Frzier Really Overrated?

Frzier Really Overrated?

Post by Larry Robert » Mon, 03 Feb 2003 14:49:27


Tonight I saw a replay of the Joe Frazier-Ron Stander fight. Man. Stander
landed some big shots squarely on Joe, even had him backing up. If Stander
had been a real banger, Joe would've been out of there. Liston, Marciano,
Dempsey etc would have nailed Frazier. Joe looked best against guys with
little pop like Mathis and Ellis.

Cap
--
pax vobiscum

 
 
 

Frzier Really Overrated?

Post by magnu » Mon, 03 Feb 2003 19:12:45

Quote:

> Tonight I saw a replay of the Joe Frazier-Ron Stander fight. Man. Stander
> landed some big shots squarely on Joe, even had him backing up. If Stander
> had been a real banger, Joe would've been out of there. Liston, Marciano,
> Dempsey etc would have nailed Frazier. Joe looked best against guys with
> little pop like Mathis and Ellis.

> Cap
> --
> pax vobiscum

And Muhammad Ali. And Stander did have some pop.

 
 
 

Frzier Really Overrated?

Post by SuperCal » Mon, 03 Feb 2003 23:23:03

correct


Quote:
> Tonight I saw a replay of the Joe Frazier-Ron Stander fight. Man. Stander
> landed some big shots squarely on Joe, even had him backing up. If Stander
> had been a real banger, Joe would've been out of there. Liston, Marciano,
> Dempsey etc would have nailed Frazier. Joe looked best against guys with
> little pop like Mathis and Ellis.

> Cap
> --
> pax vobiscum


 
 
 

Frzier Really Overrated?

Post by Johnbo » Mon, 03 Feb 2003 22:33:53

No one EVER said that Joe Frazier was a hard man to hit. Hit squarely,
sometimes. His bob n' weave was pretty good at keeping him from catching
more than a part of a punch.

Still, this is something we all know, and most of us esteem Frazier pretty
highly. He is not the greatest of heavyweights, because we all know those
limitations and therefore cannot really believe that he would triumph over
all opposition in all eras (I think Ali, Holmes, Johnson and Louis are
candidates in that department), nor did he have a singular record
(Marciano). However, he definetely belongs in the Top 10 Greatest Heavies of
All Time... at least with the way that list is shaping up right now. I think
I could find 6 or 7 heavyweights more deserving than Joe Frazier, but not
10.

Johnboy


Quote:
> Tonight I saw a replay of the Joe Frazier-Ron Stander fight. Man. Stander
> landed some big shots squarely on Joe, even had him backing up. If Stander
> had been a real banger, Joe would've been out of there. Liston, Marciano,
> Dempsey etc would have nailed Frazier. Joe looked best against guys with
> little pop like Mathis and Ellis.

> Cap
> --
> pax vobiscum

 
 
 

Frzier Really Overrated?

Post by Potter Pirat » Fri, 07 Feb 2003 06:52:34

Frazier pretty well cleaned out the heavyweight division in the late 60s and
early 70's. he beat Ali, Bonavena twice, Foster, Quarry, Ellis, Mathis, and
Ramos. By mid 1971, he was universally regarded as the best heavyweight in
the world. So I would think you have to mention Frazier's name when you
think of the top 15 or 20 all time great heavyweights.

I would put Frazier at either 9 or 11. Right around with Foreman and
Langford and Dempsey and Tunney.

Quote:
> correct



> > Tonight I saw a replay of the Joe Frazier-Ron Stander fight. Man.
Stander
> > landed some big shots squarely on Joe, even had him backing up. If
Stander
> > had been a real banger, Joe would've been out of there. Liston,
Marciano,
> > Dempsey etc would have nailed Frazier. Joe looked best against guys with
> > little pop like Mathis and Ellis.

> > Cap
> > --
> > pax vobiscum

 
 
 

Frzier Really Overrated?

Post by The Arrang » Sun, 09 Feb 2003 04:07:57

Quote:

> No one EVER said that Joe Frazier was a hard man to hit. Hit squarely,
> sometimes. His bob n' weave was pretty good at keeping him from catching
> more than a part of a punch.

> Still, this is something we all know, and most of us esteem Frazier pretty
> highly. He is not the greatest of heavyweights, because we all know those
> limitations and therefore cannot really believe that he would triumph over
> all opposition in all eras (I think Ali, Holmes, Johnson and Louis are
> candidates in that department), nor did he have a singular record
> (Marciano). However, he definetely belongs in the Top 10 Greatest Heavies of
> All Time... at least with the way that list is shaping up right now. I think
> I could find 6 or 7 heavyweights more deserving than Joe Frazier, but not
> 10.

> Johnboy



> > Tonight I saw a replay of the Joe Frazier-Ron Stander fight. Man. Stander
> > landed some big shots squarely on Joe, even had him backing up. If Stander
> > had been a real banger, Joe would've been out of there. Liston, Marciano,
> > Dempsey etc would have nailed Frazier. Joe looked best against guys with
> > little pop like Mathis and Ellis.

> > Cap
> > --
> > pax vobiscum

Manuel Ramos looked good against Frazier for a little while, then
went down in Round 2. Bonavena gave him trouble. But as with the
Ali/Cooper argument, when you start talking about wins as negatives
for a fighter, you know you're dealing with a top-notch fighter.
Who did Joe ever lose to? The Greatest and George Foreman. That's it.
He took on all comers up to then.
Joe is in my top ten heavies of all time, with Ali, Louis, Johnson,
Demspey, Marciano, Holmes, Foreman, Tunney, Holyfield.
 
 
 

Frzier Really Overrated?

Post by Dennis Beeb » Sun, 09 Feb 2003 04:23:44

Quote:

> Manuel Ramos looked good against Frazier for a little while, then
> went down in Round 2. Bonavena gave him trouble. But as with the
> Ali/Cooper argument, when you start talking about wins as negatives
> for a fighter, you know you're dealing with a top-notch fighter.
> Who did Joe ever lose to? The Greatest and George Foreman. That's it.
> He took on all comers up to then.
> Joe is in my top ten heavies of all time, with Ali, Louis, Johnson,
> Demspey, Marciano, Holmes, Foreman, Tunney, Holyfield.

Joe was tough. Bonavena put him down twice in their first fight and he still hung in for
the win. Foreman is the only guy that ever beat him one sided which, to me, would attest
more to how devastating Big George was than how easy to hit Joe was.