Miss rule in "amateur!" snooker

Miss rule in "amateur!" snooker

Post by P.S.MCWILLIA » Wed, 21 Jun 1995 04:00:00


A lot of nonsense has been posted recently about the miss rule in amateur
snooker. It is WRONG to say that a miss can never be called on an amateur
player. Convention says that it is used more sparingly with amateurs, who
often haven't the expertise to escape from snookers, but on occasions it is
imperative to call a miss when no real effort has been made to hit the ball
ON or the nominated ball.
   All snooker players (should) folow the same rules; show me where it says
that the miss rule applies to professionals only!

Patrick

 
 
 

Miss rule in "amateur!" snooker

Post by David Gareth Morg » Wed, 21 Jun 1995 04:00:00

: A lot of nonsense has been posted recently about the miss rule in amateur
: snooker. It is WRONG to say that a miss can never be called on an amateur
: player. Convention says that it is used more sparingly with amateurs, who
: often haven't the expertise to escape from snookers, but on occasions it is
: imperative to call a miss when no real effort has been made to hit the ball
: ON or the nominated ball.
:    All snooker players (should) folow the same rules; show me where it says
: that the miss rule applies to professionals only!

The rule *could* apply to amateurs but would be difficult to enforce as
the only person qualified to make a decision regarding an intentional
miss would be a referee and these are seldom used in amateur matches
(especially club level ones).

The miss rule is brought into practice when a player does not "make the
effort" to hit the on-ball. This is hard enough to judge in the pro-game
(I've seen many players penalised when, to me, it looked like a perfectly
good attempt) and would be a nightmare to judge in the amateur game..to
see the extent of the dilemma (in the PRO game), I quote from Joe Davis'
book :

"For him there are certain guiding rules. The snooker rules give him the
power to order the ball "on" to be hit, at either players turn, in the
event of "wilful evasion" of the spirit of the rules. This undoubtedly
is intended to cover the intentional miss. There is also rule 16 of
General Rules which gives a referee no option but to declare a player
as having lost the game in the event of "wilfully or persistently
unfair conduct". But the question of the intentional miss is nevertheless
bound to remain, under the present rules, one in which the referee finds
the utmost difficultly and embarrassment. he is, in effect, asked to
decide whether a player played badly or deliberately cheated"

The rules do not state that the intentional miss should not be applied to
the amateur game, but it is accepted that the rule would be very difficult
to enforce at the amateur level, and impossible without a referee.

If it were enforced, then I would be accused of "miss"ing every other
shot :)))

Dave.
--

                                        **************************

                                        **************************

 
 
 

Miss rule in "amateur!" snooker

Post by Mike Cass » Thu, 22 Jun 1995 04:00:00

Sorry for my ignorance, I only play snooker occasionally.  What is the purpose
of an intentional miss.  If you are snookered, when does the strategical cost
of hitting the ball on exceed the cost of the foul.

Mike.

 
 
 

Miss rule in "amateur!" snooker

Post by Ken Pomero » Thu, 22 Jun 1995 04:00:00

Quote:

>Sorry for my ignorance, I only play snooker occasionally.  What is the purpose
>of an intentional miss.  If you are snookered, when does the strategical cost
>of hitting the ball on exceed the cost of the foul.

>Mike.>

There are a couple of instances where a deliberate foul can be better than an
un-intentional foul. We play 4 point fouls for fouls which don't involve the
5,6, or 7 ball, if the 5,6, or 7 is involved it's that many points. I can't
think of a good example of how it could win the game off the top of my head, but
if we were playing and my on ball was hidden behind the 7 and I didn't want to
risk fouling by hitting the 7, an intentional miss would only be a 4 point foul
instead of a possible 7. Of course if I fouled on the 5 or 6, it would be 5 or 6
points. Another example would be if you broke the balls and left me snookered
behind the 2,3, or 4 balls where I only had a multiple rail kick at the red
balls, an intentional miss would keep me from just turning loose of the cue ball
and possibly leaving you in the middle of a bunch of sitting ducks and possibly
even foul anyway.
   Ken

Fore! I think that one may be coming your way!!!

 
 
 

Miss rule in "amateur!" snooker

Post by Ken Pomero » Thu, 22 Jun 1995 04:00:00

Quote:


>: A lot of nonsense has been posted recently about the miss rule in amateur
>: snooker. It is WRONG to say that a miss can never be called on an amateur
>: player. Convention says that it is used more sparingly with amateurs, who
>: often haven't the expertise to escape from snookers, but on occasions it is
>: imperative to call a miss when no real effort has been made to hit the ball
>: ON or the nominated ball.
>:    All snooker players (should) folow the same rules; show me where it says
>: that the miss rule applies to professionals only!

>The rule *could* apply to amateurs but would be difficult to enforce as
>the only person qualified to make a decision regarding an intentional
>miss would be a referee and these are seldom used in amateur matches
>(especially club level ones).

>The miss rule is brought into practice when a player does not "make the
>effort" to hit the on-ball. This is hard enough to judge in the pro-game
>(I've seen many players penalised when, to me, it looked like a perfectly
>good attempt) and would be a nightmare to judge in the amateur game..to
>see the extent of the dilemma (in the PRO game), I quote from Joe Davis'
>book :

>"For him there are certain guiding rules. The snooker rules give him the
>power to order the ball "on" to be hit, at either players turn, in the
>event of "wilful evasion" of the spirit of the rules. This undoubtedly
>is intended to cover the intentional miss. There is also rule 16 of
>General Rules which gives a referee no option but to declare a player
>as having lost the game in the event of "wilfully or persistently
>unfair conduct". But the question of the intentional miss is nevertheless
>bound to remain, under the present rules, one in which the referee finds
>the utmost difficultly and embarrassment. he is, in effect, asked to
>decide whether a player played badly or deliberately cheated"

>The rules do not state that the intentional miss should not be applied to
>the amateur game, but it is accepted that the rule would be very difficult
>to enforce at the amateur level, and impossible without a referee.

>If it were enforced, then I would be accused of "miss"ing every other
>shot :)))

>Dave.
>--

>                                    **************************

>                                    **************************

This is one rule I don't think I agree with because of the difficulty of
determining when it has been violated. Around here the way they play is when
faced with a snooker that would be very dangerous to get out of, you are allowed
to just push out with a penalty of 4 points, then your opponent has the option
of shooting or making you shoot again. I can see the value of the miss rule in a
close match you are able to somehow hide the 6 behind the 7 when there are no
other balls left. Like I say the real problem with the rule is the enforcement.
    Ken

Fore! I think that one may be coming your way!!!

 
 
 

Miss rule in "amateur!" snooker

Post by Jari Kok » Mon, 26 Jun 1995 04:00:00



Quote:
>This is one rule I don't think I agree with because of the difficulty of
>determining when it has been violated. Around here the way they play is
>when faced with a snooker that would be very dangerous to get out of,
>you are allowed to just push out with a penalty of 4 points, then your
>opponent has the option of shooting or making you shoot again. I can see
>the value of the miss rule in a close match you are able to somehow hide
>the 6 behind the 7 when there are no other balls left. Like I say the
>real problem with the rule is the enforcement.

I agree that the miss rule is hard to enforce with no referee. Here
sportmanship comes into the picture.

I call all fouls I make on myself if they aren't noticed by the referee
or if there isn't one. I've never played a miss. I have no respect for a
player who plays a miss, referee or no referee.

Allowing a "push-out" like you describe, changes the game too much for
my liking.

I do agree that it is a tough rule, maybe there should be some
guidelines to be used in the amateur game too. Like for instance, if you
see a ball on "full", you must hit a ball on, or else it's a miss.

Jari