One pocket rule question??

One pocket rule question??

Post by T78M » Tue, 27 Jan 2004 08:22:14


The game is 1 pocket and player A (lets call him Tom because that's his real
name) owes 1 ball.  Tom makes a successful shot into his pocket.  On Tom's next
shot he thin cuts the 1 ball and rattles it in the jaws of his pocket.  He
reaches into the ball return to spot the ball that he owes.  Tom has the owed
ball in his hand is about to spot it when the 1 ball falls into his pocket.
What is the correct call?  My opinion is that Tom conceded the miss on the 1
ball when he started spotting the owed ball.  He relinquished his turn at the
table but should be credited the 1 ball.  But his inning is over.  Now what
would happen if Tom needed only 1 more ball to win the game?

Paul Mon~~~~no names were changed to protect the innocent

 
 
 

One pocket rule question??

Post by Kent,W » Tue, 27 Jan 2004 08:59:41


Quote:
> The game is 1 pocket and player A (lets call him Tom because that's his
real
> name) owes 1 ball.  Tom makes a successful shot into his pocket.  On Tom's
next
> shot he thin cuts the 1 ball and rattles it in the jaws of his pocket.  He
> reaches into the ball return to spot the ball that he owes.  Tom has the
owed
> ball in his hand is about to spot it when the 1 ball falls into his
pocket.
> What is the correct call?  My opinion is that Tom conceded the miss on the
1
> ball when he started spotting the owed ball.  He relinquished his turn at
the
> table but should be credited the 1 ball.  But his inning is over.  Now
what
> would happen if Tom needed only 1 more ball to win the game?

> Paul Mon~~~~no names were changed to protect the innocent

IMO - Based on one rule set that I have seen an explanation written.

If a ball which has been*** in a pocket for more
than a few seconds suddenly falls in, it is to be placed back on
the table where it was originally sitting. Once a ball has stopped
all motion, it cannot move again without outside forces affecting
it. So, if it falls in a pocket, it is to be placed back on the table
where it was before it fell.

--
JohnA(Kent,WA)

 
 
 

One pocket rule question??

Post by T78M » Tue, 27 Jan 2004 09:07:52

IMO - Based on one rule set that I have seen an explanation written.

If a ball which has been*** in a pocket for more
than a few seconds suddenly falls in, it is to be placed back on
the table where it was originally sitting. Once a ball has stopped
all motion, it cannot move again without outside forces affecting
it. So, if it falls in a pocket, it is to be placed back on the table
where it was before it fell.

--
JohnA(Kent,WA)

Ok, we place the ball back in the jaws and Tom is not at the table.  Is that
what you're saying?

 
 
 

One pocket rule question??

Post by Kent,W » Tue, 27 Jan 2004 09:59:30


Quote:
> IMO - Based on one rule set that I have seen an explanation written.

> If a ball which has been*** in a pocket for more
> than a few seconds suddenly falls in, it is to be placed back on
> the table where it was originally sitting. Once a ball has stopped
> all motion, it cannot move again without outside forces affecting
> it. So, if it falls in a pocket, it is to be placed back on the table
> where it was before it fell.

> --
> JohnA(Kent,WA)

> Ok, we place the ball back in the jaws and Tom is not at the table.  Is
that
> what you're saying?

Yes that is what I'm saying. If the ball is still on the table then he
didn't make the shot.

This answer is in response to the original question asked on a 1-pocket
shot. In other games where a ball was legally made and another ball falls
after a few seconds, then it would be brought back up to its original
position and the same player would still be at the table.

The reason I'm clarifying this is that this exact same thing happened in a
tournament that I was watching a few days ago.

This is the shot:

START(
%FD7O8%GC5[2%Hp9E9%IF9P8%PE0T6

)END

http://SportToday.org/~wei/pool/9egg/

The player comes to the table and shoots a stop shot on the 6 planning an
easy runout from there. After making the 6 he was getting down to shoot the
7 when it fell into the pocket.:-)

--
JohnA(Kent,WA)

 
 
 

One pocket rule question??

Post by Patrick Johnso » Tue, 27 Jan 2004 11:06:46

This is pretty straightforward.  If a ball falls in within 5 seconds
after the shot ends, it's a made ball -- if it doesn't it isn't.  Them's
the (BCA/WPA) rules.

Pat Johnson
Chicago

Quote:

> The game is 1 pocket and player A (lets call him Tom because that's his real
> name) owes 1 ball.  Tom makes a successful shot into his pocket.  On Tom's next
> shot he thin cuts the 1 ball and rattles it in the jaws of his pocket.  He
> reaches into the ball return to spot the ball that he owes.  Tom has the owed
> ball in his hand is about to spot it when the 1 ball falls into his pocket.
> What is the correct call?  My opinion is that Tom conceded the miss on the 1
> ball when he started spotting the owed ball.  He relinquished his turn at the
> table but should be credited the 1 ball.  But his inning is over.  Now what
> would happen if Tom needed only 1 more ball to win the game?

> Paul Mon~~~~no names were changed to protect the innocent

 
 
 

One pocket rule question??

Post by rhncu » Tue, 27 Jan 2004 13:26:04

   I believe the BCA rulebook states that if a ball falls before 5 seconds
have passed after all balls come to a rest then it counts. If it hangs
longer than 5 seconds then it is repotted.
   If the ball falls before 5 seconds it would still be the shooter's turn
at the table even if he had spotted a ball. You can't just give away your
shot. You only lose your turn at the table if you don't make a legal shot
into your pocket or if you foul.
                                 ***

--
Building and repair of fine custom cues at affordable
prices for real poolplayers. Over 35yrs. exp.
Richard H. Neighbors  318 Linden st. Cinti. OH
ph.# (513) 242-1700
web-site: http://SportToday.org/


Quote:



> > IMO - Based on one rule set that I have seen an explanation written.

> > If a ball which has been*** in a pocket for more
> > than a few seconds suddenly falls in, it is to be placed back on
> > the table where it was originally sitting. Once a ball has stopped
> > all motion, it cannot move again without outside forces affecting
> > it. So, if it falls in a pocket, it is to be placed back on the table
> > where it was before it fell.

> > --
> > JohnA(Kent,WA)

> > Ok, we place the ball back in the jaws and Tom is not at the table.  Is
> that
> > what you're saying?

> Yes that is what I'm saying. If the ball is still on the table then he
> didn't make the shot.

> This answer is in response to the original question asked on a 1-pocket
> shot. In other games where a ball was legally made and another ball falls
> after a few seconds, then it would be brought back up to its original
> position and the same player would still be at the table.

> The reason I'm clarifying this is that this exact same thing happened in a
> tournament that I was watching a few days ago.

> This is the shot:

> START(
> %FD7O8%GC5[2%Hp9E9%IF9P8%PE0T6

> )END

> http://SportToday.org/~wei/pool/9egg/

> The player comes to the table and shoots a stop shot on the 6 planning an
> easy runout from there. After making the 6 he was getting down to shoot
the
> 7 when it fell into the pocket.:-)

> --
> JohnA(Kent,WA)

 
 
 

One pocket rule question??

Post by Lowle » Wed, 28 Jan 2004 04:19:02

Looks like the 5-second rule applies. Replace the ball on the lip like it never
happened and continue the game.
 
 
 

One pocket rule question??

Post by Paul M » Wed, 28 Jan 2004 07:53:37

Quote:

> This is pretty straightforward.  If a ball falls in within 5 seconds
> after the shot ends, it's a made ball -- if it doesn't it isn't.  Them's
> the (BCA/WPA) rules.

> Pat Johnson
> Chicago

Pat,
     I can't argue with the ruling, it is indeed clearcut and simple.
But who starts a stopwatch every time a ball is rattled in the jaws?
Nobody.  So now the argument is over was it 5 seconds or not.
Additionally, in the case I described above Tom had made contact with
the table, he retrieved a ball from the gully.  I could have made the
claim that he bumped the table to cause the ball to fall.  Nothing is
simple about this instance.

Paul Mon

 
 
 

One pocket rule question??

Post by lfiguero » Wed, 28 Jan 2004 08:19:36

If one of the players is being a niit, almost any rule can be argued over.
Generally speaking, players just watch the ball until it comes to a complete
stop.  If it then momentarily tumbles into the pocket, then it's a keeper.
But if it's comes to a complete stop and you've waited a beat or two, and it
doesn't drop, then most reasonable players would attribute any future
dropping into the pocket to vibration and put it back up.

Lou Figueroa



Quote:
> > This is pretty straightforward.  If a ball falls in within 5 seconds
> > after the shot ends, it's a made ball -- if it doesn't it isn't.  Them's
> > the (BCA/WPA) rules.

> > Pat Johnson
> > Chicago

> Pat,
>      I can't argue with the ruling, it is indeed clearcut and simple.
> But who starts a stopwatch every time a ball is rattled in the jaws?
> Nobody.  So now the argument is over was it 5 seconds or not.
> Additionally, in the case I described above Tom had made contact with
> the table, he retrieved a ball from the gully.  I could have made the
> claim that he bumped the table to cause the ball to fall.  Nothing is
> simple about this instance.

> Paul Mon

 
 
 

One pocket rule question??

Post by Patrick Johnso » Wed, 28 Jan 2004 10:24:43

Quote:

> ... who starts a stopwatch every time a ball is rattled in the jaws?

I think the call should go to the shooter if there's any doubt.  But I
don't know if this is in the rules, like the rule for split hits.

Quote:
> ....  I could have made the
> claim that he bumped the table to cause the ball to fall.

You said he took a ball out of the "gully".  Is that the ball box or his
pocket?  If he reached into the pocket the ball fell into, I don't think
he should get it under any circumstances.  I think the rules say a ball
accidentally knocked into a pocket is replaced, and I think it should be
presumed that happened, although I don't know if that presumption is in
the rules.

Pat Johnson
Chicago

 
 
 

One pocket rule question??

Post by Ron Shepar » Wed, 28 Jan 2004 14:30:37



Quote:
>      I can't argue with the ruling, it is indeed clearcut and simple.
> But who starts a stopwatch every time a ball is rattled in the jaws?

When I referee a match, I start counting, sometimes holding up my
fingers so that the players can count with me and there will be no
disagreement about the time.  I sometimes do the same thing when I
play.

There is a little ambiguity about when you should start counting.  I
think the right answer is immediately after the last moving or
spinning ball has stopped.

$.02 -Ron Shepard

 
 
 

One pocket rule question??

Post by Joey » Thu, 29 Jan 2004 08:42:59

It is reported that a guy who plays one pocket here in New Orleans, who when
he hangs up a ball in the pocket close to the edge, will lunge forward with
his hands making out like he possesses telekenesis to move the object ball.
He claims to have the ability as I do but I know he is just a cheat and a
charlatan.  :-)
JoeyA


Quote:
>    I believe the BCA rulebook states that if a ball falls before 5 seconds
> have passed after all balls come to a rest then it counts. If it hangs
> longer than 5 seconds then it is repotted.
>    If the ball falls before 5 seconds it would still be the shooter's turn
> at the table even if he had spotted a ball. You can't just give away your
> shot. You only lose your turn at the table if you don't make a legal shot
> into your pocket or if you foul.
>                                  ***

> --
> Building and repair of fine custom cues at affordable
> prices for real poolplayers. Over 35yrs. exp.
> Richard H. Neighbors  318 Linden st. Cinti. OH
> ph.# (513) 242-1700
> web-site: http://SportToday.org/





> > > IMO - Based on one rule set that I have seen an explanation written.

> > > If a ball which has been*** in a pocket for more
> > > than a few seconds suddenly falls in, it is to be placed back on
> > > the table where it was originally sitting. Once a ball has stopped
> > > all motion, it cannot move again without outside forces affecting
> > > it. So, if it falls in a pocket, it is to be placed back on the table
> > > where it was before it fell.

> > > --
> > > JohnA(Kent,WA)

> > > Ok, we place the ball back in the jaws and Tom is not at the table.
Is
> > that
> > > what you're saying?

> > Yes that is what I'm saying. If the ball is still on the table then he
> > didn't make the shot.

> > This answer is in response to the original question asked on a 1-pocket
> > shot. In other games where a ball was legally made and another ball
falls
> > after a few seconds, then it would be brought back up to its original
> > position and the same player would still be at the table.

> > The reason I'm clarifying this is that this exact same thing happened in
a
> > tournament that I was watching a few days ago.

> > This is the shot:

> > START(
> > %FD7O8%GC5[2%Hp9E9%IF9P8%PE0T6

> > )END

> > http://SportToday.org/~wei/pool/9egg/

> > The player comes to the table and shoots a stop shot on the 6 planning
an
> > easy runout from there. After making the 6 he was getting down to shoot
> the
> > 7 when it fell into the pocket.:-)

> > --
> > JohnA(Kent,WA)

 
 
 

One pocket rule question??

Post by Bernie Cosel » Thu, 29 Jan 2004 22:23:08

Quote:

} It is reported that a guy who plays one pocket here in New Orleans, who when
} he hangs up a ball in the pocket close to the edge, will lunge forward with
} his hands making out like he possesses telekenesis to move the object ball.
} He claims to have the ability as I do but I know he is just a cheat and a
} charlatan.  :-)

Especially if he surreptitiously nudges the table with his leg while he's
distracting you with his histrionics..:O)

  /bernie\

--
Bernie Cosell                     Fantasy Farm Fibers

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