New seat designs

New seat designs

Post by Kris Ho » Thu, 05 Oct 2000 04:00:00


Hi,

Thanks Scott for the good comments regarding the Roach
Seatcover.  Regarding one comment:

Quote:
>    In its current offering, the Roach cover holds
> itself in place with an
> elastic strap in front of the seat post and a buckle
> strap aft of the seat
> post.....To improve attachment, replace the
> straps with a series
> of punched perimeter holes with brass eyelets to
> allow the seat to be laced
> under the seat plate with a leather thong.  

This was actually the original arrangement.  However,
I couldn't think of a way to do this without
interfering with the grip position used for all
seat-out-in-front moves, where you grip the side of
the seat and your fingers wrap into the area that
would be covered with lacing.

I was just at a big trade show in Las Vegas
(Interbike), and the owner of Velo (one of the biggest
bike saddle manufactures in the world) has agreed to
make a new prototype uni seat.  We just need to send
her a detailed sketch of what we want (ideas/sketches
welcom!). Do you think it might be possible to make a
seat that has a gap in the middle like some modern
bike seats?

Cheers,

Kris Holm.

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos - 35mm Quality Prints, Now Get 15 Free!
http://photos.yahoo.com/

 
 
 

New seat designs

Post by Chris Reed » Thu, 05 Oct 2000 04:00:00

Kris,

The rear cinch strap on the Roach cover seems very effective.    On my
air pillow seat I replaced the forward elastic with six eyelets, but I
left the rear cinch strap in place.  When I hop seat out in front, I
grab the right rear quadrant of the seat.  The shoelace is never in the
way because it only covers the front two quadrants of the seat.  Is this
where most people grab the seat?

Chris

Quote:
> This was actually the original arrangement.  However,
> I couldn't think of a way to do this without
> interfering with the grip position used for all
> seat-out-in-front moves, where you grip the side of
> the seat and your fingers wrap into the area that
> would be covered with lacing.

> Cheers,

> Kris Holm.

> __________________________________________________


 
 
 

New seat designs

Post by Mark Stephe » Thu, 05 Oct 2000 04:00:00


Quote:

>I was just at a big trade show in Las Vegas
>(Interbike), and the owner of Velo (one of the biggest
>bike saddle manufactures in the world) has agreed to
>make a new prototype uni seat.  We just need to send
>her a detailed sketch of what we want (ideas/sketches
>welcom!). Do you think it might be possible to make a
>seat that has a gap in the middle like some modern
>bike seats?

Although I don't do MUni (right now) I'm very interested in seat design.  I can imagine that a *perfect* MUni seat might not be a *perfect* Coker seat or a *perfect* freestyle seat.  So do we need ideas for more than one design for different styles of riding or an "all around good seat" or just ideas for a good MUni seat?  Also maybe more than one different size for different size people?
-Mark  

_____________________________________________________________
Free e-Mail and Webspace - http://Unicyclist.com

 
 
 

New seat designs

Post by Chris Reed » Thu, 05 Oct 2000 04:00:00

I think you hit the nail on the head.  I'm very happy with the Roach/air
pillow/Carbon Fiber/Miyata combination, but it takes some work to put it
together, and street riders don't need the suspension effect that it
offers.  Maybe a real seat company could make a similar product that's
one piece.  

Chris  

Quote:
> Although I don't do MUni (right now) I'm very interested in seat design.  I can imagine that a *perfect* MUni seat might not be a *perfect* Coker seat or a *perfect* freestyle seat.  So do we need ideas for more than one design for different styles of riding or an "all around good seat" or just ideas for a good MUni seat?  Also maybe more than one different size for different size people?
> -Mark

> _____________________________________________________________
> Free e-Mail and Webspace - http://Unicyclist.com

 
 
 

New seat designs

Post by John Fo » Thu, 05 Oct 2000 04:00:00

Quote:
> The rear cinch strap on the Roach cover seems very effective.    On my
> air pillow seat I replaced the forward elastic with six eyelets, but I
> left the rear cinch strap in place.  When I hop seat out in front, I
> grab the right rear quadrant of the seat.  The shoelace is
> never in the way because it only covers the front two quadrants of the
> seat.  Is this where most people grab the seat?

My main handhold for seat in front is to hold alongside the seat post, or
rearward from there. For seat in back, I"d be holding the front bumper so
laces wouldn't matter.

jf

 
 
 

New seat designs

Post by Neil dunlo » Fri, 06 Oct 2000 08:53:51

Mark - you're bang on me thinks!

What say we aim for the sky to start with... and we might end up with a
great seat that doesn't require tubes, gel pads, sewing machines and the
like to get a vaguely comfortable ***pedestal. What are the categories
we're looking at - MUni, street, freestyle and long distance?

I think we need to identify what each kind of seat should have for each
purpose. I'm not the one to come up with the ideal design for a seat but to
try and get a ball rolling here's some blatantly vaugue ideas:

MUni and street both need strength.
MUni, street and freestyle all want a good handle - since long distance is
mainly the field of Cokers a handle probably ain't required?
Bumpers front and back for all. Tougher for MUni and street?
All should be comfortable. Hey - I can state the obvious as well as anybody
;-)
Thigh friendly covers for long distance riding and tougher one for the rest.

Some kind of component based design where everything is interchangable could
be good. You could have seat bases with varying strengths / weights. To this
you pick your padding, a choice of coloured covering and then your bumpers -
with or without a handle.

Neil


Quote:



> >I was just at a big trade show in Las Vegas
> >(Interbike), and the owner of Velo (one of the biggest
> >bike saddle manufactures in the world) has agreed to
> >make a new prototype uni seat.  We just need to send
> >her a detailed sketch of what we want (ideas/sketches
> >welcom!). Do you think it might be possible to make a
> >seat that has a gap in the middle like some modern
> >bike seats?

> Although I don't do MUni (right now) I'm very interested in seat design.

I can imagine that a *perfect* MUni seat might not be a *perfect* Coker seat
or a *perfect* freestyle seat.  So do we need ideas for more than one design
for different styles of riding or an "all around good seat" or just ideas
for a good MUni seat?  Also maybe more than one different size for different
size people?
Quote:
> -Mark

> _____________________________________________________________
> Free e-Mail and Webspace - http://SportToday.org/

 
 
 

New seat designs

Post by Roger Davi » Fri, 06 Oct 2000 04:00:00

Quote:

> MUni and street both need strength.
> MUni, street and freestyle all want a good handle - since long distance is
> mainly the field of Cokers a handle probably ain't required?
> Bumpers front and back for all. Tougher for MUni and street?
> All should be comfortable. Hey - I can state the obvious as well as
anybody
> ;-)
> Thigh friendly covers for long distance riding and tougher one for the

rest.

I would not totally agree that handles on the front are not needed on long
listance unicycles.  They perform 2 functions:
Falling at 20mph causes considerable damage on front of seats the
handle/bumper on the Miyata saves the seat.
The second reason is to hold on to! When riding long distance you need to
transfer the weight from your back side to your upper body using your arm.
For this you need a good holding area.  Have a look at the photos of the
Minnasota ride and you will see all the riders using this technique.  There
is an additional related reason... climbing hills with 110 cranks on a coker
makes a handle to pull on essential!

Quote:
> Some kind of component based design where everything is interchangable
could
> be good. You could have seat bases with varying strengths / weights. To
this
> you pick your padding, a choice of coloured covering and then your
bumpers -
> with or without a handle.

I have changed my cover designs to include a draw string pocket along the
bottom edge.  This is similar to what Kris is talking about with shoe lace,
although I use knicker elastic.  It is easy to fit, you simply remove the
bumpers and slip it over.  Then replace the bumpers.  It fits very tightly
to the inside of the seat and does not come off unless you actually want it
to come off.  It would also allow deferent levels of padding inside the seat
and for fast colour change at event..... encase your seat cover clashed with
some else's! (well you never know!).
The draw sting design is also very simple to manufacture because you would
turn the bottom over anyway.
 
 
 

New seat designs

Post by Kris Ho » Fri, 06 Oct 2000 04:00:00

Hi all,

Ideally several seat designs might be desirable, but
since we currently cannot buy even ONE type of good
seat (without significant modifications), perhaps we
should just work on one good one to start with.

-Kris.


Quote:
> Mark - you're bang on me thinks!

> What say we aim for the sky to start with... and we
> might end up with a
> great seat that doesn't require tubes, gel pads,
> sewing machines and the
> like to get a vaguely comfortable ***pedestal.
> What are the categories
> we're looking at - MUni, street, freestyle and long
> distance?

> I think we need to identify what each kind of seat
> should have for each
> purpose. I'm not the one to come up with the ideal
> design for a seat but to
> try and get a ball rolling here's some blatantly
> vaugue ideas:

> MUni and street both need strength.
> MUni, street and freestyle all want a good handle -
> since long distance is
> mainly the field of Cokers a handle probably ain't
> required?
> Bumpers front and back for all. Tougher for MUni and
> street?
> All should be comfortable. Hey - I can state the
> obvious as well as anybody
> ;-)
> Thigh friendly covers for long distance riding and
> tougher one for the rest.

> Some kind of component based design where everything
> is interchangable could
> be good. You could have seat bases with varying
> strengths / weights. To this
> you pick your padding, a choice of coloured covering
> and then your bumpers -
> with or without a handle.

> Neil


> message


- Show quoted text -

Quote:



> > >I was just at a big trade show in Las Vegas
> > >(Interbike), and the owner of Velo (one of the
> biggest
> > >bike saddle manufactures in the world) has agreed
> to
> > >make a new prototype uni seat.  We just need to
> send
> > >her a detailed sketch of what we want
> (ideas/sketches
> > >welcom!). Do you think it might be possible to
> make a
> > >seat that has a gap in the middle like some
> modern
> > >bike seats?

> > Although I don't do MUni (right now) I'm very
> interested in seat design.
> I can imagine that a *perfect* MUni seat might not
> be a *perfect* Coker seat
> or a *perfect* freestyle seat.  So do we need ideas
> for more than one design
> for different styles of riding or an "all around
> good seat" or just ideas
> for a good MUni seat?  Also maybe more than one
> different size for different
> size people?
> > -Mark

_____________________________________________________________

Quote:
> > Free e-Mail and Webspace - http://SportToday.org/

__________________________________________________
Do You Yahoo!?
Yahoo! Photos - 35mm Quality Prints, Now Get 15 Free!
http://SportToday.org/
 
 
 

New seat designs

Post by Mark Stephe » Fri, 06 Oct 2000 04:00:00


Quote:

>Hi all,

>Ideally several seat designs might be desirable, but
>since we currently cannot buy even ONE type of good
>seat (without significant modifications), perhaps we
>should just work on one good one to start with.

>-Kris.

Understandable.  Sorry if I got carried away.  Just the thought of a "new" seat is pretty exciting!

_____________________________________________________________
Free e-Mail and Webspace - http://Unicyclist.com

 
 
 

New seat designs

Post by John Hoote » Fri, 06 Oct 2000 04:00:00

A new seat should mount on rails instead of the current method.

Freestyle riders would rather not have a Miyata type handle on the seat,
but flat bumpers as on older Miyata seats. These are easily
interchangable if they are available.

John Hooten

Quote:

> Hi all,

> Ideally several seat designs might be desirable, but
> since we currently cannot buy even ONE type of good
> seat (without significant modifications), perhaps we
> should just work on one good one to start with.

> -Kris.


> > Mark - you're bang on me thinks!

> > What say we aim for the sky to start with... and we
> > might end up with a
> > great seat that doesn't require tubes, gel pads,
> > sewing machines and the
> > like to get a vaguely comfortable ***pedestal.
> > What are the categories
> > we're looking at - MUni, street, freestyle and long
> > distance?

> > I think we need to identify what each kind of seat
> > should have for each
> > purpose. I'm not the one to come up with the ideal
> > design for a seat but to
> > try and get a ball rolling here's some blatantly
> > vaugue ideas:

> > MUni and street both need strength.
> > MUni, street and freestyle all want a good handle -
> > since long distance is
> > mainly the field of Cokers a handle probably ain't
> > required?
> > Bumpers front and back for all. Tougher for MUni and
> > street?
> > All should be comfortable. Hey - I can state the
> > obvious as well as anybody
> > ;-)
> > Thigh friendly covers for long distance riding and
> > tougher one for the rest.

> > Some kind of component based design where everything
> > is interchangable could
> > be good. You could have seat bases with varying
> > strengths / weights. To this
> > you pick your padding, a choice of coloured covering
> > and then your bumpers -
> > with or without a handle.

> > Neil


> > message




> > > >I was just at a big trade show in Las Vegas
> > > >(Interbike), and the owner of Velo (one of the
> > biggest
> > > >bike saddle manufactures in the world) has agreed
> > to
> > > >make a new prototype uni seat.  We just need to
> > send
> > > >her a detailed sketch of what we want
> > (ideas/sketches
> > > >welcom!). Do you think it might be possible to
> > make a
> > > >seat that has a gap in the middle like some
> > modern
> > > >bike seats?

> > > Although I don't do MUni (right now) I'm very
> > interested in seat design.
> > I can imagine that a *perfect* MUni seat might not
> > be a *perfect* Coker seat
> > or a *perfect* freestyle seat.  So do we need ideas
> > for more than one design
> > for different styles of riding or an "all around
> > good seat" or just ideas
> > for a good MUni seat?  Also maybe more than one
> > different size for different
> > size people?
> > > -Mark

> _____________________________________________________________
> > > Free e-Mail and Webspace - http://SportToday.org/

> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Photos - 35mm Quality Prints, Now Get 15 Free!
> http://SportToday.org/

 
 
 

New seat designs

Post by Neil Dunlo » Fri, 06 Oct 2000 04:00:00

Watch out here comes another opinion... or it might turn out into a
question... lets see...

I think the idea of a component based design with interchangable parts is a
good one for 1 or 2 or 3 or more reasons i.e. I'll make them up as I go
along:

People all want something slightly different in their *ideal* seat e.g. I
certainly want a handle on my bumper, Mark Hooten doesn't. This is hardly a
comprehensive poll but this is a new thread.
A manufacturer (at my guess) may well like the idea of being able to use
some of the same components to comprise a different product which appeals to
a different buyer. Kris - you've confabed with manufacturers I believe - you
probably can corrrect me on this.
In my original post I said we should aim for the stars / sky / whatever.
Invariable in any kind of negotiations you end up compromising and coming
out with less than you origianlly would've liked. So we may very well end up
with a single design of seat but we'd have more bargaining power on getting
it how we want. Erm... no - I'm not a power crazed looney. Anyone who says
so will be crushed and their remains ffed to my dogs ;-)

Hmmm... I'll stop there (he lied).

So how do we, as a group, deside on exactly what we want? What about some
kind of voting / questionaire on a web site where anyone can play their
part? When the result are in - the specifics of design can begin. Me thinks
I'm maybe getting ahead of myself. I'd be happy to leave it to the likes of
Kris to come up with the design as I imagine it's what I'd want anyway.
But... the more interest, the more hastle but the better the end result.

It's late,
Neil


Quote:
> Hi all,

> Ideally several seat designs might be desirable, but
> since we currently cannot buy even ONE type of good
> seat (without significant modifications), perhaps we
> should just work on one good one to start with.

> -Kris.


> > Mark - you're bang on me thinks!

> > What say we aim for the sky to start with... and we
> > might end up with a
> > great seat that doesn't require tubes, gel pads,
> > sewing machines and the
> > like to get a vaguely comfortable ***pedestal.
> > What are the categories
> > we're looking at - MUni, street, freestyle and long
> > distance?

> > I think we need to identify what each kind of seat
> > should have for each
> > purpose. I'm not the one to come up with the ideal
> > design for a seat but to
> > try and get a ball rolling here's some blatantly
> > vaugue ideas:

> > MUni and street both need strength.
> > MUni, street and freestyle all want a good handle -
> > since long distance is
> > mainly the field of Cokers a handle probably ain't
> > required?
> > Bumpers front and back for all. Tougher for MUni and
> > street?
> > All should be comfortable. Hey - I can state the
> > obvious as well as anybody
> > ;-)
> > Thigh friendly covers for long distance riding and
> > tougher one for the rest.

> > Some kind of component based design where everything
> > is interchangable could
> > be good. You could have seat bases with varying
> > strengths / weights. To this
> > you pick your padding, a choice of coloured covering
> > and then your bumpers -
> > with or without a handle.

> > Neil


> > message




> > > >I was just at a big trade show in Las Vegas
> > > >(Interbike), and the owner of Velo (one of the
> > biggest
> > > >bike saddle manufactures in the world) has agreed
> > to
> > > >make a new prototype uni seat.  We just need to
> > send
> > > >her a detailed sketch of what we want
> > (ideas/sketches
> > > >welcom!). Do you think it might be possible to
> > make a
> > > >seat that has a gap in the middle like some
> > modern
> > > >bike seats?

> > > Although I don't do MUni (right now) I'm very
> > interested in seat design.
> > I can imagine that a *perfect* MUni seat might not
> > be a *perfect* Coker seat
> > or a *perfect* freestyle seat.  So do we need ideas
> > for more than one design
> > for different styles of riding or an "all around
> > good seat" or just ideas
> > for a good MUni seat?  Also maybe more than one
> > different size for different
> > size people?
> > > -Mark

> _____________________________________________________________
> > > Free e-Mail and Webspace - http://SportToday.org/

> __________________________________________________
> Do You Yahoo!?
> Yahoo! Photos - 35mm Quality Prints, Now Get 15 Free!
> http://SportToday.org/

 
 
 

New seat designs

Post by Arthur Doerkse » Fri, 06 Oct 2000 04:00:00


Quote:
> A new seat should mount on rails instead of the current method.

John, you've hit the nail on the head.  Seat rails make excellent sense to
standardize with the
bike folks.

Blessings!

Arthur Doerksen

 
 
 

New seat designs

Post by Nicholas Pri » Fri, 06 Oct 2000 04:00:00

I think that seat rails are an important addition to any new design. They
needn't be over complicated - most high end MTB seats have a single allen
key bolt that adjusts the seat angle and front-back positioning. The
adjustable angle could be an advantage for unicycling, because it would
allow a rider to change exactly where the body pressure is supported. Also,
if the rails extend to the front and back of the seat, as in bike seats,
they will offer some suspension effect, since the seat will flex a little
bit. This could turn out to be a disadvantage.

Also, the bolts underneat the Viscount seat are a real pain (literally).
The first time I miscaught my seat, and some friends' seats, I cut my hands
on the bolts. This should never have been an issue, but because they are
close to the seat post, and stick down a lot, they become quite dangerous.

Finally, seat rails will make it a lot easier to get a seat post that
matches a rider's height. Offhand, I seem to recall that MTB posts with the
integrated seatrail clamp at the top are designed to be set at an angle.
This could be a bit of a problem, but since the seat angle is adjustable, it
should be OK.

Of course, this new seat isn't going to be cheap! I recently bought a new,
cheap MTB seat post. It cost about $40, which is only slightly less than an
entire Viscount seat and post.

nic

 
 
 

New seat designs

Post by Carl Hoy » Fri, 06 Oct 2000 04:00:00

Quote:

> Also, the bolts underneat the Viscount seat are a real pain (literally).
> The first time I miscaught my seat, and some friends' seats, I cut my hands
> on the bolts. This should never have been an issue, but because they are
> close to the seat post, and stick down a lot, they become quite dangerous.

At least you still have your bumpers and the bolts that hold them in
place :) Albeit, I've been pretty rough on my viscount, the front bumper
fell off on my first MUni ride and it wasn't that hard a fall. I'm
currently riding without a front and rear bumper on the viscount (as
they've both fallen off countless times) and find it to be much easier
on the hands. (I know it's really tough on the cover, I haven't had the
time to make a trip to the hardware store, again, to pick up some screws
that will fit. It's definitely not the ideal situation!)

I have my first Miyata seat on the way with a roach cover and the Kris
Holm-designed rail-type seat post bracket, so I'll probably have more to
say about seat design once I've got that all setup and in use.

One thing about my current seats (the viscount and a no-name, but not
too bad seat) is that grabbing them on the side is very uncomfortable
and my fingers are usually very sore afterwards. I hope the Miyata seat
is a little bit more comfortable on my hands.

Carl