Whats wrong with outlaw paintball (NOTHING!)

Whats wrong with outlaw paintball (NOTHING!)

Post by Andy » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 11:28:24


I've been reading this group for the last two months.  Been playing
paintball off and on for over ten years (first gun was a Splatmaster!)
I love Outlaw ball.  I do not play on commercial fields.  Every
experience I've on commercial fields had sucked.  I have a good job, so
it ain't the cost I dislike.  It's the experience.  These are my 3
commercial field experiences.

    Field #1   This field actually started out good and went downhill.
I played here a total of six times.
       Here's what happened the last 3 times.
                    No input from players allowed.  "You all liked
playing that field huh? well lets change fields
                    Refs would return to the staging area in the middle
of the game.
                    Refs would not kick out overly agressive players.
(I'm talking near***fights)

Field #2    Myself and 5 friends went to this field, 4 were renting guns
and had never played before.  They put us on the rookie field (I had
just boought my first semi (VM-68!) and was still very much a
recreational player.)  My friends and I were the first 5 people out.
(we were not all on the same team.)  The other players said we were too
good!!! So we had to play on the field where two established teams were
practicing against each other.  5 guys with VM-68's and rentals against
autocockers, and automags.  WTF.   Staff refused our requests to move
back to the other field.  This was my first and last visit.

Field #3    An indoor field in a Mall.  (maybe 100ft x 50 ft with
barrels and pallets as cover.)  A great place to introduce new players!
Except for the Jackass with the Angel that would run through 300 rounds
per game, shoot every player 3 times to make sure they were dead, and
kill every person on the other team every time.  I can't bellieve this
guy enjoyed it.  he was beating up on 13 year olds and he was probably
35.    I talked to the owner and told him that the jackass was runing it
for everyone.  He said he's not going to stop him because he's his best
customer and is there every night!    This place closed 2 months
later...hmmm no new customers????

So, this is why I play outlaw.  Why should I be villified on this
newsgroup for my choice?

REason #1  No insurance.
   I mountain bike and rock climb at places with no insurace.  Why is
paintball different.  PLAY AT YOUR OWN RISK.

Reason #2   Tresspassing.
   This Land is My Land

Reason #3  No medic
   I play with friends who know how to call for help.  And most of us
know first aid. (Learn it, it aint hard)

Reason #4  No chrongraph.
  I play with friends.  Real friends that I trust.

Reason #5  Support local businesses (fields)
  I did, and they failed me.   I do buy my equipment locally though.

Reason #6  No Refs
  See # 4

Reason #7 Hurt on the Field and Nobody Finding You for Several Days
  ummm do You play alone?

Reason #8  You are taking your life into your own hands.
  Hmmm that would be life.  Have fun sitting in you safety bubble!

Anyone else got a reason I shouldn't play outlaw????

 
 
 

Whats wrong with outlaw paintball (NOTHING!)

Post by Big Habe » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 11:37:22

I don't think anyone really has a problem with outlaw ball, persay...but there
are certain items which you haven't mentioned...

1. Do you use a chronograph?  This one goes without saying.  If you do, good
for you.  Most outlaw ballers don't appear to, and just use the 'yeah that
looks around 300 fps' method.  You say you 'trust' your friends.  Thats great,
and a wonderful thing, but do you 'trust' that springs won't tighten, loosen,
or generally mess up?  Keeping in mind that all it takes is a tiny amount of
extra tension to make a paintball move at a velocity that current goggle
systems are not designed to handle.  Trust has absolutely nothing to do with
it.

2. Have you netted the area in which you play?  It's been my experience that no
matter how remote the location, no matter how well marked, no matter how
private the property, people will always end up wandering too close to the
field while not wearing goggles.  Example: My old team captain built a field in
his backyard in bumble-frig Rhode Island.  We never bothered with netting (We
DID have a chronie).  We then started bothering with netting because
periodically a bow hunter would wander through our 'field'.

3. Insurance IS actually an issue.  Maybe you don't think so, but wait until
someone gets hurt.  You'll end up paying those medical expenses out of YOUR
pocket as the owner of the land.  Trespassing or no you are still accountable
for any injuries that may occur.  For example: ever hear of the burglar who
tripped and fell in a house he was robbing and proceeded to sue and WIN a
lawsuit against the owners?

Other than that, I doubt very much anyone here would object to outlaw ball.
The only real objections we DO have is that people don't play safely...Keeping
other paintballers, and more importantly, non paintballers safe needs to be our
top priority.  You hurt your case in a big way by admitting that you don't use
a chronograph.  Hell, those of us who play tourneys in general 'trust' each
other...I still wouldn't set foot on a field that didn't require chronying.

Mitch

 
 
 

Whats wrong with outlaw paintball (NOTHING!)

Post by Tempes » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 13:34:03

I strongly agree with every point EXCEPT the part about the chronograph- not
having one isn't a good idea. Not only does it make an unfair advantage for
guys who just might have hot guns by chance, but it's dangerous. That, and
you can't chrono a gun, leave it, and then play a week later and think that
it'll shoot the same velocity. IT WON'T.

Just buy a cheap radarchron- have everyone chip in. They're only like $80
and are very accurate. Its not worth a cracked lense or a broken finger to
not have one.

-Mike


Quote:
> I've been reading this group for the last two months.  Been playing
> paintball off and on for over ten years (first gun was a Splatmaster!)
> I love Outlaw ball.  I do not play on commercial fields.  Every
> experience I've on commercial fields had sucked.  I have a good job, so
> it ain't the cost I dislike.  It's the experience.  These are my 3
> commercial field experiences.

>     Field #1   This field actually started out good and went downhill.
> I played here a total of six times.
>        Here's what happened the last 3 times.
>                     No input from players allowed.  "You all liked
> playing that field huh? well lets change fields
>                     Refs would return to the staging area in the middle
> of the game.
>                     Refs would not kick out overly agressive players.
> (I'm talking near***fights)

> Field #2    Myself and 5 friends went to this field, 4 were renting guns
> and had never played before.  They put us on the rookie field (I had
> just boought my first semi (VM-68!) and was still very much a
> recreational player.)  My friends and I were the first 5 people out.
> (we were not all on the same team.)  The other players said we were too
> good!!! So we had to play on the field where two established teams were
> practicing against each other.  5 guys with VM-68's and rentals against
> autocockers, and automags.  WTF.   Staff refused our requests to move
> back to the other field.  This was my first and last visit.

> Field #3    An indoor field in a Mall.  (maybe 100ft x 50 ft with
> barrels and pallets as cover.)  A great place to introduce new players!
> Except for the Jackass with the Angel that would run through 300 rounds
> per game, shoot every player 3 times to make sure they were dead, and
> kill every person on the other team every time.  I can't bellieve this
> guy enjoyed it.  he was beating up on 13 year olds and he was probably
> 35.    I talked to the owner and told him that the jackass was runing it
> for everyone.  He said he's not going to stop him because he's his best
> customer and is there every night!    This place closed 2 months
> later...hmmm no new customers????

> So, this is why I play outlaw.  Why should I be villified on this
> newsgroup for my choice?

> REason #1  No insurance.
>    I mountain bike and rock climb at places with no insurace.  Why is
> paintball different.  PLAY AT YOUR OWN RISK.

> Reason #2   Tresspassing.
>    This Land is My Land

> Reason #3  No medic
>    I play with friends who know how to call for help.  And most of us
> know first aid. (Learn it, it aint hard)

> Reason #4  No chrongraph.
>   I play with friends.  Real friends that I trust.

> Reason #5  Support local businesses (fields)
>   I did, and they failed me.   I do buy my equipment locally though.

> Reason #6  No Refs
>   See # 4

> Reason #7 Hurt on the Field and Nobody Finding You for Several Days
>   ummm do You play alone?

> Reason #8  You are taking your life into your own hands.
>   Hmmm that would be life.  Have fun sitting in you safety bubble!

> Anyone else got a reason I shouldn't play outlaw????


 
 
 

Whats wrong with outlaw paintball (NOTHING!)

Post by Voltag » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 13:20:34

Excuse me Andy, but #7 came from one of my posts and I just can't let
something like that slide.  Just in case you are unfamiliar with it, it's
called sarcasm.
sarcasm   Pronunciation Key  (s?rkzm)
n.
  1.. A cutting, often ironic remark intended to wound.
  2.. A form of wit that is marked by the use of sarcastic language and is
intended to make its victim the ***of contempt or ridicule.
  3.. The use of sarcasm.
No I don't play paintball by myself.  In fact we're planning an outlaw game
for a few weeks from now.  My neighbors are going to LOVE me.  w00t w00t.
Lighten up a little man.  There's going to be jackasses everywhere you play.

Volt
MVP Products LLC


Quote:
> I've been reading this group for the last two months.  Been playing
> paintball off and on for over ten years (first gun was a Splatmaster!)
> I love Outlaw ball.  I do not play on commercial fields.  Every
> experience I've on commercial fields had sucked.  I have a good job, so
> it ain't the cost I dislike.  It's the experience.  These are my 3
> commercial field experiences.

>     Field #1   This field actually started out good and went downhill.
> I played here a total of six times.
>        Here's what happened the last 3 times.
>                     No input from players allowed.  "You all liked
> playing that field huh? well lets change fields
>                     Refs would return to the staging area in the middle
> of the game.
>                     Refs would not kick out overly agressive players.
> (I'm talking near***fights)

> Field #2    Myself and 5 friends went to this field, 4 were renting guns
> and had never played before.  They put us on the rookie field (I had
> just boought my first semi (VM-68!) and was still very much a
> recreational player.)  My friends and I were the first 5 people out.
> (we were not all on the same team.)  The other players said we were too
> good!!! So we had to play on the field where two established teams were
> practicing against each other.  5 guys with VM-68's and rentals against
> autocockers, and automags.  WTF.   Staff refused our requests to move
> back to the other field.  This was my first and last visit.

> Field #3    An indoor field in a Mall.  (maybe 100ft x 50 ft with
> barrels and pallets as cover.)  A great place to introduce new players!
> Except for the Jackass with the Angel that would run through 300 rounds
> per game, shoot every player 3 times to make sure they were dead, and
> kill every person on the other team every time.  I can't bellieve this
> guy enjoyed it.  he was beating up on 13 year olds and he was probably
> 35.    I talked to the owner and told him that the jackass was runing it
> for everyone.  He said he's not going to stop him because he's his best
> customer and is there every night!    This place closed 2 months
> later...hmmm no new customers????

> So, this is why I play outlaw.  Why should I be villified on this
> newsgroup for my choice?

> REason #1  No insurance.
>    I mountain bike and rock climb at places with no insurace.  Why is
> paintball different.  PLAY AT YOUR OWN RISK.

> Reason #2   Tresspassing.
>    This Land is My Land

> Reason #3  No medic
>    I play with friends who know how to call for help.  And most of us
> know first aid. (Learn it, it aint hard)

> Reason #4  No chrongraph.
>   I play with friends.  Real friends that I trust.

> Reason #5  Support local businesses (fields)
>   I did, and they failed me.   I do buy my equipment locally though.

> Reason #6  No Refs
>   See # 4

> Reason #7 Hurt on the Field and Nobody Finding You for Several Days
>   ummm do You play alone?

> Reason #8  You are taking your life into your own hands.
>   Hmmm that would be life.  Have fun sitting in you safety bubble!

> Anyone else got a reason I shouldn't play outlaw????

begin 666 prime.gif
M1TE&.#EA! `6`/ ``/___P```"'Y! $`````+ `````$`!8```(.A(^I$<;>
*0)2JVHLO00$`.P``
`
end

begin 666 abreve.gif
M1TE&.#EA!P`/`/ ``/___P```"'Y! $`````+ `````'``\```(5A ^!H<P(
1C3M*VDMK:KAZ_3S1&!$H`#L`
`
end

begin 666 lprime.gif
M1TE&.#EA`P`6`/ ``/___P```"'Y! $`````+ `````#`!8```(+A(\)8;P-
'E9PT$10`.P``
`
end

begin 666 schwa.gif


`
end

 
 
 

Whats wrong with outlaw paintball (NOTHING!)

Post by Matt Taylo » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 14:43:22

Andy,

I think you one of the biggest issues with "outlaw ball", chronograph.  This
all pertains to safety.  I have been playing for about 2 years and 3 times I
have gone to the chrono and have been shooting hot.  These were at the
beginning of the day with no adjustments made to my marker from the previous
time.  A chronograph is a must even if they are your friends.  Sure you can
say masks are rated to 300 and there is probably a buffer in there, but if a
person is playing with an older mask or one that has been abused who is to
say if it will work.  I really have no problem playing outlaw, as matter of
fact when I visit family in Idaho that's all we can play.

The other thing is making sure everyone understands when they can take off
their mask.  Case in point is my brother was playing with some friends and
they invited a guy they work with. In one game he started to lift his mask
because it fogged up the next thing you know he took a ball right under the
eye.  His eye was swollen shut within a few minutes and was so the next day.
He didn't suffer any permanent damage, but rest assured he won't be invited
anymore.  Just my 2 cents worth.

Matt


Quote:
> I've been reading this group for the last two months.  Been playing
> paintball off and on for over ten years (first gun was a Splatmaster!)
> I love Outlaw ball.  I do not play on commercial fields.  Every
> experience I've on commercial fields had sucked.  I have a good job, so
> it ain't the cost I dislike.  It's the experience.  These are my 3
> commercial field experiences.

>     Field #1   This field actually started out good and went downhill.
> I played here a total of six times.
>        Here's what happened the last 3 times.
>                     No input from players allowed.  "You all liked
> playing that field huh? well lets change fields
>                     Refs would return to the staging area in the middle
> of the game.
>                     Refs would not kick out overly agressive players.
> (I'm talking near***fights)

> Field #2    Myself and 5 friends went to this field, 4 were renting guns
> and had never played before.  They put us on the rookie field (I had
> just boought my first semi (VM-68!) and was still very much a
> recreational player.)  My friends and I were the first 5 people out.
> (we were not all on the same team.)  The other players said we were too
> good!!! So we had to play on the field where two established teams were
> practicing against each other.  5 guys with VM-68's and rentals against
> autocockers, and automags.  WTF.   Staff refused our requests to move
> back to the other field.  This was my first and last visit.

> Field #3    An indoor field in a Mall.  (maybe 100ft x 50 ft with
> barrels and pallets as cover.)  A great place to introduce new players!
> Except for the Jackass with the Angel that would run through 300 rounds
> per game, shoot every player 3 times to make sure they were dead, and
> kill every person on the other team every time.  I can't bellieve this
> guy enjoyed it.  he was beating up on 13 year olds and he was probably
> 35.    I talked to the owner and told him that the jackass was runing it
> for everyone.  He said he's not going to stop him because he's his best
> customer and is there every night!    This place closed 2 months
> later...hmmm no new customers????

> So, this is why I play outlaw.  Why should I be villified on this
> newsgroup for my choice?

> REason #1  No insurance.
>    I mountain bike and rock climb at places with no insurace.  Why is
> paintball different.  PLAY AT YOUR OWN RISK.

> Reason #2   Tresspassing.
>    This Land is My Land

> Reason #3  No medic
>    I play with friends who know how to call for help.  And most of us
> know first aid. (Learn it, it aint hard)

> Reason #4  No chrongraph.
>   I play with friends.  Real friends that I trust.

> Reason #5  Support local businesses (fields)
>   I did, and they failed me.   I do buy my equipment locally though.

> Reason #6  No Refs
>   See # 4

> Reason #7 Hurt on the Field and Nobody Finding You for Several Days
>   ummm do You play alone?

> Reason #8  You are taking your life into your own hands.
>   Hmmm that would be life.  Have fun sitting in you safety bubble!

> Anyone else got a reason I shouldn't play outlaw????

 
 
 

Whats wrong with outlaw paintball (NOTHING!)

Post by 0shark » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 14:44:10


Quote:
> I don't think anyone really has a problem with outlaw ball, persay...but
there
> are certain items which you haven't mentioned...

> 1. Do you use a chronograph?  This one goes without saying.  If you do,
good
> for you.  Most outlaw ballers don't appear to, and just use the 'yeah that
> looks around 300 fps' method.  You say you 'trust' your friends.  Thats
great,
> and a wonderful thing, but do you 'trust' that springs won't tighten,
loosen,
> or generally mess up?  Keeping in mind that all it takes is a tiny amount
of
> extra tension to make a paintball move at a velocity that current goggle
> systems are not designed to handle.  Trust has absolutely nothing to do
with
> it.

Total agreement.  Buy a chronie, they are not too expensive and you can't
play safely without them.  Guns do "settle" as they are shot, and the
velocity can change dramatically if you disassemble them at all.

Quote:
> 2. Have you netted the area in which you play?  It's been my experience
that no
> matter how remote the location, no matter how well marked, no matter how
> private the property, people will always end up wandering too close to the
> field while not wearing goggles.  Example: My old team captain built a
field in
> his backyard in bumble-frig Rhode Island.  We never bothered with netting
(We
> DID have a chronie).  We then started bothering with netting because
> periodically a bow hunter would wander through our 'field'.

This is a judgement call.  I play where the only way a person not playing
could get hit is to trespass, by hundreds of yards in most directions.  We
have netting for the safe area, but not around the field.

- Show quoted text -

Quote:
> 3. Insurance IS actually an issue.  Maybe you don't think so, but wait
until
> someone gets hurt.  You'll end up paying those medical expenses out of
YOUR
> pocket as the owner of the land.  Trespassing or no you are still
accountable
> for any injuries that may occur.  For example: ever hear of the burglar
who
> tripped and fell in a house he was robbing and proceeded to sue and WIN a
> lawsuit against the owners?
> Other than that, I doubt very much anyone here would object to outlaw
ball.
> The only real objections we DO have is that people don't play
safely...Keeping
> other paintballers, and more importantly, non paintballers safe needs to
be our
> top priority.  You hurt your case in a big way by admitting that you don't
use
> a chronograph.  Hell, those of us who play tourneys in general 'trust'
each
> other...I still wouldn't set foot on a field that didn't require
chronying.

> Mitch

 
 
 

Whats wrong with outlaw paintball (NOTHING!)

Post by Joe Mart » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 14:59:20

The statement below is just another urban legend.  See snopes.com for
specifics.  It ain't true, folks.

http://www.snopes2.com/legal/lawsuits.htm

Quote:
>  For example: ever hear of the burglar who
> tripped and fell in a house he was robbing and proceeded to sue and WIN a
> lawsuit against the owners?

 
 
 

Whats wrong with outlaw paintball (NOTHING!)

Post by Jim Pop » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 16:47:24

I know this will flame a few but I play on 2 different commercial fields I
can afford it anytime I want, and I play for a team 3 and 5 man speedball. I
practice every weekend and we have chrony's, but I still play once a month
with my friends and I go OUTLAW for a lot of reasons. One is different
terrain two it is cheaper and three if you ever get caught doing something
to dangerous stupid wrong or worse cheating you do not come back ever!!!! We
play on several friends farms and over odd country off back roads... it is
the best. I bring friends and family and we all know... do not cross the
line to the field without goggles and don't shoot back to the base ever. A
few idiots can ruin paintball for everyone but smart people do not have that
problem and I hate to be lumped with a group of folks who do all the wrong
things hurting them selves and others. The issue is how to protect morons
from getting hurt. I have been playing paintball since 1984 and my worst
injury was lost some skin off a knuckle getting shot to close. I want the
right to play when and where I want same as any impromptu football game
softball basketball or any other sport. Play smart and there is no prob so
please try not to make it out to be insurance or safety it is restriction of
my right to do what I want when I want where I want I respect others safety
so respect my right to have my sport.

Quote:
> Andy,

> I think you one of the biggest issues with "outlaw ball", chronograph.
This
> all pertains to safety.  I have been playing for about 2 years and 3 times
I
> have gone to the chrono and have been shooting hot.  These were at the
> beginning of the day with no adjustments made to my marker from the
previous
> time.  A chronograph is a must even if they are your friends.  Sure you
can
> say masks are rated to 300 and there is probably a buffer in there, but if
a
> person is playing with an older mask or one that has been abused who is to
> say if it will work.  I really have no problem playing outlaw, as matter
of
> fact when I visit family in Idaho that's all we can play.

> The other thing is making sure everyone understands when they can take off
> their mask.  Case in point is my brother was playing with some friends and
> they invited a guy they work with. In one game he started to lift his mask
> because it fogged up the next thing you know he took a ball right under
the
> eye.  His eye was swollen shut within a few minutes and was so the next
day.
> He didn't suffer any permanent damage, but rest assured he won't be
invited
> anymore.  Just my 2 cents worth.

> Matt



> > I've been reading this group for the last two months.  Been playing
> > paintball off and on for over ten years (first gun was a Splatmaster!)
> > I love Outlaw ball.  I do not play on commercial fields.  Every
> > experience I've on commercial fields had sucked.  I have a good job, so
> > it ain't the cost I dislike.  It's the experience.  These are my 3
> > commercial field experiences.

> >     Field #1   This field actually started out good and went downhill.
> > I played here a total of six times.
> >        Here's what happened the last 3 times.
> >                     No input from players allowed.  "You all liked
> > playing that field huh? well lets change fields
> >                     Refs would return to the staging area in the middle
> > of the game.
> >                     Refs would not kick out overly agressive players.
> > (I'm talking near***fights)

> > Field #2    Myself and 5 friends went to this field, 4 were renting guns
> > and had never played before.  They put us on the rookie field (I had
> > just boought my first semi (VM-68!) and was still very much a
> > recreational player.)  My friends and I were the first 5 people out.
> > (we were not all on the same team.)  The other players said we were too
> > good!!! So we had to play on the field where two established teams were
> > practicing against each other.  5 guys with VM-68's and rentals against
> > autocockers, and automags.  WTF.   Staff refused our requests to move
> > back to the other field.  This was my first and last visit.

> > Field #3    An indoor field in a Mall.  (maybe 100ft x 50 ft with
> > barrels and pallets as cover.)  A great place to introduce new players!
> > Except for the Jackass with the Angel that would run through 300 rounds
> > per game, shoot every player 3 times to make sure they were dead, and
> > kill every person on the other team every time.  I can't bellieve this
> > guy enjoyed it.  he was beating up on 13 year olds and he was probably
> > 35.    I talked to the owner and told him that the jackass was runing it
> > for everyone.  He said he's not going to stop him because he's his best
> > customer and is there every night!    This place closed 2 months
> > later...hmmm no new customers????

> > So, this is why I play outlaw.  Why should I be villified on this
> > newsgroup for my choice?

> > REason #1  No insurance.
> >    I mountain bike and rock climb at places with no insurace.  Why is
> > paintball different.  PLAY AT YOUR OWN RISK.

> > Reason #2   Tresspassing.
> >    This Land is My Land

> > Reason #3  No medic
> >    I play with friends who know how to call for help.  And most of us
> > know first aid. (Learn it, it aint hard)

> > Reason #4  No chrongraph.
> >   I play with friends.  Real friends that I trust.

> > Reason #5  Support local businesses (fields)
> >   I did, and they failed me.   I do buy my equipment locally though.

> > Reason #6  No Refs
> >   See # 4

> > Reason #7 Hurt on the Field and Nobody Finding You for Several Days
> >   ummm do You play alone?

> > Reason #8  You are taking your life into your own hands.
> >   Hmmm that would be life.  Have fun sitting in you safety bubble!

> > Anyone else got a reason I shouldn't play outlaw????

 
 
 

Whats wrong with outlaw paintball (NOTHING!)

Post by Big Habe » Fri, 22 Mar 2002 21:03:07

You're righ, this WILL bring a flame.

1. 'Doo not cross the line to the field'.  Well thats intelligent, and I'm sure
paintballs know not to cross the line OFF of the field as well.

2. Whether you want to believe it or not, insurance IS an issue.  If you want
to make it an argument about having the right to do what you want, where you
want, why don't you go walk down a main street in town ***?  Simply because
it is against the law.  Unfortunately for those who play Outlaw paintball
responsibly, so is playing in an unsafe manner.

Quote:
>Subject: Re: Whats wrong with outlaw paintball (NOTHING!)

>Date: 3/21/2002 2:47 AM Eastern Standard Time

>I know this will flame a few but I play on 2 different commercial fields I
>can afford it anytime I want, and I play for a team 3 and 5 man speedball. I
>practice every weekend and we have chrony's, but I still play once a month
>with my friends and I go OUTLAW for a lot of reasons. One is different
>terrain two it is cheaper and three if you ever get caught doing something
>to dangerous stupid wrong or worse cheating you do not come back ever!!!! We
>play on several friends farms and over odd country off back roads... it is
>the best. I bring friends and family and we all know... do not cross the
>line to the field without goggles and don't shoot back to the base ever. A
>few idiots can ruin paintball for everyone but smart people do not have that
>problem and I hate to be lumped with a group of folks who do all the wrong
>things hurting them selves and others. The issue is how to protect morons
>from getting hurt. I have been playing paintball since 1984 and my worst
>injury was lost some skin off a knuckle getting shot to close. I want the
>right to play when and where I want same as any impromptu football game
>softball basketball or any other sport. Play smart and there is no prob so
>please try not to make it out to be insurance or safety it is restriction of
>my right to do what I want when I want where I want I respect others safety
>so respect my right to have my sport.

 
 
 

Whats wrong with outlaw paintball (NOTHING!)

Post by Jim Pop » Sat, 23 Mar 2002 04:05:47

since

Quote:
> You're righ, this WILL bring a flame.

> 1. 'Doo not cross the line to the field'.  Well thats intelligent, and I'm
sure
> paintballs know not to cross the line OFF of the field as well.

since the rally area is 50 yards from the feild let me know which ass is
that bad a shot and makes it back there.

Quote:
> 2. Whether you want to believe it or not, insurance IS an issue.  If you
want
> to make it an argument about having the right to do what you want, where
you
> want, why don't you go walk down a main street in town ***?  Simply
because
> it is against the law.  Unfortunately for those who play Outlaw paintball
> responsibly, so is playing in an unsafe manner.

people play football and go rock climbing with no insurance everyday in
national parks so DUH it is not the issue if you don't want to give money to
some insurance companys. ***?? What the hell are you on? lay off the crack
pipe and try to stay on the issues before you speak ever again ....(low
grumble) "Damn 14 year old idiots."

Quote:
> >Subject: Re: Whats wrong with outlaw paintball (NOTHING!)

> >Date: 3/21/2002 2:47 AM Eastern Standard Time

> >I know this will flame a few but I play on 2 different commercial fields
I
> >can afford it anytime I want, and I play for a team 3 and 5 man
speedball. I
> >practice every weekend and we have chrony's, but I still play once a
month
> >with my friends and I go OUTLAW for a lot of reasons. One is different
> >terrain two it is cheaper and three if you ever get caught doing
something
> >to dangerous stupid wrong or worse cheating you do not come back ever!!!!
We
> >play on several friends farms and over odd country off back roads... it
is
> >the best. I bring friends and family and we all know... do not cross the
> >line to the field without goggles and don't shoot back to the base ever.
A
> >few idiots can ruin paintball for everyone but smart people do not have
that
> >problem and I hate to be lumped with a group of folks who do all the
wrong
> >things hurting them selves and others. The issue is how to protect morons
> >from getting hurt. I have been playing paintball since 1984 and my worst
> >injury was lost some skin off a knuckle getting shot to close. I want the
> >right to play when and where I want same as any impromptu football game
> >softball basketball or any other sport. Play smart and there is no prob
so
> >please try not to make it out to be insurance or safety it is restriction
of
> >my right to do what I want when I want where I want I respect others
safety
> >so respect my right to have my sport.

 
 
 

Whats wrong with outlaw paintball (NOTHING!)

Post by greg » Sat, 23 Mar 2002 07:46:01

COULDENT HAVE SAID IT BETTER !!!!!

--

Quote:
> I've been reading this group for the last two months.  Been playing
> paintball off and on for over ten years (first gun was a Splatmaster!)
> I love Outlaw ball.  I do not play on commercial fields.  Every
> experience I've on commercial fields had sucked.  I have a good job, so
> it ain't the cost I dislike.  It's the experience.  These are my 3
> commercial field experiences.

>     Field #1   This field actually started out good and went downhill.
> I played here a total of six times.
>        Here's what happened the last 3 times.
>                     No input from players allowed.  "You all liked
> playing that field huh? well lets change fields
>                     Refs would return to the staging area in the middle
> of the game.
>                     Refs would not kick out overly agressive players.
> (I'm talking near***fights)

> Field #2    Myself and 5 friends went to this field, 4 were renting guns
> and had never played before.  They put us on the rookie field (I had
> just boought my first semi (VM-68!) and was still very much a
> recreational player.)  My friends and I were the first 5 people out.
> (we were not all on the same team.)  The other players said we were too
> good!!! So we had to play on the field where two established teams were
> practicing against each other.  5 guys with VM-68's and rentals against
> autocockers, and automags.  WTF.   Staff refused our requests to move
> back to the other field.  This was my first and last visit.

> Field #3    An indoor field in a Mall.  (maybe 100ft x 50 ft with
> barrels and pallets as cover.)  A great place to introduce new players!
> Except for the Jackass with the Angel that would run through 300 rounds
> per game, shoot every player 3 times to make sure they were dead, and
> kill every person on the other team every time.  I can't bellieve this
> guy enjoyed it.  he was beating up on 13 year olds and he was probably
> 35.    I talked to the owner and told him that the jackass was runing it
> for everyone.  He said he's not going to stop him because he's his best
> customer and is there every night!    This place closed 2 months
> later...hmmm no new customers????

> So, this is why I play outlaw.  Why should I be villified on this
> newsgroup for my choice?

> REason #1  No insurance.
>    I mountain bike and rock climb at places with no insurace.  Why is
> paintball different.  PLAY AT YOUR OWN RISK.

> Reason #2   Tresspassing.
>    This Land is My Land

> Reason #3  No medic
>    I play with friends who know how to call for help.  And most of us
> know first aid. (Learn it, it aint hard)

> Reason #4  No chrongraph.
>   I play with friends.  Real friends that I trust.

> Reason #5  Support local businesses (fields)
>   I did, and they failed me.   I do buy my equipment locally though.

> Reason #6  No Refs
>   See # 4

> Reason #7 Hurt on the Field and Nobody Finding You for Several Days
>   ummm do You play alone?

> Reason #8  You are taking your life into your own hands.
>   Hmmm that would be life.  Have fun sitting in you safety bubble!

> Anyone else got a reason I shouldn't play outlaw????

Help fight mailbots with these in your tagline:



 
 
 

Whats wrong with outlaw paintball (NOTHING!)

Post by Nevada Smit » Sat, 23 Mar 2002 08:24:19


Quote:
> people play football and go rock climbing with no insurance everyday in
> national parks so DUH it is not the issue if you don't want to give money
to
> some insurance companys. ***?? What the hell are you on? lay off the
crack
> pipe and try to stay on the issues before you speak ever again ....(low
> grumble) "Damn 14 year old idiots."

Playing football and rock climbing is not the same as 10 guys getting
together in a public place shooting projectiles which can harm innocent
bystanders.I if you are on public property doing this then me and my friends
can go where you are shoot our crossbows at targets that we choose.Oh guess
what your ***looks like a good target, I hope you don't get hit.You must
realize that Outlaw ball has it's place in an area that will not allow some
passerby to get zinged.I have a video of some kids playing outlaw and
whacked this old guy on his bike.He was very pissed off.That sort of thing
ruins the sport for everyone.

You can have your outlaw.I am playing it too, but where I go is behind
someone's farm in the woods on his property.All the neighbors know in
advance when we are coming.I don't care so much about insurance because if
you hurt someone chances are you will get sued anyway.I like outlaw ball and
it does have its' place but I don't want to play in an area that I know I
may have a chance to hit someone, even the slimmest one.We as players must
take responsibility and accountability for what we do. Look one day somebody
is going to get hurt doing this if they are not careful.All I care about is
safety first.

Have respect for one another whether outlaw or regulated paintball is all I
am saying.Even here in this group I see people just cursing people and
insulting someone for their opinions.Do what you want, how you want, but a
little class, dignity, and respect is always good while doing whatever you
do.

Nevada

 
 
 

Whats wrong with outlaw paintball (NOTHING!)

Post by Andy » Sat, 23 Mar 2002 11:18:37

I was going to say the same thing but you beat me to it....
Quote:

> The statement below is just another urban legend.  See snopes.com for
> specifics.  It ain't true, folks.

> http://www.snopes2.com/legal/lawsuits.htm

> >  For example: ever hear of the burglar who
> > tripped and fell in a house he was robbing and proceeded to sue and WIN a
> > lawsuit against the owners?

 
 
 

Whats wrong with outlaw paintball (NOTHING!)

Post by Andy » Sat, 23 Mar 2002 11:19:44

I know sarcasm, your post cracked me up.  I just thought I'd throw it in there
for good measure!
Quote:

> Excuse me Andy, but #7 came from one of my posts and I just can't let
> something like that slide.  Just in case you are unfamiliar with it, it's
> called sarcasm.
> sarcasm   Pronunciation Key  (s?rkzm)
> n.
>   1.. A cutting, often ironic remark intended to wound.
>   2.. A form of wit that is marked by the use of sarcastic language and is
> intended to make its victim the ***of contempt or ridicule.
>   3.. The use of sarcasm.
> No I don't play paintball by myself.  In fact we're planning an outlaw game
> for a few weeks from now.  My neighbors are going to LOVE me.  w00t w00t.
> Lighten up a little man.  There's going to be jackasses everywhere you play.

> Volt
> MVP Products LLC



> > I've been reading this group for the last two months.  Been playing
> > paintball off and on for over ten years (first gun was a Splatmaster!)
> > I love Outlaw ball.  I do not play on commercial fields.  Every
> > experience I've on commercial fields had sucked.  I have a good job, so
> > it ain't the cost I dislike.  It's the experience.  These are my 3
> > commercial field experiences.

> >     Field #1   This field actually started out good and went downhill.
> > I played here a total of six times.
> >        Here's what happened the last 3 times.
> >                     No input from players allowed.  "You all liked
> > playing that field huh? well lets change fields
> >                     Refs would return to the staging area in the middle
> > of the game.
> >                     Refs would not kick out overly agressive players.
> > (I'm talking near***fights)

> > Field #2    Myself and 5 friends went to this field, 4 were renting guns
> > and had never played before.  They put us on the rookie field (I had
> > just boought my first semi (VM-68!) and was still very much a
> > recreational player.)  My friends and I were the first 5 people out.
> > (we were not all on the same team.)  The other players said we were too
> > good!!! So we had to play on the field where two established teams were
> > practicing against each other.  5 guys with VM-68's and rentals against
> > autocockers, and automags.  WTF.   Staff refused our requests to move
> > back to the other field.  This was my first and last visit.

> > Field #3    An indoor field in a Mall.  (maybe 100ft x 50 ft with
> > barrels and pallets as cover.)  A great place to introduce new players!
> > Except for the Jackass with the Angel that would run through 300 rounds
> > per game, shoot every player 3 times to make sure they were dead, and
> > kill every person on the other team every time.  I can't bellieve this
> > guy enjoyed it.  he was beating up on 13 year olds and he was probably
> > 35.    I talked to the owner and told him that the jackass was runing it
> > for everyone.  He said he's not going to stop him because he's his best
> > customer and is there every night!    This place closed 2 months
> > later...hmmm no new customers????

> > So, this is why I play outlaw.  Why should I be villified on this
> > newsgroup for my choice?

> > REason #1  No insurance.
> >    I mountain bike and rock climb at places with no insurace.  Why is
> > paintball different.  PLAY AT YOUR OWN RISK.

> > Reason #2   Tresspassing.
> >    This Land is My Land

> > Reason #3  No medic
> >    I play with friends who know how to call for help.  And most of us
> > know first aid. (Learn it, it aint hard)

> > Reason #4  No chrongraph.
> >   I play with friends.  Real friends that I trust.

> > Reason #5  Support local businesses (fields)
> >   I did, and they failed me.   I do buy my equipment locally though.

> > Reason #6  No Refs
> >   See # 4

> > Reason #7 Hurt on the Field and Nobody Finding You for Several Days
> >   ummm do You play alone?

> > Reason #8  You are taking your life into your own hands.
> >   Hmmm that would be life.  Have fun sitting in you safety bubble!

> > Anyone else got a reason I shouldn't play outlaw????

>  [Image]

>  [Image]

>  [Image]

>  [Image]

 
 
 

Whats wrong with outlaw paintball (NOTHING!)

Post by Andy » Sat, 23 Mar 2002 11:46:35

I knew I would set off a hot thread....

Everyone seems to agree with you on the chrongraph part.

I may get one for my rifle, and if I do I will use it for paintball too.   But, I
don't care if I get hit with a 350fps paintball.  Can any guns even break 400fps?
I would bet money that a paintball mask/googles could withstand a 400fps ball with
out cracking.   (It's called over engineering to avoid  product liability
lawsuits.)  I'm sure it's life would be signifigantly shortened, but it would not
crack.  (And we all do replaces lenses yearly.  Thats only about 6 or 7 games.)
300fps is an arbitrary number picked as the speed limit years ago.   Going much
slower and balls don't fly as far and don't break as often,  going much faster and
you get bigger brusies.   300 was a compromise.   You do have me wondering how much
googles can take now.  Perhaps a chrono is in order.... but I doubt any of our guns
could bust a pair of googles set at their max settings.

Has anyone ever seen a pair of PB googles broken by a paintball?  Just curious.

As for netting, we are very remote, and you would have to be nuts to play during
hunting season.  (It's too cold anyways.)   Tresspassers would have to cross marked
barbed wire or climb a 60 foot river cliff to get to my land.

Who is going to sue me????  Tresspassers??   Joe nailed it, that is a myth.

But, the point of my original post, was completey missed by everyone.  That
includes me, becasue on re-reading it, I see that I never got to my point.   When
someone plays outlaw ball, take it easy on them.  (TA-DA!!! the point!!!)    I
wonder how many people have been turned away from this group because of they way
they were treated after admiting they play outlaw.   I know it sounds like im on
the defensive, but I have no problem with someone making safety recomendations.
Tell them why commercial is better.  But if they disagree, don't bash them.

Quote:

> I don't think anyone really has a problem with outlaw ball, persay...but there
> are certain items which you haven't mentioned...

> 1. Do you use a chronograph?  This one goes without saying.  If you do, good
> for you.  Most outlaw ballers don't appear to, and just use the 'yeah that
> looks around 300 fps' method.  You say you 'trust' your friends.  Thats great,
> and a wonderful thing, but do you 'trust' that springs won't tighten, loosen,
> or generally mess up?  Keeping in mind that all it takes is a tiny amount of
> extra tension to make a paintball move at a velocity that current goggle
> systems are not designed to handle.  Trust has absolutely nothing to do with
> it.

> 2. Have you netted the area in which you play?  It's been my experience that no
> matter how remote the location, no matter how well marked, no matter how
> private the property, people will always end up wandering too close to the
> field while not wearing goggles.  Example: My old team captain built a field in
> his backyard in bumble-frig Rhode Island.  We never bothered with netting (We
> DID have a chronie).  We then started bothering with netting because
> periodically a bow hunter would wander through our 'field'.

> 3. Insurance IS actually an issue.  Maybe you don't think so, but wait until
> someone gets hurt.  You'll end up paying those medical expenses out of YOUR
> pocket as the owner of the land.  Trespassing or no you are still accountable
> for any injuries that may occur.  For example: ever hear of the burglar who
> tripped and fell in a house he was robbing and proceeded to sue and WIN a
> lawsuit against the owners?

> Other than that, I doubt very much anyone here would object to outlaw ball.
> The only real objections we DO have is that people don't play safely...Keeping
> other paintballers, and more importantly, non paintballers safe needs to be our
> top priority.  You hurt your case in a big way by admitting that you don't use
> a chronograph.  Hell, those of us who play tourneys in general 'trust' each
> other...I still wouldn't set foot on a field that didn't require chronying.

> Mitch