Lou and Rickey (Red Sox talk)

Lou and Rickey (Red Sox talk)

Post by William Willia » Thu, 09 Jan 1992 18:30:25


In the Sun. Dec. 29 (I believe) Boston Globe, Peter Gammons claimed
that he had it from "officials" in Oakland that the A's would con-
sider a Greenwell-Rickey Henderson trade.  To my amazement, except
for some talk show discussion, the media had nothing further on this.

Then yesterday's Globe reported that Gorman had just returned from
a two week vacation, and said he wouldn't pursue talks with the A's
about Henderson.  Gorman wouldn't give reasons, but the Globe specu-
lated that Rickey's no-trade-without-his-okay clause and his distaste
for Boston precludes such a deal.

(I believe there has been some discussion of this prospect in this
group).

If Gorman's reason is that he feels Rickey wouldn't get on with the
Boston media, and would upset the clubhouse chemistry, then Gorman
is as big a fool (and racist) as people like Eddie Andelman make him
out to be.  Henderson is EXACTLY what the Red Sox need, and his
acquisition would be a turning point in Red Sox history (IMO).

Has anyone out West heard anything from Henderson that would shed
light on this?

 
 
 

Lou and Rickey (Red Sox talk)

Post by Dave Kirs » Fri, 10 Jan 1992 04:41:13


Quote:

>In the Sun. Dec. 29 (I believe) Boston Globe, Peter Gammons claimed
>that he had it from "officials" in Oakland that the A's would con-
>sider a Greenwell-Rickey Henderson trade.  To my amazement, except
>for some talk show discussion, the media had nothing further on this.

>Then yesterday's Globe reported that Gorman had just returned from
>a two week vacation, and said he wouldn't pursue talks with the A's
>about Henderson.  Gorman wouldn't give reasons, but the Globe specu-
>lated that Rickey's no-trade-without-his-okay clause and his distaste
>for Boston precludes such a deal.

  I suggest Lou Gorman stop eating Soylent Green, if that's the case. If
Sandy Alderson would even *consider* trading Rickey for only Greenwell, he
outta be shot. Matter of fact, I think we'll be hearing something about a
disgruntled youth with flaming locks and an Uzzi going on a shooting spree
at the Oakland front office if this happens.

  Hell, we'll give the A's Jeff Kent (2B prospect stuck behind Alomar in
Toronto with excellent MLEs) to replace Mikey, Ed Sprague to replace the
Stone Glacier at 3B, Derek Bell to take Rickey's place in LF and Jim Acker
so that Huckabay gets to take home a souvenir on a regular basis. :-) All
for Rickey.

Quote:
>If Gorman's reason is that he feels Rickey wouldn't get on with the
>Boston media, and would upset the clubhouse chemistry, then Gorman
>is as big a fool (and racist) as people like Eddie Andelman make him
>out to be.  Henderson is EXACTLY what the Red Sox need, and his
>acquisition would be a turning point in Red Sox history (IMO).

  Henderson is EXACTLY what any team needs: an ideal leadoff man with some
bonus extras. If the A's are gonna give him up, it better be a 'rebuild in
one move' type of trade.

--
Dave Hung Like a Jim Acker Slider Kirsch .. Valentine + Hockey Stick = ???  

"Nice fella, but about as sharp as a sack of wet mice."
  - Foghorn Leghorn on Cito Gaston

 
 
 

Lou and Rickey (Red Sox talk)

Post by Gary Life By The Drop Huckab » Fri, 10 Jan 1992 06:05:35


Quote:
>  I suggest Lou Gorman stop eating Soylent Green, if that's the case. If
>Sandy Alderson would even *consider* trading Rickey for only Greenwell, he
>outta be shot. Matter of fact, I think we'll be hearing something about a
>disgruntled youth with flaming locks and an Uzzi going on a shooting spree
>at the Oakland front office if this happens.

Not really.  The deal was supposedly Greenwell, Burks, Gardiner, and
Cooper.  At least that's what the local talking heads claim.

Quote:
>  Hell, we'll give the A's Jeff Kent (2B prospect stuck behind Alomar in
>Toronto with excellent MLEs) to replace Mikey, Ed Sprague to replace the
>Stone Glacier at 3B, Derek Bell to take Rickey's place in LF and Jim Acker
>so that Huckabay gets to take home a souvenir on a regular basis. :-) All
>for Rickey.

Hey, Acker in the OAC?  Sorta like the irresistable force against the
immovable object, but with a scruffy beard.

Speaking of souvenirs - from A's games alone, I have three Tony Armas
home run balls, half of a Fred Stanley bat (I didn't think he could
break a bat either), a Wayne Gross cap, a Jim Rice autographed Seattle
Mariners hat (actually, my ex-girlfriend has this, I think.  Or
perhaps an ex-roommate...), and my prize possession...

A Cliff Johnson "Heads Up" model thrown bat!

Quote:
>  Henderson is EXACTLY what any team needs: an ideal leadoff man with some
>bonus extras. If the A's are gonna give him up, it better be a 'rebuild in
>one move' type of trade.

I thought it sorta was, actually.  Alderson, however, is certainly too
stupid to do anything except trade Henderson for two guys that are
older.  For a guy who knows as much about OBP as Alderson, he sure is
foolish sometimes.

And, sad as it seems, the A's have no clue whatsoever that they even
need to rebuild.  They're still making stopgap moves, trying to figure
out why a whole bunch of 32-35 year old players suddenly produced a
little less, and all at one time.  Must be bad luck.

WAAAAAAAAAA!

--
*    Gary Huckabay    * "Yes, I have a drinking problem.  That second liter *
* "Not often mistaken *  is a real hassle for me sometimes." - R. J. Scott. *
* for Meryl Streep or * "There's no feeling quite like hitting a ball over  *
* James Earl Jones."  *  the fence for a home run." - D. Kuiper.            *

 
 
 

Lou and Rickey (Red Sox talk)

Post by Jonathan Ki » Fri, 10 Jan 1992 09:50:42


Quote:

>>  I suggest Lou Gorman stop eating Soylent Green, if that's the case. If
>>Sandy Alderson would even *consider* trading Rickey for only Greenwell, he
>>outta be shot. Matter of fact, I think we'll be hearing something about a
>>disgruntled youth with flaming locks and an Uzzi going on a shooting spree
>>at the Oakland front office if this happens.

>Not really.  The deal was supposedly Greenwell, Burks, Gardiner, and
>Cooper.  At least that's what the local talking heads claim.

And if Sir Huckabay is displeased with *this* deal, he's been using
recreational solvents, too.  What's this--two starting outfielders, a
starting pitcher and an actual third baseman (all under 30) for a
30-something year old superstar?  Even Rickey Henderson isn't worth
quite *this* much.  The A's gotta throw in some one; personally I've
had my eyes on that Van Pupil kid. :-)

Quote:
>>  Hell, we'll give the A's Jeff Kent (2B prospect stuck behind Alomar in
>>Toronto with excellent MLEs) to replace Mikey, Ed Sprague to replace the
>>Stone Glacier at 3B, Derek Bell to take Rickey's place in LF and Jim Acker
>>so that Huckabay gets to take home a souvenir on a regular basis. :-) All
>>for Rickey.

>Hey, Acker in the OAC?  Sorta like the irresistable force against the
>immovable object, but with a scruffy beard.

Uh, ahem.  Unless he re-signed with the Jays and I didn't notice,
Acker isn't Toronto's to foist on anybody.  And, as chief stat-head of
the BB DDD, I have to remind you that Gene "Tapemeasure" Nelson has
already solved your philosophical quandry.  With Nelson's pitching,
the immovable object achieved near relativistic speeds on it's way out
of the park.  

Quote:
>Speaking of souvenirs - from A's games alone, I have three Tony Armas
>home run balls, half of a Fred Stanley bat (I didn't think he could
>break a bat either), a Wayne Gross cap, a Jim Rice autographed Seattle
>Mariners hat (actually, my ex-girlfriend has this, I think.  Or
>perhaps an ex-roommate...), and my prize possession...

>A Cliff Johnson "Heads Up" model thrown bat!

Jeez.  You've got *me* beat.  All I ever got is four batting practice
homers (two thanks to George "Purple" Bell) and another souvenir ball
flipped to me by Sid Bream back in '87.

This year's mission: to catch a deep drive off the bat of Fred
McGriff, avatar of the Almighty.

jking

 
 
 

Lou and Rickey (Red Sox talk)

Post by djt2.. » Fri, 10 Jan 1992 14:22:49


Quote:

>>  I suggest Lou Gorman stop eating Soylent Green, if that's the case. If
>>Sandy Alderson would even *consider* trading Rickey for only Greenwell, he
>>outta be shot. Matter of fact, I think we'll be hearing something about a
>>disgruntled youth with flaming locks and an Uzzi going on a shooting spree
>>at the Oakland front office if this happens.

>Not really.  The deal was supposedly Greenwell, Burks, Gardiner, and
>Cooper.  At least that's what the local talking heads claim.

I'd trade Greenwell, Cooper, and Gardiner for Henderson (Greenwell has Phil
"Toilet Seat" Plantier behind him), Cooper (way to Boston is blocked by Boggs)
and Gardiner (this one is a tougher deal, because the kid is tough, but I think
the Sox could replace him with minor prospects Dave Owen, Scott Taylor, and/or
Paul Quantrill). But Burks? Not unless the A's cough up a good replacement CF
player (I'd willingly take back Dave Henderson, at least until the prospects in
the minors develop more experience (Wayne Housie? JJ Johnson? Bob Zupic?))
I would say Greenwell, a two time All Star with good hitting percentage that
should be helped by the A's large park, Cooper (an excellent prospect, most
certainly better than anyone the A's have there now), and Gardiner, a good
young pitcher, should be good enough  for Henderson, who is 4 years older than
Greenwell. Hell, if you want, we can throw in Matt Young for those souvenirs
the next paragrah suggests.

Quote:
>>  Hell, we'll give the A's Jeff Kent (2B prospect stuck behind Alomar in
>>Toronto with excellent MLEs) to replace Mikey, Ed Sprague to replace the
>>Stone Glacier at 3B, Derek Bell to take Rickey's place in LF and Jim Acker
>>so that Huckabay gets to take home a souvenir on a regular basis. :-) All
>>for Rickey.

>Hey, Acker in the OAC?  Sorta like the irresistable force against the
>immovable object, but with a scruffy beard.

[souvenir listing deleted]

Quote:
>>  Henderson is EXACTLY what any team needs: an ideal leadoff man with some
>>bonus extras. If the A's are gonna give him up, it better be a 'rebuild in
>>one move' type of trade.

>I thought it sorta was, actually.  Alderson, however, is certainly too
>stupid to do anything except trade Henderson for two guys that are
>older.  For a guy who knows as much about OBP as Alderson, he sure is
>foolish sometimes.

>And, sad as it seems, the A's have no clue whatsoever that they even
>need to rebuild.  They're still making stopgap moves, trying to figure
>out why a whole bunch of 32-35 year old players suddenly produced a
>little less, and all at one time.  Must be bad luck.

>WAAAAAAAAAA!

So trade Henderson while you can! (No way in hell should anyone want Mark
McGwire in trade, and Canseco isn't even in his prime yet! (That is, at ages
28-32)) Nobody else seem as marketable, and you certainly can get young players
in exchange with the Sox, who have a surplus of outfielders. Hmm, could you,
perchance, use Carlos Quintana to replace McGwire? I always considered Q's
defense underrated (can anyone give me stats for this?), and he hits a lot
better than McGwire (no, we don't need McGwire, not when we got the Hit Dog
Mo Vaughn at 1st)

Quote:

>--
>*    Gary Huckabay    * "Yes, I have a drinking problem.  That second liter *
>* "Not often mistaken *  is a real hassle for me sometimes." - R. J. Scott. *
>* for Meryl Streep or * "There's no feeling quite like hitting a ball over  *
>* James Earl Jones."  *  the fence for a home run." - D. Kuiper.            *

David Tai
 
 
 

Lou and Rickey (Red Sox talk)

Post by Dave Kirs » Sat, 11 Jan 1992 10:41:53


Quote:
King) writes:

>>Not really.  The deal was supposedly Greenwell, Burks, Gardiner, and
>>Cooper.  At least that's what the local talking heads claim.

>And if Sir Huckabay is displeased with *this* deal, he's been using
>recreational solvents, too.  What's this--two starting outfielders, a
>starting pitcher and an actual third baseman (all under 30) for a
>30-something year old superstar?  Even Rickey Henderson isn't worth
>quite *this* much.  The A's gotta throw in some one; personally I've
>had my eyes on that Van Pupil kid. :-)

  Actually, I heard the A's were willing to throw in Carney '15 inch lateral
leap' Lansford so he could return to Boston, along with Willie 'Mookie II: the
sequel' Wilson.

Quote:
>Uh, ahem.  Unless he re-signed with the Jays and I didn't notice,
>Acker isn't Toronto's to foist on anybody.  And, as chief stat-head of
>the BB DDD, I have to remind you that Gene "Tapemeasure" Nelson has
>already solved your philosophical quandry.  With Nelson's pitching,
>the immovable object achieved near relativistic speeds on it's way out
>of the park.  

  I knew this one wouldn't get by jking. Okay, then we'll throw in the pitcher
acquired specifically with this trade in mind, Eric 'Ping Pong Pow!' Plunk.
(Or 'Powertool' if you're contractually bound by the DDD rules.) The A's
would then have Plunk back in the fold to challenge 'Tapemeasure' Nelson for
the souvenir derby competition.

Quote:
>This year's mission: to catch a deep drive off the bat of Fred
>McGriff, avatar of the Almighty.

  Hallelujah!

--
Dave Hung Like a Jim Acker Slider Kirsch .. Valentine + Hockey Stick = ???  

"Nice fella, but about as sharp as a sack of wet mice."
  - Foghorn Leghorn on Cito Gaston

 
 
 

Lou and Rickey (Red Sox talk)

Post by Roger Wakefie » Sat, 11 Jan 1992 09:29:54


Quote:

> In the Sun. Dec. 29 (I believe) Boston Globe, Peter Gammons claimed
> that he had it from "officials" in Oakland that the A's would con-
> sider a Greenwell-Rickey Henderson trade.  To my amazement, except
> for some talk show discussion, the media had nothing further on this.

I took the article in question to be idle ramblings of what the author,
NICK CAFARDO (not Peter Gammons) would like to see.  I really didn't
take it that seriously.  Then, I saw this thread mention the 'full'
trade of Greenwell, Burks, Cooper, and Gardiner for Rickey.  I would
NEVER give up that much for Rickey.

As was pointed out, the Sox would need a CF in return for Burks.  IMHO,
the Sox should not trade Cooper yet if Hobson believes he can play a
major league SS.  Give him a chance to prove it.  I am really high on
Gardiner too.  I'm not too worried that a disaster deal like that would
ever really come to pass.

Quote:
> Then yesterday's Globe reported that Gorman had just returned from
> a two week vacation, and said he wouldn't pursue talks with the A's
> about Henderson.  Gorman wouldn't give reasons, but the Globe specu-
> lated that Rickey's no-trade-without-his-okay clause and his distaste
> for Boston precludes such a deal.

I'm sure if the money was right, Rickey would OK any deal.  However,
he's likely to want his contract renegotiated for 6M/yr at this point,
and yet he'd still be whining if Cal Ripken overtakes him a year from
now.  Also, I wouldn't exactly call Boston the 'ideal situation' for
Rickey; much like it was/is not the ideal locale for Matt Young.

Quote:
> If Gorman's reason is that he feels Rickey wouldn't get on with the
> Boston media, and would upset the clubhouse chemistry, then Gorman
> is as big a fool (and racist) as people like Eddie Andelman make him
> out to be.  Henderson is EXACTLY what the Red Sox need, and his
> acquisition would be a turning point in Red Sox history (IMO).

Rickey is well-known for upsetting clubhouse chemistry in his past.  I
can just imagine how Jack Clark would react to his rantings.  Acquiring
him is much like selling your soul to the devil-- while I would love how
he would change the face of this team, the cost might be too dear.  I
have never seen one indication that Lou Gorman is racist.  I'll reserve
judgement on whether or not he is a fool.

Basically, I would still do it only if the price really were cheap (i.e.
Greenwell plus more marginal players) and essentially if Oakland drove
the deal out of a strong desire to be rid of Rickey.

Anyone have any suggestions if there's still a decent defensive CF
available to replace Psycho Lyons?

==================
Roger Wakefield

 
 
 

Lou and Rickey (Red Sox talk)

Post by Mark E. Malle » Mon, 13 Jan 1992 03:01:36

Quote:


>King) writes:
>>And, as chief stat-head of
>>the BB DDD, I have to remind you that Gene "Tapemeasure" Nelson has
>>already solved your philosophical quandry.  With Nelson's pitching,
>>the immovable object achieved near relativistic speeds on it's way out
>>of the park.  

Nelson had an awful year after breaking his finger trying to save
face in the dugout.  But remember that this followed a superb 1990
and 2 decent years preceding (maybe even 3).  I'll be anxious to see if
he returns to form in 1992.  Any word on him?

-mm-

--
Mark E. Mallett  MV Communications, Inc./ PO Box 4963/ Manchester NH/ 03108
Bus. Phone: 603 429 2223    Home: 603 424 8129     BIX: mmallett

Looking for news and mail in southern NH / northern MA?  Try MV!

 
 
 

Lou and Rickey (Red Sox talk)

Post by CRAS » Fri, 10 Jan 1992 00:59:37

Quote:

> (lots of things regarding Rickey coming to Boston)
> If Gorman's reason is that he feels Rickey wouldn't get on with the
> Boston media, and would upset the clubhouse chemistry, then Gorman
> is as big a fool (and racist) as people like Eddie Andelman make him
> out to be.  Henderson is EXACTLY what the Red Sox need, and his
> acquisition would be a turning point in Red Sox history (IMO).

  Well, Henderson isn't EXACTLY what the Red Sox need; they have too many good
outfielders, and really could use another closer (Reardon's back leaves them
vulnberable), more setup help in the bullpen and a backup for Burks in CF.
But I don't think that the reason Gorman isn't going after Henderson is that
he's a racist (though he may well be, I don't know the man), but that a) Rickey
might not like playing in Boston and therefore just wouldn't play and/or b)
they really are trying to get ballplayers who give their all and aren't prima
donnas a la Wade Boggs.
  Don't get me wrong; I think that if the Sox could persuade the A's to take
Wade Boggs and Mike Greenwell (and maybe something else marginally useful) for
Henderson that they should do it, but I also can't see it happening and I don't
think Lou Gorman will be the one standing in the way of such a deal.

                                                -- Crash