Meeks' double-standards, pt 2

Meeks' double-standards, pt 2

Post by air_jud.. » Fri, 02 Apr 1999 04:00:00


Does Dave Meeks ever stop?

As recently as yesterday, he was jocking Jerry Stackhouse, while this month,
he has dogged on Antoine Walker. Shall we analyze them, using a variety of
"Dave Meeks established" 'data points'?

1) Statistics

            PPG     FG%     3Pt%    APG    SPG    A/TO    RPG   BPG
Walker      19.3    41.2    35.0    3.1    1.5    1.10    8.7   0.5
Stackhouse  16.2    37.8    29.3    3.1    0.8    1.05    2.6   0.5

2)  Tendex (a completley worthless stat, but the foundation for Dave's
            religious beliefs)

    Walker = 16.7
    Stackhouse = 10.8

3) Celtic Home-bias

Walker = yes
Stackhouse = no

4) The "Walker vs. Webber analysis"  (strangely, Dave never answered Judden's
last reply from a few weeks ago.  Sounds like he had no response for Judden's
exposing his dupicity...probably like he'll ignore this post, or claim that
his server 'didn't see it'...unless Judden threatens to re-post it.).

____________________________________________________________________
Re: the ten best centers ever

Forum:      rec.sport.basketball.pro
Posted on:  1998/07/22

Because, your strawman argument of 'Dave's all stats' has never been true.
Stats are the one factual view of the world we have.  It's a very good and
strong data point for analysis.  But, that's all it is.  I prefer Walker
at this point because:

        o) He is more versatile.  He regularly has played three positions for
                the Celtics.
        o) He is more of a leader.
        o) He is (thus far) much less of a headcase/problem child.  Chrissy
                has whined and moaned everywhere he's gone
        o) He is more durable.  Chrissy has been injury prone.
        o) He is younger with more upside.  I think we've seen all of
                what Webber has to offer.  While quite good, Walker has
                more potential.
____________________________________________________________________

    OK, from Dave's criteria:

  Versatility:  Walker.  Walker has played all 5 positions, and has that
capability.  Stackhouse can't even start over Lindsay Hunter!  Leader:
Walker.  Hard to call a bench player who complains about the  team's star as
a "leader."  Besides, even Dave can't deny that  Hill and Dumars are the
leaders on the Pistons...even if Jerry  Stackhouse can (deny it).  Dave
himself called Walker a  "leader" last year, so who is Judden to argue with
Dave?  Headcase/problem child.  Well, Stackhouse has 'whined and moaned
everywhere  he's gone'.  He complained about Iverson and he drew the wrath of
his  coach and the media recently for his complaints about Grant Hill.
Stackhouse got himself in trouble in the past for claiming he would  have no
difficulties with Michael Jordan and he also got suspended for  fighting with
Jeff Hornacek.  Durability.  Walker.  Walker has never missed a game.
Stackhouse has  missed 13 in his 3-1/2 year career.  Younger.  Walker -- by
over a year and a half.  More upside.  Walker.  Walker's has slipped a little
since last year, but  Stackhouse has slid since his rookie season, to the
point where he  can't even start anymore.

Well, there you have it.  In every single Data Point that I have seen Dave
present, Antoine Walker wins, yet Dave dogs on Walker and jocks Stackhouse.

Dave's duplicity has been exposed again.

What do you have to say, Dave?  What new criteria will you come up with now?
Be careful, because you know Judden will use it in the future on you.

*flush*

Dave Meeks.  Founder, lone member.  Jerry Stackhouse Fan club.

Judden
Even Bathroom Stall wouldn't jock Stackhouse!

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Meeks' double-standards, pt 2

Post by David T. Meek » Fri, 02 Apr 1999 04:00:00

Quote:

> Does Dave Meeks ever stop?

> As recently as yesterday, he was jocking Jerry Stackhouse

Really?  Where was I jocking him again?  I did mention that the
team he is playing for is doing better than the 76ers...  since you've
been shouting about what a cancer he was, I thought I'd point that
out...

You will note, also, that I have not once claimed Stackhouse was
better than Walker...

Quote:
> 4) The "Walker vs. Webber analysis"  (strangely, Dave never answered Judden's
> last reply from a few weeks ago.  Sounds like he had no response for Judden's
> exposing his dupicity...probably like he'll ignore this post, or claim that
> his server 'didn't see it'...unless Judden threatens to re-post it.).

Didn't think it warranted a response...  You want a quick response... here you
go...

    You state:
        "You were claiming that Walker could play all positions"

    False:  In the statement you quoted, I clearly state:
        "He is more versatile.  He regularly has played three positions
           for the Celtics"

    You state:
        "You overlooked these incidents as 'less' than Webber's career of
        whining and moaning"  Since Webber wasn't whining and moaning
        last year, you must put a lot of weight in Webber's history of whining
        and moaning."

    My response:
        As clearly stated many times before, Webber had an established persona,
        one he had done little to change.  He's done much to improve upon that
        this year.  Walker's selfishness wasn't as big an issue his first two
years, as
        he was the acknowledged star, especially his first year.  Last year, some
of
        us started to realize that Walker was having trouble co-existing with a
guy
        like Mercer.  When Anderson was first brought in, Walker seemed to do
        better, because he wasn't controlling the ball as much.  But this year,
he
        seems to have taken his selfishness even further, especially given he now

        has Pierce and Mercer both being offensive weapons.

    You state:
        "LIE!  In last summer's post, you waid of Walker: 'He is more of a
leader'"

    Response:
        You made this in response to me claiming "This year, he was expected to
be
        the true leader, and he hasn't been that"
        Walker was more of a leader than Webber, but that doesn't mean he's the
        example that needs to be followed.  When the Celtics were lacking in
        offensive weapons, the Cs needed a guy like Walker to play like he did.
        Now, they have more weapons... they need a guy to play in a TEAM
        oriented scheme.  Walker hasn't shown a consistent desire to do so...

    You state:
        "LIE!  Webber said he wants out of Sacramento!"

    Cite your sources.  I have not heard any such comments from Webber this
    year.  Quite to the contrary, in fact.  I've heard him make many statements
    about how happy he is with his new team.

    You state:
        "Another lie!  You specifically pointed out his shot selection and his
        FG%.  Judden showed that Walker is shooting less and hitting more
        this year vs. last year"

Year    FG%    FGA/game    FT%    FTA/game
97-98    42.6    20.7    64.5%    5.8
98-99    41.2    18.3    51.3%    5.2

Now, perhaps you can help me with that KSU math...

I have a hard time figuring out how he is 'hitting more'...

Quote:
> Well, there you have it.  In every single Data Point that I have seen Dave
> present, Antoine Walker wins, yet Dave dogs on Walker and jocks Stackhouse.

False...  Dave has not once claimed Stackhouse was > than Walker....

Cite your evidence to the contrary...

Quote:
> What do you have to say, Dave?  What new criteria will you come up with now?

None needed.  You have yet to show where I've ever claimed Stackhouse > Walker...

 
 
 

Meeks' double-standards, pt 2

Post by air_jud.. » Fri, 02 Apr 1999 04:00:00



Quote:


> > Does Dave Meeks ever stop?

> > As recently as yesterday, he was jocking Jerry Stackhouse

> Really?  Where was I jocking him again?  I did mention that the
> team he is playing for is doing better than the 76ers...  since you've
> been shouting about what a cancer he was, I thought I'd point that
> out...

      Funny -- last year, the Wizzards had a better record than the Celtics,
      but you were saying that Walker was better than Webber, and one of your
      reasons was because, as you said...

      "He [Walker] is (thus far) much less of a headcase/problem child.
       Chrissy has whined and moaned everywhere he's gone"

      So, records are irrelevant to a player being a cancer...according to
      you -- or are you presenting ANOTHER double standard?

      D'OH!

  and do you REALLY want Judden to go dig up your quotes where you said  the
Pistons were happy with Stackhouse (even when his shooting had fallen  to
33%)?  Because you know Judden WILL ... yet here you are saying that  Boston
isn't happy with Walker.

      Oh Dave, your forked tongue pokes holes in you again.

      You lie so much, you're getting bed sores!

      *flush*

Quote:
> You will note, also, that I have not once claimed Stackhouse was
> better than Walker...

       Didn't say you did, and if you try to, you will lie.  You claim that
       the Pistons are happy with Stackhouse and you still think it's a good
       pickup, yet you think Walker is bad for the Celtics, even though,
       according to all the criteia OF YOURS that Judden presented, Walker is
       better than Stackhouse, so Detroit CAN'T have made a good signing with
       Stackhouse...correct?

Quote:
> > 4) The "Walker vs. Webber analysis"  (strangely, Dave never answered
Judden's
> > last reply from a few weeks ago.  Sounds like he had no response for
Judden's
> > exposing his dupicity...probably like he'll ignore this post, or claim that
> > his server 'didn't see it'...unless Judden threatens to re-post it.).

> Didn't think it warranted a response...  You want a quick response... here you
> go...

>     You state:
>         "You were claiming that Walker could play all positions"

>     False:  In the statement you quoted, I clearly state:
>         "He is more versatile.  He regularly has played three positions
>            for the Celtics"

  You deny he played all 5 positions during his career?  (Be careful, DAve...
 he did during his rookie year!)

     BTW, you dodged the topic...he is STILL more versatile than Webber, so
     your standard STILL has Walker > Webber.

Quote:
>     You state:
>         "You overlooked these incidents as 'less' than Webber's career of
>         whining and moaning"  Since Webber wasn't whining and moaning
>         last year, you must put a lot of weight in Webber's history of whining
>         and moaning."

>     My response:
>         As clearly stated many times before, Webber had an established
persona,
>         one he had done little to change.  He's done much to improve upon that
>         this year.

  21 games changes your whole attitude toward the guy?  Me thinks YOU LIE!!!
Judden posted that 21 games into the season.

  Walker's selfishness wasn't as big an issue his first two

Quote:
> years, as
>         he was the acknowledged star, especially his first year.  Last year,
some
> of
>         us started to realize that Walker was having trouble co-existing with
a
> guy
>         like Mercer.  When Anderson was first brought in, Walker seemed to do
>         better, because he wasn't controlling the ball as much.  But this
year,
> he
>         seems to have taken his selfishness even further, especially given he
now

>         has Pierce and Mercer both being offensive weapons.

      Yet his apg are the same as Stackhouse's even though Stackhouse is
      a guard and plays with Hill and Dumars...and you think Stackhouse was
      a good pickup?  Your duplicity shows again.

      BTW, if you realized this LAST YEAR, then why did you STILL put Walker
      ahead of Webber in that category after LAST YEAR, when Webber hadn't
      cried at all during the season.  How can 21 games change your mind, but
      82 cannot?

      Mayday!  Mayday!  DAve's going down in the flames of his own lies!

- Show quoted text -

Quote:
>     You state:
>         "LIE!  In last summer's post, you waid of Walker: 'He is more of a
> leader'"

>     Response:
>         You made this in response to me claiming "This year, he was expected
to
> be
>         the true leader, and he hasn't been that"
>         Walker was more of a leader than Webber, but that doesn't mean he's
the
>         example that needs to be followed.  When the Celtics were lacking in
>         offensive weapons, the Cs needed a guy like Walker to play like he
did.
>         Now, they have more weapons... they need a guy to play in a TEAM
>         oriented scheme.  Walker hasn't shown a consistent desire to do so...

    You said Walker was showing these selfish anti-team tendencies last year,
    and had problems co-existing with Mercer, yet you STILL put him ahead of
    Webber, so you are still lying.  Don't try to say his doing the same thing
    now makes him worse than Webber.

Quote:
>     You state:
>         "LIE!  Webber said he wants out of Sacramento!"

>     Cite your sources.  I have not heard any such comments from Webber this
>     year.

      told you...USA Today.  check the February issues.

 Quite to the contrary, in fact.  I've heard him make many
statements

Quote:
>     about how happy he is with his new team.

      Cite your sources.

Quote:
>     You state:
>         "Another lie!  You specifically pointed out his shot selection and his
>         FG%.  Judden showed that Walker is shooting less and hitting more
>         this year vs. last year"

> Year    FG%    FGA/game    FT%    FTA/game
> 97-98    42.6    20.7    64.5%    5.8
> 98-99    41.2    18.3    51.3%    5.2

> Now, perhaps you can help me with that KSU math...

> I have a hard time figuring out how he is 'hitting more'...

        That is his stats NOW.  When Judden posted this, his fg% and ft% were
        higher, as well as his PPG.  You lie!

Quote:
> > Well, there you have it.  In every single Data Point that I have seen Dave
> > present, Antoine Walker wins, yet Dave dogs on Walker and jocks Stackhouse.

> False...  Dave has not once claimed Stackhouse was > than Walker....

       YOU LIE!!!  Now, you are saying false because you claim that Judden
       Judden claims that you said that Stackhouse > Walker.  What Judden
       did say was that Walker > Stackhouse, according to YOUR data points,
       but yet you dog on Walker and claim that Stackhouse was a great pickup.

  Don't dodge the issue, Dave.  Either Stackhouse is bad for Detroit, or
Walker is a very good player for the Celtics.  Your only other course is  to
prove that Stackhouse > Walker, using your previously established  'data
points'.  You are so desperate to save face in the Stackhouse  debate, that
you aren't willing to admit you were wrong.  YOu CLAIM that  you're a big
enough man to admit that you were wrong, but yet you still  can't do it,
though Judden doesn't doubt that you are quite the big  man -- you should lay
off fast food.

       Judden has exposed your lies and your duplicities over and over.  You
       dogged on Theo Ratliff when his FG% fell to 38%, but you still claim
       Stackhouse, who shoots ~38% was a great pickup.  Your Walker/Webber
       criteria has proven your duplicity.  You criteria disproves that Walker
       is bad for the Celts while Stackhouse is good for Detroit.  You also
       are not humble enough to admit that you were wrong and that you use
       double-standards to try and justify your points....THAT was why you
       ignored Judden's reply on the first "double-standard" thread. You
       tried to use a few selective "cite where I said exactly that" type of
       arguments, while ignoring the argument.  Shall Judden Repost the reply,
       so you can respond to it, point by point?  Didn't think you'd want to
       go there!

       David, is there a caboose on your train of thought?

       To bad the parole board at Ho Jail doesn't use double-standards, like
       yeaux deaux...

       *slam*

Judden
Dave's worst usenet nightmare!

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