judging and biased judgement should look in
not so distant past, when an Eastern block athlete (especially if he
or she was Soviet in origin) would ONLY win any judged sport if he or
she (or even a team) was head over hills stronger than western
opponents. This was given, taken for granted and not discussed.
Nowadays, when the system starts backfiring at the
US/Canada competitors in particular, there is a sudden outcry in the
US media - "Why? How is that possible? Where is the merit-based
judgement? What's happening to this sport?". Nothing is happening. It
is exactly the same as before, but this time the judges are more or
less split in half, hence the block judging (as invented by the West)
shifts ever so often in East's favour.

So, if you disagree with the judges' objectiveness in this case,
consider this a payback time for all those cases, where, for example,
female singles were always outvoted in favour of Kwan/Lipinsky.

2. "The win is a disgrace to the innocent Russian couple"

It was not a disgrace at the time of victory. Fans and judges opinions
often differ, with no consequences besides a little roar/booing at the
time. The US media coverage made it a disgrace, by publishing
literally zillions of identical (in spirit) articles, repeating the
same story over, over and over again. So please, do not play an
innocent bystander, feeling oh so sorry for the Russian couple. You
have made their win a disgrace in the truly innocent, misinformed
public's eye.

3. Official Olympic website coverage

This is the most horrifying and disgusting part of the story. I
haven't seen a more biased, narrow-minded coverage in my entire life.
90% of the stories (in general) are dedicated to the US / Canadian
athletes. Excuse me, but this is an official website, dedicated to
Olympic games, in which athletes from all over the WORLD compete. The
world does not consist of 90% US, 10% other and the medal counts also
do not quite reflect that statistic.

As for the figure skating story, 100% of the articles expressed exact
same viewpoint in exact same way, interviewing literally dozens of
Canadian experts, athletes, housewives and what have you and barely
mentioning what possibly the winners or their supporters have to say.
If this is not brainwashing, but rather a way of living, then I am
truly sorry for the American nation, as it has been deprived of its
major human right - to think and decide for yourself.

I apologise for potentially offending anyone with this post, but the
media crusade against declared Olympic champions (as they inevitably
become the victims of this exercise) is getting to me.

 
 
 

Berezhnaya/Sikharulidze vs Sale/Pelletier controversy - my (russian) 2c

Post by Milhau » Sat, 16 Feb 2002 00:24:18


Quote:

> 1. The judging

> Those who accuse of block-judging and biased judgement should look in
> not so distant past, when an Eastern block athlete (especially if he
> or she was Soviet in origin) would ONLY win any judged sport if he or
> she (or even a team) was head over hills stronger than western
> opponents. This was given, taken for granted and not discussed.
> Nowadays, when the system starts backfiring at the
> US/Canada competitors in particular, there is a sudden outcry in the
> US media - "Why? How is that possible? Where is the merit-based
> judgement? What's happening to this sport?". Nothing is happening. It
> is exactly the same as before, but this time the judges are more or
> less split in half, hence the block judging (as invented by the West)
> shifts ever so often in East's favour.

> So, if you disagree with the judges' objectiveness in this case,
> consider this a payback time for all those cases, where, for example,
> female singles were always outvoted in favour of Kwan/Lipinsky.

What the *** are you talking about?  Do you remember Baiul?  Witt?
The men's basketball team at the 72 Olympics? You clearly have a short
memory, despite your claims.  Let's establish that there is no NA
block, since there are  really only two countries who can have a judge.
The only "bloc" refers to those who conspire to vote a certain way. or
have a definite bias (simple trending could show this. . . ) Oh, and
did Kwan and Lipinsky make several mistakes, only to win over a
*perfect* performance?  No.  

Quote:
> 2. "The win is a disgrace to the innocent Russian couple"

> It was not a disgrace at the time of victory. Fans and judges opinions
> often differ, with no consequences besides a little roar/booing at the
> time. The US media coverage made it a disgrace, by publishing
> literally zillions of identical (in spirit) articles, repeating the
> same story over, over and over again. So please, do not play an
> innocent bystander, feeling oh so sorry for the Russian couple. You
> have made their win a disgrace in the truly innocent, misinformed
> public's eye.

It is a disgrace to them.  They know they didn't deserve to win, yet
they had to accept the gold medal.  They could have very well held
their heads high with a silver medal, but the judges didn't allow them
to do this.  So yes, I feel sorry for the Russin couples, but even more
for those delusional people who won't concede that their performance
was flawed, or that they didn't deserve the gold medal.

- Show quoted text -

Quote:
> 3. Official Olympic website coverage

> This is the most horrifying and disgusting part of the story. I
> haven't seen a more biased, narrow-minded coverage in my entire life.
> 90% of the stories (in general) are dedicated to the US / Canadian
> athletes. Excuse me, but this is an official website, dedicated to
> Olympic games, in which athletes from all over the WORLD compete. The
> world does not consist of 90% US, 10% other and the medal counts also
> do not quite reflect that statistic.

> As for the figure skating story, 100% of the articles expressed exact
> same viewpoint in exact same way, interviewing literally dozens of
> Canadian experts, athletes, housewives and what have you and barely
> mentioning what possibly the winners or their supporters have to say.
> If this is not brainwashing, but rather a way of living, then I am
> truly sorry for the American nation, as it has been deprived of its
> major human right - to think and decide for yourself.

> I apologise for potentially offending anyone with this post, but the
> media crusade against declared Olympic champions (as they inevitably
> become the victims of this exercise) is getting to me.

Well, then, why don't you write those media outlets?  Coming from
Russia, and you want to lecture North Americans on brainwashing?  I
didn't need any media outlet to tell me S&P were robbed of gold - I saw
that myself when I saw the performance.  The only thing offensive in
your comment is your ignorance.

 
 
 

Berezhnaya/Sikharulidze vs Sale/Pelletier controversy - my (russian) 2c

Post by Ogg » Sat, 16 Feb 2002 01:06:33

So, if you disagree with the judges' objectiveness in this case, consider this
a payback time for all those cases, where, for example,
female singles were always outvoted in favour of Kwan/Lipinsky.>>

It's wrong when it happens to Western skaters.  It's wrong when it happens to
Eastern skaters.

But payback?  Well, that is just making victims of all the skaters.

I don't think many judges are really judging what they purely see on the ice.

And that sucks.
Tania

 
 
 

Berezhnaya/Sikharulidze vs Sale/Pelletier controversy - my (russian) 2c

Post by Sammi » Sat, 16 Feb 2002 01:34:33

Quote:
> 3. Official Olympic website coverage

> This is the most horrifying and disgusting part of the story. I
> haven't seen a more biased, narrow-minded coverage in my entire life.
> 90% of the stories (in general) are dedicated to the US / Canadian
> athletes. Excuse me, but this is an official website, dedicated to

You're absolutely right on this point. As I wanted to read some unbiased
information about what's happening right now and who said or did what
concerning the pairs finals, I turned to the official site only to find a
bunch of biased articles from NBC. I then turned to my "normal" sport site
(the Belgian www.sport24.be) where I found just one article saying that
Cinquata told "there were some allegations the past few days against one
member of the judge" (I assume he means the French judge) "but that there
was no hard evidence and that he could not see any reason to conduct a large
investigation to the method of judging". It seems for Europe it's a cause
not worth fighting about, a hype created by the American media. Just to put
this whole hype into perspective...

Sammie

 
 
 

Berezhnaya/Sikharulidze vs Sale/Pelletier controversy - my (russian) 2c

Post by Robert Diste » Sat, 16 Feb 2002 06:15:59


Quote:



> > 1. The judging

> > Those who accuse of block-judging and biased judgement should look in
> > not so distant past, when an Eastern block athlete (especially if he
> > or she was Soviet in origin) would ONLY win any judged sport if he or
> > she (or even a team) was head over hills stronger than western
> > opponents. This was given, taken for granted and not discussed.
> > Nowadays, when the system starts backfiring at the
> > US/Canada competitors in particular, there is a sudden outcry in the
> > US media - "Why? How is that possible? Where is the merit-based
> > judgement? What's happening to this sport?". Nothing is happening. It
> > is exactly the same as before, but this time the judges are more or
> > less split in half, hence the block judging (as invented by the West)
> > shifts ever so often in East's favour.

> > So, if you disagree with the judges' objectiveness in this case,
> > consider this a payback time for all those cases, where, for example,
> > female singles were always outvoted in favour of Kwan/Lipinsky.

> What the *** are you talking about?  Do you remember Baiul?  Witt?
> The men's basketball team at the 72 Olympics? You clearly have a short
> memory, despite your claims.  Let's establish that there is no NA
> block, since there are  really only two countries who can have a judge.
> The only "bloc" refers to those who conspire to vote a certain way. or
> have a definite bias (simple trending could show this. . . ) Oh, and
> did Kwan and Lipinsky make several mistakes, only to win over a
> *perfect* performance?  No.  

Let's not forget Petrenko-Wylie, Poetzsch-Fratianne,
Linichuk&Karponosov-Regoczy&Sallay (Russians over comrade Hungarians),
Bestemianova&Bukhin-Wilson&McCall, and Pasha and Sasha over just about
anyone. Do you supporters of Russian skating have ANY sense of shame or
irony. Friggin' unbelievable.

Bob

 
 
 

Berezhnaya/Sikharulidze vs Sale/Pelletier controversy - my (russian) 2c

Post by Anonymou » Sat, 16 Feb 2002 11:29:32



Quote:
>It is a disgrace to them.  They know they didn't deserve to win, yet
>they had to accept the gold medal.  They could have very well held
>their heads high with a silver medal, but the judges didn't allow them
>to do this

They won with the same rules and the same judge pool as Sale and
Pelletier had when they won.  That was good enough for S&P when they
were WINNERS.  Now suddenly it is not good enough when they have to
take second place.

The Russians deservedly were given the medals.  Just as deserving as
Gordeeva and Grinkov in 1994.

 
 
 

Berezhnaya/Sikharulidze vs Sale/Pelletier controversy - my (russian) 2c

Post by Anonymou » Sat, 16 Feb 2002 11:31:26

On Thu, 14 Feb 2002 13:15:59 -0800, Robert Dister

Quote:

> Do you supporters of Russian skating have ANY sense of shame or
>irony. Friggin' unbelievable.

What we have is logical consistency.  YOU are arguing that when
America's skaters are given gold by ISU, it is somehow honest, but
when European skaters get gold, it is somehow tainted.

This is just emotion speaking on your part.