US Open 9-Ball Championship: Efren Reyes v Schmidt

US Open 9-Ball Championship: Efren Reyes v Schmidt

Post by John Blac » Fri, 02 Apr 2010 12:20:48


Who are these clowns?  Neither could pocket a ball for over 5 minutes!

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXKP2Pqtjxs

John Black

 
 
 

US Open 9-Ball Championship: Efren Reyes v Schmidt

Post by Jack Stei » Tue, 06 Apr 2010 01:45:10

Quote:

> Who are these clowns?  Neither could pocket a ball for over 5 minutes!

> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXKP2Pqtjxs

Thanks John, great match.  I never cease to enjoy watching the greatest
players on earth miss the most basic shots...  I particularly enjoyed
John missing the straight in 7 ball I think in rack 16.  I've done that
so many times it's routine for me.  Reyes missed a few, great stuff...
How many times have you played almost perfect position for a ball on the
side rail and watched helplessly as whitey slowly, painfully rolls right
up and in the black hole...  When Reyes does it, it adds legitimacy to
your own game:-)

I know how to miss like the pros, now all I need is to make 'em like the
pros:-)

--
Jack
Got Change: big government =====> BIG GOVERNMENT!
http://jbstein.com

 
 
 

US Open 9-Ball Championship: Efren Reyes v Schmidt

Post by Ron Shepar » Tue, 06 Apr 2010 02:51:47



Quote:

> > Who are these clowns?  Neither could pocket a ball for over 5 minutes!

> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXKP2Pqtjxs
[...]

> I know how to miss like the pros, now all I need is to make 'em like the
> pros:-)

I think John was talking about the extended safety battle in the
first rack.

$.02 -Ron Shepard

 
 
 

US Open 9-Ball Championship: Efren Reyes v Schmidt

Post by bk42.. » Tue, 06 Apr 2010 06:52:41


Quote:
> Who are these clowns? ?Neither could pocket a ball for over 5 minutes!

> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXKP2Pqtjxs

> John Black

Since I've been paying attention to attitudes lately here is what I
saw.
Reyes got first chance at the first game after "slopping" in the 1-
ball on a kick shot.   They had both played several excellent kick-
safeties, and Efren's last shot at the 1-ball was a hit-it-and-hope
type of kick.  Granted, he demonstrated a lot of skill in running the
rack from that point.

But the question is, how would you feel if you played the great 2-rail
kick safety that John Schmidt did, and then your opponent "slop-
kicked" in the 1-ball and ran out?  How often does this type of thing
happen in your local league or tournament and what is your reaction?
What reactions have you observed from local "bangers" in your area?
What is the appropriate reaction?

Just food for thought.
Yum, yum, yum.

Bob Keller

 
 
 

US Open 9-Ball Championship: Efren Reyes v Schmidt

Post by John Blac » Tue, 06 Apr 2010 09:41:56


says...

Quote:

> > Who are these clowns?  Neither could pocket a ball for over 5 minutes!

> > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXKP2Pqtjxs

> Thanks John, great match.

I agree.  I really enjoyed it.

Quote:
> I never cease to enjoy watching the greatest
> players on earth miss the most basic shots...  I particularly enjoyed
> John missing the straight in 7 ball I think in rack 16.  I've done that
> so many times it's routine for me.  Reyes missed a few, great stuff...
> How many times have you played almost perfect position for a ball on the
> side rail and watched helplessly as whitey slowly, painfully rolls right
> up and in the black hole...  When Reyes does it, it adds legitimacy to
> your own game:-)

Yeah, its interesting to see the greats miss once in a while but I think you
enjoy it too much.  :-)  I saw Reyes miss a straight in 9 for the match one
time that a drunken girl scout would be expected to make.  After seeing that
I realized that ANYBODY could miss ANY SHOT.

Quote:
> I know how to miss like the pros, now all I need is to make 'em like the
> pros:-)

Great quote.

John Black

 
 
 

US Open 9-Ball Championship: Efren Reyes v Schmidt

Post by John Blac » Tue, 06 Apr 2010 09:43:57



Quote:



> > > Who are these clowns?  Neither could pocket a ball for over 5 minutes!

> > > http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXKP2Pqtjxs
> [...]

> > I know how to miss like the pros, now all I need is to make 'em like the
> > pros:-)

> I think John was talking about the extended safety battle in the
> first rack.

I was but I'd bet Jack knew that.

While we're on the topic, I know I should appreciate saftey battles more but
I just don't enjoy watching them or participating in them.  I'd much rather
watch and play runout pool.

John Black

 
 
 

US Open 9-Ball Championship: Efren Reyes v Schmidt

Post by Ron Shepar » Tue, 06 Apr 2010 13:52:36

In article

Quote:

> But the question is, how would you feel if you played the great 2-rail
> kick safety that John Schmidt did, and then your opponent "slop-
> kicked" in the 1-ball and ran out?

The way you have to feel about it is that your opponent was the one
who got the lucky break that time.  When you have these kinds of
safety battles, especially between two good players like this, the
outcome almost always depends on one of the players getting a lucky
roll.  In this case it was pocketing the ball and ending up with an
easy jump shot on the 2-ball (as if any jump shot is really easy,
right?).  Maybe instead of getting lucky and making the kick shot,
the cue ball could have frozen to a cluster, or some other
unexpected thing like that happens, to give Reyes some other kind of
advantage.  Or Reyes could have kicked in the 1-ball, but had no
shot at all on the 2-ball.  Luck works both ways, and I think that
is what you have to say to yourself in these situations, whether you
are blessed or cursed on that particular shot.

The other important thing is that the next time you get back to the
table, you can't let your opponent's good roll affect how you play.  
You have to simply acknowledge that your opponent got lucky, and
then get your game firing on all cylinders when you get back to the
table.

$.02 -Ron Shepard

 
 
 

US Open 9-Ball Championship: Efren Reyes v Schmidt

Post by bk42.. » Tue, 06 Apr 2010 18:07:46



Quote:
> In article


> > But the question is, how would you feel if you played the great 2-rail
> > kick safety that John Schmidt did, and then your opponent "slop-
> > kicked" in the 1-ball and ran out?

> The way you have to feel about it is that your opponent was the one
> who got the lucky break that time. ?When you have these kinds of
> safety battles, especially between two good players like this, the
> outcome almost always depends on one of the players getting a lucky
> roll. ?In this case it was pocketing the ball and ending up with an
> easy jump shot on the 2-ball (as if any jump shot is really easy,
> right?). ?Maybe instead of getting lucky and making the kick shot,
> the cue ball could have frozen to a cluster, or some other
> unexpected thing like that happens, to give Reyes some other kind of
> advantage. ?Or Reyes could have kicked in the 1-ball, but had no
> shot at all on the 2-ball. ?Luck works both ways, and I think that
> is what you have to say to yourself in these situations, whether you
> are blessed or cursed on that particular shot.

> The other important thing is that the next time you get back to the
> table, you can't let your opponent's good roll affect how you play. ?
> You have to simply acknowledge that your opponent got lucky, and
> then get your game firing on all cylinders when you get back to the
> table.

> $.02 -Ron Shepard

Yes, I agree with everything you said.  But IMO the next level of
understanding is:

I would say that your opponent didn't really get "lucky".  Without
defining "lucky", the opponent did what he had to do given the rules
of the game.  In the Reyes/Schmidt example above, Reyes knew there
wasn't some kind of finesse-able kick safety available and so his best
chance was to achieve a solid hit with some speed and hope for
something favorable like pocketing a ball or a tough leave or safety.

As the safe-er in that situation, it's natural to hope for ball-in-
hand or at least a good shot, especially given how well my earlier two-
rail kick worked out.  But I think it's important to consciously
recognize that there is no causal connection whatsoever between my
safety and the opponent's kick.  That's kind of obvious, but when you
really take it to heart it makes it possible to totally let go of the
table (all hope or conversely, all despair should my safety have
failed).  Then I don't NEED to 'make sure I don't let my opponent's
good roll affect my play'.

When I relinquish the table to my opponent, for whatever reason, the
attitude that I strive for is a conscious and objective recognition of
the reason - whether I scratched, played safe well, played safe
poorly, missed.....whatever.  And I also strive to have no hope along
with no fear of the result of my opponents efforts.  I am merely an
active observer.  All of my focus is on what I did, and then if I
return to the table my focus is on what I will do.  I do not want to
REACT to the result of my opponent's efforts, regardless of whether
they can be judged as favorable or unfavorable to me.

And so when I see a player REACT-ing to HIS opponent (whether that is
me or someone else, and whether the result of his opponent's efforts
was favorable or unfavorable to him), I already know that I have an
advantage because that type of player is more susceptible to being
knocked out of his process.  And so when I catch myself reacting to my
opponent's efforts (whether they are favorable or unfavorable to me),
I always try to stop and recenter my attitude on MY process.

Bob Keller <-- think he might be ready for the NEXT level of
understanding......
but he might not be!

 
 
 

US Open 9-Ball Championship: Efren Reyes v Schmidt

Post by Jack Stei » Wed, 07 Apr 2010 00:41:21

   When Reyes does it, it adds legitimacy to your own game:-)

Quote:
> Yeah, its interesting to see the greats miss once in a while but I think you
> enjoy it too much.  :-)  

Perhaps, but it took me a long time to get over beating myself up when I
missed shots I thought I should have made.  First, I learned that many
shots I thought were easy, were not so easy, so stop beating yourself up
over shots that you are not good enough to make all the time anyway.
Embarrassingly enough, that one I learned from RSB, too dumb to figure
that one out myself.

Then, I learned that no matter how good you are, you will miss some easy
shots, so no reason to be talking down to yourself. This one needs
constant reinforcement, thus the need to see the pros miss some easy ones.

Reyes I particularly like missing because most of the time, it brings a
smile to his face.... I like that much better than any other reaction to
a missed easy shot...

A better way to say it up there would be if Reyes can miss the easy
ones, why shouldn't I?

I saw Reyes miss a straight in 9 for the match one

Quote:
> time that a drunken girl scout would be expected to make.  After seeing that
> I realized that ANYBODY could miss ANY SHOT.

Yes, I saw Thorsten Hohmann miss a couple 9 balls like that on TV in a
$50,000 match.  Two in one match where normally, ESPN never shows anyone
  missing a 9 ball, ever.

--
Jack
Got Change: Democratic Republic ======> Banana Republic!
http://jbstein.com

 
 
 

US Open 9-Ball Championship: Efren Reyes v Schmidt

Post by Jack Stei » Wed, 07 Apr 2010 00:51:57

Quote:






>>>> Who are these clowns?  Neither could pocket a ball for over 5 minutes!

>>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXKP2Pqtjxs
>> [...]
>>> I know how to miss like the pros, now all I need is to make 'em like the
>>> pros:-)
>> I think John was talking about the extended safety battle in the
>> first rack.

> I was but I'd bet Jack knew that.

Yeah, he knew that before he even looked at the video...

Quote:
> While we're on the topic, I know I should appreciate saftey battles more but
> I just don't enjoy watching them or participating in them.  I'd much rather
> watch and play runout pool.

I do enjoy safety battles.  I like watching them more than playing them,
but still, it's a part of the game I enjoy, and enjoy watching the
really good players pull off. Some of the safety's the pro's make
demonstrate just how much control they have over whitey.  Good stuff.

--
Jack
"I have not failed.  I've just found ten thousand ways that won't work."
http://jbstein.com

 
 
 

US Open 9-Ball Championship: Efren Reyes v Schmidt

Post by Ed McCun » Thu, 08 Apr 2010 02:11:38

Quote:

> When I relinquish the table to my opponent, for whatever reason, the
> attitude that I strive for is a conscious and objective recognition of
> the reason - whether I scratched, played safe well, played safe
> poorly, missed.....whatever.  And I also strive to have no hope along
> with no fear of the result of my opponents efforts.  I am merely an
> active observer.  All of my focus is on what I did, and then if I
> return to the table my focus is on what I will do.  I do not want to
> REACT to the result of my opponent's efforts, regardless of whether
> they can be judged as favorable or unfavorable to me.

> And so when I see a player REACT-ing to HIS opponent (whether that is
> me or someone else, and whether the result of his opponent's efforts
> was favorable or unfavorable to him), I already know that I have an
> advantage because that type of player is more susceptible to being
> knocked out of his process.  And so when I catch myself reacting to my
> opponent's efforts (whether they are favorable or unfavorable to me),
> I always try to stop and recenter my attitude on MY process.

I like what you're saying here Bob. I strive to only think about what I
might do should I get back to the table as opposed to worrying about
what might cause my opponent to fail. But what about the Strickland
-like guys who are always rolling their eyes, both on your "lucky shots"
and their "unlucky ones." Personal I love to beat these guys and the
"luckier" the better but I really have to watch that their bad attitude
doesn't affect me by making me want to win too badly to show them up.

Ed-plays lots of these guys and has a teammate like this too. I love the
ones who fail on their position and then point to the spot the cue ball
should have gone to like it was somehow the tables fault.

 
 
 

US Open 9-Ball Championship: Efren Reyes v Schmidt

Post by Ed McCun » Thu, 08 Apr 2010 02:16:21

Quote:

> Perhaps, but it took me a long time to get over beating myself up when I
> missed shots I thought I should have made.  First, I learned that many
> shots I thought were easy, were not so easy, so stop beating yourself up
> over shots that you are not good enough to make all the time anyway.
> Embarrassingly enough, that one I learned from RSB, too dumb to figure
> that one out myself.

That was a tough one for me too Jack. I always like to hit the table
immediately after a match so I can try the "easy" shots I missed. Most
of the time I find, like you, that they are far from 100%ers.

Quote:

> Then, I learned that no matter how good you are, you will miss some easy
> shots, so no reason to be talking down to yourself. This one needs
> constant reinforcement, thus the need to see the pros miss some easy ones.

Yup. Still have trouble with that one. Can be hard to shrug off a stupid
loss sometimes. Some of my favorite league nights are nights when I suck
for the first 2 or 3 games and then suck it up to play well in the last
couple.

Quote:

> Reyes I particularly like missing because most of the time, it brings a
> smile to his face.... I like that much better than any other reaction to
> a missed easy shot...

Yes. I like to use Reyes as a role model for this. He always has that
little self depreciating smile when he screws up. I try to emulate that
and it does help. You captured this topic in a nutshell for me.

Ed

 
 
 

US Open 9-Ball Championship: Efren Reyes v Schmidt

Post by lfiguero » Wed, 07 Apr 2010 21:01:09

I dan't know so much about 9ball, but this kind of thing happens all the
time at 1pocket:  you end up putting your opponent in such a death trap
that they are forced to gnaw off their own paw to get out of it and come
with some off the wall shot.

I hate it when that happens.

Lou Figueroa

Quote:


>> Who are these clowns?  Neither could pocket a ball for over 5 minutes!

>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXKP2Pqtjxs

>> John Black

> Since I've been paying attention to attitudes lately here is what I
> saw.
> Reyes got first chance at the first game after "slopping" in the 1-
> ball on a kick shot.   They had both played several excellent kick-
> safeties, and Efren's last shot at the 1-ball was a hit-it-and-hope
> type of kick.  Granted, he demonstrated a lot of skill in running the
> rack from that point.

> But the question is, how would you feel if you played the great 2-rail
> kick safety that John Schmidt did, and then your opponent "slop-
> kicked" in the 1-ball and ran out?  How often does this type of thing
> happen in your local league or tournament and what is your reaction?
> What reactions have you observed from local "bangers" in your area?
> What is the appropriate reaction?

> Just food for thought.
> Yum, yum, yum.

> Bob Keller

 
 
 

US Open 9-Ball Championship: Efren Reyes v Schmidt

Post by lfiguero » Wed, 07 Apr 2010 21:03:12

You can't really enjoy it too much.

A couple of years ago I kept score while Gabe Owens shot Bob's 14.1
Challenge:  miss on the break shot; scratch on the break shot; 2; 8; jaw
the break ball; and so on and so forth.

Made my day :-)

Lou Figueroa

Quote:


> says...

>>> Who are these clowns?  Neither could pocket a ball for over 5 minutes!

>>> http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jXKP2Pqtjxs
>> Thanks John, great match.

> I agree.  I really enjoyed it.

>> I never cease to enjoy watching the greatest
>> players on earth miss the most basic shots...  I particularly enjoyed
>> John missing the straight in 7 ball I think in rack 16.  I've done that
>> so many times it's routine for me.  Reyes missed a few, great stuff...
>> How many times have you played almost perfect position for a ball on the
>> side rail and watched helplessly as whitey slowly, painfully rolls right
>> up and in the black hole...  When Reyes does it, it adds legitimacy to
>> your own game:-)

> Yeah, its interesting to see the greats miss once in a while but I think you
> enjoy it too much.  :-)  I saw Reyes miss a straight in 9 for the match one
> time that a drunken girl scout would be expected to make.  After seeing that
> I realized that ANYBODY could miss ANY SHOT.

>> I know how to miss like the pros, now all I need is to make 'em like the
>> pros:-)

> Great quote.

> John Black

 
 
 

US Open 9-Ball Championship: Efren Reyes v Schmidt

Post by Jack Stei » Wed, 07 Apr 2010 23:19:16

Quote:

> I dan't know so much about 9ball, but this kind of thing happens all the
> time at 1pocket:  you end up putting your opponent in such a death trap
> that they are forced to gnaw off their own paw to get out of it and come
> with some off the wall shot.

Happens in 9 ball.  I was in an APA 9 ball match, I had to go to 56, he
had to go to 46, or something like that.  I'm ahead 50 to 45 and I got
him as safe as one can be.  OB is near the side pocket, surrounded by
other balls, the CB is locked up to one of the balls surrounding the OB,
and he can only shoot against the pocket rail, away from the pack.  If
he had ball in hand for this shot, someone would have to watch for a
good hit.   He shoots 4 rails, hits the ball as perfect as he would with
ball in hand, and lands perfect on the 3 ball....  I rarely do this, but
all I could manage was a "get the *** out".   He could have missed by 2
feet and it would have been a gallant try.

--
Jack
Got Change: Democratic Republic ======> Banana Republic!
http://SportToday.org/