Seen the pictures of St Cuthbert's BC at WHoRR?

Seen the pictures of St Cuthbert's BC at WHoRR?

Post by Henry La » Tue, 08 Mar 2005 03:27:29


http://www.livejournal.com/~berrimar/302.html

Sad, and from the pictures rather alarming, though I expect there was
much more help around than you can actually see.

I've been trying to work out what happened, though: they got stuck on
the buoy, yes, but why the capsize and the smashed boat?  Maybe if I
knew the Tideway I'd know the answer.

 
 
 

Seen the pictures of St Cuthbert's BC at WHoRR?

Post by Jon Anderso » Tue, 08 Mar 2005 03:51:25

Quote:

> http://www.livejournal.com/~berrimar/302.html

> Sad, and from the pictures rather alarming, though I expect there was
> much more help around than you can actually see.

> I've been trying to work out what happened, though: they got stuck on
> the buoy, yes, but why the capsize and the smashed boat?  Maybe if I
> knew the Tideway I'd know the answer.

By the time someone said "bow and 3 row on" it was too late and the boat
was well and truly gone.
The wind and tide were against them and you have to remember that the
bow was in quicker water than the stern when the boat was across the
river at an angle.

Are they the ones who caught a crab and stopped rowing entirely for 10
seconds?

Jon
--


    [ All views expressed are personal unless otherwise stated ]

 
 
 

Seen the pictures of St Cuthbert's BC at WHoRR?

Post by anton2.. » Tue, 08 Mar 2005 03:55:01

Quote:

> http://www.livejournal.com/~berrimar/302.html

> Sad, and from the pictures rather alarming, though I expect there was
> much more help around than you can actually see.

> I've been trying to work out what happened, though: they got stuck on
> the buoy, yes, but why the capsize and the smashed boat?  Maybe if I
> knew the Tideway I'd know the answer.

Yes I think you would. The power of the  tide is immmnse and
unrelenting especially on the outside of the bend where the buoy is. It
can be compared to a normal river on flood! This crews boat was
finished as soon as the bows went through about 30 degrees from into
the stream. If 2 had paddled with bows blade it would have had the same
effect as a bow thruster on a ship. But this looks a pretty
inexperienced crew.

The got off very lightly I would suggest.

 
 
 

Seen the pictures of St Cuthbert's BC at WHoRR?

Post by Nick Sues » Wed, 09 Mar 2005 10:01:02


Quote:
> On Sun, 06 Mar 2005 18:27:29 +0000, Henry Law

> The follow-up posts on this are a worrying read.  If there's to be an
> enquiry then some of what's posted might be prejudicial.

Without wishing to be prejudicial, it looks pretty frightening. Amidst all
the other dangers of nine people tumbling into water that is fast flowing
and none too warm, there's lots of stuff to get tangled up in, and
potentially trap people under water. Thankfully that didn't happen.

One thing that often gets missed in the briefing of crews unfamiliar with
fast and turbulent water is the need for the engine room to respond in a
swift and positive manner to signals from the bridge. About 15 years ago
(and nearly 15kg lighter!) I had to make this point when occasionally coxing
crews of veteran novice women on Melbourne's Yarra River, which whilst
sometimes no more than a docile meander can at others take on the nature of
a fierce torrent. On days when the water was still rowable but clearly
tricky I'd make it plain that even if sitting at easy, crew members could
only reach for a drink or start to put on clothing when I told them it was
safe so to do.

To avoid any possibility of prejudice, let it be clear that I cannot
possibly tell from those pictures if this in any way relates to what
happened there on the Tideway.

 
 
 

Seen the pictures of St Cuthbert's BC at WHoRR?

Post by Christopher Anto » Wed, 09 Mar 2005 10:01:41


Quote:
> On Sun, 06 Mar 2005 18:27:29 +0000, Henry Law

> I made the mistake of showing the pictures to my wife, who is now
> concerned for my welfare a week on Saturday/Sunday.

Better still show them to your cox and make sure you

a) have someone competent rather than picking someone just because they're
exactly 55kg
b) have someone who realises that THEY are in charge of the boat and what
goes on in it at all times
c) have someone who is fully briefed on the perils of rowing on a tideway
d) row in a bouyant boat

 
 
 

Seen the pictures of St Cuthbert's BC at WHoRR?

Post by Guide Frid » Wed, 09 Mar 2005 18:03:49

Quote:
> To avoid any possibility of prejudice, let it be clear that I cannot
> possibly tell from those pictures if this in any way relates to what
> happened there on the Tideway.

The pictures are in no way prejudicial. They were taken at the time of
the incident and are important in helping any inquiry into this event.
They are fact. Everyone was safe, thankfully, and there are no reasons
to believe any criminal charges will be brought. Therefore prejudice
is not an issue.

However, the comments associated with the pictures aren't helpful and
will only hinder any investigation into the event. I notice some of
the posters typing contrary information based on what they think they
can see in the pictures. this isn't helpful. It seems a lot of people
are quick to apportion blame.

 
 
 

Seen the pictures of St Cuthbert's BC at WHoRR?

Post by Neil Wallac » Wed, 09 Mar 2005 18:47:27

Quote:

> One thing that often gets missed in the briefing of crews unfamiliar
> with fast and turbulent water is the need for the engine room to
> respond in a swift and positive manner to signals from the bridge.
> About 15 years ago (and nearly 15kg lighter!) I had to make this
> point when occasionally coxing crews of veteran novice women on
> Melbourne's Yarra River, which whilst sometimes no more than a docile
> meander can at others take on the nature of a fierce torrent. On days
> when the water was still rowable but clearly tricky I'd make it plain
> that even if sitting at easy, crew members could only reach for a
> drink or start to put on clothing when I told them it was safe so to
> do.

good point Nick.
I'm forwarding this to my crew who are doing Tideway and Vets Horr.

We have a very experienced cox, but you re absolutely correct, that can
count for nothing unless the whole crew is on the ball at all times.

 
 
 

Seen the pictures of St Cuthbert's BC at WHoRR?

Post by Sara » Wed, 09 Mar 2005 20:53:17

and know all the circulation patterns even for bits of the tideway you
don't think you'll have to navigate (that's how we almost came unstuck
last year in the vets HoR - our cox knew how to get to the start and
marshal, and what to do at the finish and get back to CSBH - but not
how to get from down stream of putney bridge with a rising tide onto
putney embankment -only the fact that the 99's crew smashed into the
moored boats first stopped it being us..
 
 
 

Seen the pictures of St Cuthbert's BC at WHoRR?

Post by Jon Anderso » Wed, 09 Mar 2005 21:16:27

Quote:

> and know all the circulation patterns even for bits of the tideway you
> don't think you'll have to navigate (that's how we almost came unstuck
> last year in the vets HoR - our cox knew how to get to the start and
> marshal, and what to do at the finish and get back to CSBH - but not
> how to get from down stream of putney bridge with a rising tide onto
> putney embankment -only the fact that the 99's crew smashed into the
> moored boats first stopped it being us..

Er, there wasn't a Cambridge '99 boat entered in the Vets Head last year!

Jon
--


    [ All views expressed are personal unless otherwise stated ]

 
 
 

Seen the pictures of St Cuthbert's BC at WHoRR?

Post by Sarah Farquha » Wed, 09 Mar 2005 21:56:14

Quote:


>> putney embankment -only the fact that the 99's crew smashed into the
>> moored boats first stopped it being us..

> Er, there wasn't a Cambridge '99 boat entered in the Vets Head last year!

> Jon

that'd be the 'Cambridge veterans' then...
 
 
 

Seen the pictures of St Cuthbert's BC at WHoRR?

Post by chris harriso » Wed, 09 Mar 2005 21:56:58

Quote:

> I made the mistake of showing the pictures to my wife, who is now
> concerned for my welfare a week on Saturday/Sunday.

And, even as we speak, in conjunction with the regional safety officer
and the Port of London Authority, the Vets Head safety plan is being
tweaked to take advantage of the new knowledge and experience gained
from Saturday (and, for that matter, the couple of incidents in
yesterday's Schools Head).